All-New 2022 Toyota 86 Reveal Delayed

[14stu]

There is an upcoming event hosted by the US Toyota HQ in Plano at one of the local racetracks (the same track where some of the promotional pictures for the new BRZ were shot). There may or may not be some cars in one of the garages that cannot yet be shown to the public. While I'm at the track the next two weekends, I'm going to volunteer to come back and help out with the event and try to get a peek at the new cars.

As one of the instructors at the track, I'd be more than happy to help as a pace car.

[Blighty]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Best Car's record on the new ones only looks good if you only read the one immediately before the car showed up and they had real info. Go back even a few months and it was not even close to reality.

Totaly ridiculous to think the CEO of Toyota waited until the car was ready and then said "oh no no no make it better than the BRZ even if we have to wait"

I agree that I think they are making a guess as to release dates and mechanical details, and reading the article it kind of feels like they are extrapolating from a very small bit of information. I think its a mistake to do that anyway, I think the 'twins' image is far far more positive in nature to say how people view the Supra BMW venture. I think its actually a positive, and one hopes that there isn't from some kind of of management frustration with how that project played out (the Toyota got a lower power engine profile)

In regards to bestcar - this is from early 2019 https://bestcarweb.jp/news/scoop/93965

They got a few things right - they did pick that it would be the same platform, suspension layout, NA FA2.4, with much more torque than power (although it was a lower number of 217hp, 177lbft), also got the date right (mid 2021), and keeping the auto and manual box (though that probably isn't hard to predict).

They also got the dimension changes pretty close - 10mm longer, 5mm wider, 5mm lower - though failed to predict the (admittedly extremely small) change in wheelbase, saying it was unchanged.

The bits they got very wrong was that they predicted little styling changes and that it would not be another generation as such, just more like a continuation on the first model - which I think you could kind of argue based on silhouette and general layout, but I think its a bit of a stretch.

It will be interesting anyway - I've now put out feelers for a BRZ deposit (seems a bit harder to achieve, but I'm working on it), and honestly I'm not going to wait for the 86 if its late because I actually need a car!

[Stonehorsw]

Originally Posted by Sport-Tech

It would be great if Toyota offered the equivalent of the TRD package out of the gate, because it's very unlikely that the performance package will be available on the new BRZ in year one (maybe even not in year two).

I would not expect for the Toyota version to be the most expensive, but the cheapest. No reason to have turbo, brakes and so on.

[Sport-Tech]

Originally Posted by Stonehorsw

I would not expect for the Toyota version to be the most expensive, but the cheapest. No reason to have turbo, brakes and so on.

TRD package is simply Sachs, Brembos, and PS4s, no turbo in sight. If Subaru doesn't offer their version right away Toyota could pull some sales their way by doing so. The days of the Toyota version being lower-rent are long gone.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Sport-Tech

TRD package is simply Sachs, Brembos, and PS4s, no turbo in sight. If Subaru doesn't offer their version right away Toyota could pull some sales their way by doing so. The days of the Toyota version being lower-rent are long gone.

Ya. At least here they went up $2,000 sticker price for a base model when they changed the badge from Scion to Toyota. No doubt the changes in 2017 would have been the same even if still marketed as Scions so all you were really paying for was that it was now a Toyota like it had been in the rest of the world all along.

[FR-SWINK]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Ya. At least here they went up $2,000 sticker price for a base model when they changed the badge from Scion to Toyota. No doubt the changes in 2017 would have been the same even if still marketed as Scions so all you were really paying for was that it was now a Toyota like it had been in the rest of the world all along.

Well $2000 difference also came with way better headlights and taillights

Honestly my biggest issue with the new designs has to be that hood slope. Makes it look much more sedan imo. Still can't wait to test drive one

[TheDonEffect]

Hmm, perhaps the disconnect between Toyota and Subaru is what to offer at the beginning. Subaru falls into the thought process of releasing the car, and the coax more sales down the road by offering different packages and new shiny bits to maintain interest.

Whereas if the Supra is any indicator, Toyota wants to cash in on early hype by offering the top of the line model upfront, and then offering more affordable variants down the road, and in that way giving a discount without giving a discount per se. This model has proven to work rather well for more niche products.

All the mules pretty much showed the same car (tires, brakes, etc), so Toyota may be finalizing the decisions on what exactly to offer, because it's very possible they don't just lift the brembo brakes from the outgoing car, heck they may even follow industry trends by offering a brake package but non-Brembo, so maybe they offer a bigger brake but a different, likely cheaper, setup for instance. Whatever they choose, they will still need to test it, I mean they'll have to tune suspension, brakes, and tire, along with any other bits they want add on.

So it wouldn't surprise me that Toyota comes out the gate with some sort of release edition that has alot of the bells and whistles, while Subaru comes out the gate with a sensible offering. Toyota may have even decided that they will stick to a more modest sales goal, and therefore milk each unit sold by optioning them up, ala Corvette/BMW.

At first I thought that Toyota would absolutely need to release at least some info by now to meet their on sale date later this year, but this isn't a Corvette or Porsche in that there isn't going to be a ton of personalization, they're going to make a # of each variant/combination and we the consumer will get in line for which one we want like they did with the Supra, vs. made to order like the Corvette/Bronco. So with that they won't need as much lead time.

I do hope that Toyota is actually hearing some of the early feedback about the BRZ and is finalizing their own tweaks, like offering a PP, and keep the