FR-S/86/BRZ as my next car?

[Sjej]

Hi, I currently have a Ford Edge. I plan to sell it after high school and get a FRS. I've been saving money, and driving relatively safe in order to drop my insurance rates. Is it a good idea to get a FRS after high school or will I regret it?


I have a lot of my future planned and a lot of money saved, so there's no real worries financially. But I do want a car that is reliable, even if beat on from time to time. It's not gonna be a track car, at most maybe autocross a few times in the year. Everybody says it's a generally reliable car, and I know how to work on cars so there's no issues there.



And finally, I don't care much at all for street/drag racing. I love the handling that the car has for so cheap. That's all I want, and the looks/customization of it, and I think it'd be a great car to learn manual in. That being said, is it a good choice? A lot of my friends say to get a used WRX or old mustang, but I'm not a fan of the EJ (especially the sound) and it's AWD, or muscle cars in general either. I just don't want to buy a car then get myself stuck with a moneypit like an older BMW, or end up with a boring car with terrible MPG.



If anything, I'd just like to hear everyone else's experience with their FRS/BRZ/86, in terms of reliability, mpg, how the manual feels to drive, the handling , modding , how easy to work on and anything else relevant. Sorry for such long post but I didn't want to leave anything out!!

PS I live in iowa so there are E85 pumps everywhere if an e85 tune is possible

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Sjej

Hi, I currently have a Ford Edge. I plan to sell it after high school and get a FRS. I've been saving money, and driving relatively safe in order to drop my insurance rates. Is it a good idea to get a FRS after high school or will I regret it?


I have a lot of my future planned and a lot of money saved, so there's no real worries financially. But I do want a car that is reliable, even if beat on from time to time. It's not gonna be a track car, at most maybe autocross a few times in the year. Everybody says it's a generally reliable car, and I know how to work on cars so there's no issues there.



And finally, I don't care much at all for street/drag racing. I love the handling that the car has for so cheap. That's all I want, and the looks/customization of it, and I think it'd be a great car to learn manual in. That being said, is it a good choice? A lot of my friends say to get a used WRX or old mustang, but I'm not a fan of the EJ (especially the sound) and it's AWD, or muscle cars in general either. I just don't want to buy a car then get myself stuck with a moneypit like an older BMW, or end up with a boring car with terrible MPG.



If anything, I'd just like to hear everyone else's experience with their FRS/BRZ/86, in terms of reliability, mpg, how the manual feels to drive, the handling , modding , how easy to work on and anything else relevant. Sorry for such long post but I didn't want to leave anything out!!

PS I live in iowa so there are E85 pumps everywhere if an e85 tune is possible

Welcome to ..... ye ol forum, there, Sjej -

Yep, I have found that the FRS is a dependable, fun to drive, relatively economical car. I've driven my 2013 for 30,000 miles over the past 9 years and never had it into a shop for anything except regular oil changes.

Yep, changing the oil is easy (because the filter is on top - ) however, the drain plug is on the bottom and my almost 80 year body doesn't like to crawl around on concrete floors -

For Iowa winter driving, just get some good winter tires and take it easy.

Modifications - it don't need none - it's good to go right out of the box.

[Sjej]

Originally Posted by humfrz

Welcome to ..... ye ol forum, there, Sjej -

Yep, changing the oil is easy (because the filter is on top - ) however, the drain plug is on the bottom and my almost 80 year body doesn't like to crawl around on concrete floors -

For Iowa winter driving, just get some good winter tires and take it easy.

Modifications - it don't need none - it's good to go right out of the box.

I do love modding cars, but I've heard of the so-called prius tires. What about two sets of tires (expensive, but this car isnt doing burnouts) a set for summer and a set for winter?


What about the torque dip too? I'm going to be buying used, theyre pretty expensive brand new.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Sjej

I do love modding cars, but I've heard of the so-called prius tires. What about two sets of tires (expensive, but this car isnt doing burnouts) a set for summer and a set for winter?


What about the torque dip too? I'm going to be buying used, theyre pretty expensive brand new.

As far as tires, if I lived in Iowa, I would recommend two sets of tires, one set for winter and a different set for summer. Here in the PNW, I run all season tires the year around.

If you hadn't had already read about it, you wouldn't even be aware of any "torque dip", just from driving the car. Even if you look for and find it, it only last about a second. -

If you buy used, I'd suggest you avoid highly modified ones.

[soundman98]

if you're worried about mpg, honestly a high-revving sports car is likely the worst possible option.

i get around 25 cruising on the highway, around 10-15 in the city. but i don't shift till the rev limiter beeps!

be sure to check insurance rates. sports cars are typically higher for younger drivers. but these are reliable cars, so ongoing expenses aren't that significant, barring general maintenance.

also be wary of maintenance. my rule of thumb, if the seller doesn't have receipts for past work up to the current mileage, assume the maintenance was never performed.


the 'prius tires' is going to be a debatable point in this instance. if you're looking specifically for an fr-s, that means '13-15, which the likelihood of a vehicle of that age still being on the oem tires is slim. the oem tires do nicely reflect and complement the car, giving a ton of feedback as to what the car is doing and giving plenty of warning before the limit is reached. but last i checked, they're over $400/tire! there's plenty of similar tires for a fraction of the cost.

winter tires are a really nice option. if you get a vehicle with the oem 'prius tires', you will definitely need to do something for winter, those oem tires are summer only, and turn into slick sections of smooth plastic in freezing temps.

when i first got my brz, i got winter tires while i wore down the oem tires. winter tires are great. it makes the car a riot in the snow. controllable everywhere. always left me conflicted, as it was really fun, but snow in chicagoland means salt trucks, and salt means rust...

but after the oem tires wore out, i switched to all season tires. bf good wrench comp 2 a/s. they're slightly stickier than the oem tires, a little less noisy, but less than $200/tire! realistically, they're 7/10's of the snow tires, and about 11/10's of the oem tires in the summer. there's arguments to be made in either way on multiple tires, or 1 really good tire. i choose to stick with the all seasons and not change tires all the time. the snow tires took up residence in my garage.

torque dip is only a problem if you're afraid to drive the car!

if you're pushing, you're above the dip. if you're cruising, you're below the dip. it's really that simple. this is a motor that loves to sing at top rpm. but many people are terrified of letting it sing!

[Sjej]

Originally Posted by humfrz

As far as tires, if I lived in Iowa, I would recommend two sets of tires, one set for winter and a different set for summer. Here in the PNW, I run all season tires the year around.

If you hadn't had already read about it, you wouldn't even be aware of any "torque dip", just from driving the car. Even if you look for and find it, it only last about a second. -

If you buy used, I'd suggest you avoid highly modified ones.

Yeah, I want completely stock. Most I'd allow is wheels or exhaust, but I don't want anything else done to the car.

[Sjej]

Originally Posted by soundman98

if you're worried about mpg, honestly a high-revving sports car is likely the worst possible option.

i get around 25 cruising on the highway, around 10-15 in the city. but i don't shift till the rev limiter beeps!

be sure to check insurance rates. sports cars are typically higher for younger drivers. but these are reliable cars, so ongoing expenses aren't that significant, barring general maintenance.

also be wary of maintenance. my rule of thumb, if the seller doesn't have receipts for past work up to the current mileage, assume the maintenance was never performed.


the 'prius tires' is going to be a debatable point in this instance. if you're looking specifically for an fr-s, that means '13-15, which the likelihood of a vehicle of that age still being on the oem tires is slim. the oem tires do nicely reflect and complement the car, giving a ton of feedback as to what the car is doing and giving plenty of warning before the limit is reached. but last i checked, they're over $400/tire! there's plenty of similar tires for a fraction of the cost.

winter tires are a really nice option. if you get a vehicle with the oem 'prius tires', you will definitely need to do something for winter, those oem tires are summer only, and turn into slick sections of smooth plastic in freezing temps.

when i first got my brz, i got winter tires while i wore down the oem tires. winter tires are great. it makes the car a riot in the snow. controllable everywhere. always left me conflicted, as it was really fun, but snow in chicagoland means salt trucks, and salt means rust...

but after the oem tires wore out, i switched to all season tires. bf good wrench comp 2 a/s. they're slightly stickier than the oem tires, a little less noisy, but less than $200/tire! realistically, they're 7/10's of the snow tires, and about 11/10's of the oem tires in the summer. there's arguments to be made in either way on multiple tires, or 1 really good tire. i choose to stick with the all seasons and not change tires all the time. the snow tires took up residence in my garage.

torque dip is only a problem if you're afraid to drive the car!

if you're pushing, you're above the dip. if you're cruising, you're below the dip. it's really that simple. this is a motor that loves to sing at top rpm. but many people are terrified of letting it sing!

this is all very useful. first off, my edge gets 16 mpg. even 17 mpg is an improvement. its almost all city driving and it does have to idle longer in winter, so in summer i do 17-18 mpg. purely highway i get 23. so really anything around that is ideal, but i can sacrifice a bit of mpg for a fun car.


all of that is very nice to know, thank you so much. one question though, why are they so cheap? i can find a cheap brz for 15k with low miles and in pretty good condition.. but why? is there a problem with the engine? transmission? or does nobody just want it

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by Sjej

this is all very useful. first off, my edge gets 16 mpg. even 17 mpg is an improvement. its almost all city driving and it does have to idle longer in winter, so in summer i do 17-18 mpg. purely highway i get 23. so really anything around that is ideal, but i can sacrifice a bit of mpg for a fun car.


all of that is very nice to know, thank you so much. one question though, why are they so cheap? i can find a cheap brz for 15k with low miles and in pretty good condition.. but why? is there a problem with the engine? transmission? or does nobody just want it

$15k sounds about ballpark. remember, these cars were between $20-32k brand new, 8 years ago. they were 'cheap' cars to begin with.

sports cars always exist in that weird middling area. they're not entirely practical, this one isn't fast, or loud, or mild mannered--the suspension is not lexus-soft.

so a lot of people won't consider them out of practicality. it's why i've got a 4dr tacoma as well as the car. the car for me is for fun, the tacoma is for working, because bags of mulch, stone, tools, and ladders don't fit great into the 86(i can and have made it work, with the interior scratches to prove it). even grocery shopping with the 86 sometimes involves compromises. there's not a ton of trunk space, and the back seat is a better place to toss jackets than people, unless they're missing limbs.

before The-End-of-the-World-as-We-Know-It began, '13's were starting to track around $7-9k for 100k-and-up mileage examples with criminally-low 4-digit mileage examples being around $13-15k.

they're saying the market is shifting back down to those levels, but it will be slow. it became a game of hot potato, and the car lots that bought at the higher price are going to be left with the bag.

[CedN]

If you live in a snowy part of the world get two set of wheels if you can, real snow tyres are great, and you can have sporty tyres in the summer.

Regarding fuel consumption its pretty good if you drive it carefully, I've seen 40mpg at best on country roads in the summer,. Pretty good when you hammer it aswell compared to turbo cars at least . Not sure what you will do with the car, but be careful with putting massive wheels on them like many people do. It makes acceleration slower, and makes it less fun in the bends imho, for road driving.

[bcj]

About 95k on mine. No broken mechanical stuff, even switches and levers.
Still avg mpg of 33. I don't foot it heavily.
That's including trips up, down and through the Cascades and Rockies.

I grew up appreciating the classic sport cars rather than oval trackers and drag missiles.
Waited 20 years before the twins arrived finally. Still an overweight pig barge, comparatively,
but they've got just enough power to overcome that disability.
The contemporary brakes and suspension work very well to make up for most of it.

Still a happy first adopter.

[NLSP]

I say go for it, very few newer cars feel like this one at this price point.

I'm coming up on 8 years of ownership with my 2014. Have a little over 100,000 miles on the odometer and it still puts a smile on my face.

I average 26 mpg mixed driving. Side note - it drinks premium fuel only.

I'd say reliability has been pretty good considering how much hard driving it sees. Other than regular maintenance, I've replaced the rear wheel bearings back in 2020, a cracked radiator earlier this year, and recently the throwout bearing along with new clutch.

Off the top of my head, the 2 common issues are:

1) Valve spring recall on the 2013 models (production range Dec 9, 2011 - July 2, 2013). I would avoid these models since dealer mechanics have been known to do shoddy work to try and fix it.

2) Throwout bearing (TOB) wearing out prematurely on 2013-2016 models, requiring the trans to be dropped and replace with revised 2017+ part. I've read some members having theirs wear out around 50k-60k miles, but mine lasted 100k miles, so it can vary.

The manual shifter feels great in my opinion. Some reviews/journalists also tend to agree. Compared to other sporty cars I've driven, the shifter definitely feels better than a BMW M2 and Challenger Hellcat. Only shifters I've tried that were better are a Porsche 911 and a Civic Type-R.

The handling is also very good, especially if you're coming from Ford Edge Steering is precise and decent feel for an electric rack. Very little body roll compared to most cars.

For the most part, the car is pretty easy to work on/modify. But reaching the spark plugs is a big of a tight squeeze though; some people raise the engine a bit to make it easier.

If you have the budget and space, I'd highly recommend having separate summer and winter tires, especially if you're doing any sporty driving/autocross. All-seasons will feel squishier, less precise, less grippy and overheat easier compared to a real summer tire.

[Sjej]

Originally Posted by soundman98

$15k sounds about ballpark. remember, these cars were between $20-32k brand new, 8 years ago. they were 'cheap' cars to begin with.

sports cars always exist in that weird middling area. they're not entirely practical, this one isn't fast, or loud, or mild mannered--the suspension is not lexus-soft.

so a lot of people won't consider them out of practicality. it's why i've got a 4dr tacoma as well as the car. the car for me is for fun, the tacoma is for working, because bags of mulch, stone, tools, and ladders don't fit great into the 86(i can and have made it work, with the interior scratches to prove it). even grocery shopping with the 86 sometimes involves compromises. there's not a ton of trunk space, and the back seat is a better place to toss jackets than people, unless they're missing limbs.

before The-End-of-the-World-as-We-Know-It began, '13's were starting to track around $7-9k for 100k-and-up mileage examples with criminally-low 4-digit mileage examples being around $13-15k.

they're saying the market is shifting back down to those levels, but it will be slow. it became a game of hot potato, and the car lots that bought at the higher price are going to be left with the bag.

so give it two years, how do you think it'll look? because that's around the time i plan to start looking. i dont want awfully high mileage (70k max) and yeah i'll pay a bit more if i have to, i dont really need anything crazy. just for groceries. maybe moving a bit of tools, but if i ever need anything my dad would always lend his old ford escape for me to use. but that's very helpful, makes me confident about buying lol because you dont see sports cars for this cheap.



but i think it's perfect, my ford edge rides rough because of "sport-tuned suspension" yet it doesnt exactly handle like a sports car. it gets low mpg, but its pretty damn fun to drive and thats all i care about. thats just to show you how little i care about the comfort.

[Sjej]

Originally Posted by CedN

If you live in a snowy part of the world get two set of wheels if you can, real snow tyres are great, and you can have sporty tyres in the summer.

Regarding fuel consumption its pretty good if you drive it carefully, I've seen 40mpg at best on country roads in the summer,. Pretty good when you hammer it aswell compared to turbo cars at least . Not sure what you will do with the car, but be careful with putting massive wheels on them like many people do. It makes acceleration slower, and makes it less fun in the bends imho, for road driving.

whats the highest you'd go? I have 22" on my edge right now, although it's an SUV and just for looks. dont think i'd put even 20" on a brz lol


but if i can afford, i definitely will get two sets of tires. i dont think steelies + snow tires would be too expensive, especially when they shouldnt really wear down, theyre not being used much besides for snow driving. right? ive never actually owned a set of snow tires.

[Sjej]

Originally Posted by NLSP

I say go for it, very few newer cars feel like this one at this price point.

I'm coming up on 8 years of ownership with my 2014. Have a little over 100,000 miles on the odometer and it still puts a smile on my face.

I average 26 mpg mixed driving. Side note - it drinks premium fuel only.

I'd say reliability has been pretty good considering how much hard driving it sees. Other than regular maintenance, I've replaced the rear wheel bearings back in 2020, a cracked radiator earlier this year, and recently the throwout bearing along with new clutch.

Off the top of my head, the 2 common issues are:

1) Valve spring recall on the 2013 models (production range Dec 9, 2011 - July 2, 2013). I would avoid these models since dealer mechanics have been known to do shoddy work to try and fix it.

2) Throwout bearing (TOB) wearing out prematurely on 2013-2016 models, requiring the trans to be dropped and replace with revised 2017+ part. I've read some members having theirs wear out around 50k-60k miles, but mine lasted 100k miles, so it can vary.

The manual shifter feels great in my opinion. Some reviews/journalists also tend to agree. Compared to other sporty cars I've driven, the shifter definitely feels better than a BMW M2 and Challenger Hellcat. Only shifters I've tried that were better are a Porsche 911 and a Civic Type-R.

The handling is also very good, especially if you're coming from Ford Edge Steering is precise and decent feel for an electric rack. Very little body roll compared to most cars.

If you have the budget and space, I'd highly recommend having separate summer and winter tires, especially if you're doing any sporty driving/autocross. All-seasons will feel squishier, less precise, less grippy and overheat easier compared to a real summer tire.

very reassuring. i love the idea of that. id also love to mention sliding in the snow. i love to slide the edge lol but its not the easiest thing to kick out the rear tires in fwd with no handbrake. thats just another reason i wanted the car, the rear wheel drive.



it sounds like an amazing car for the cheap price, and the videos ive seen of a brz on autocross just make me want to go get the car now. i dont know how practical the car would be for road trips, but im sure occasional out of state road trips wouldnt be bad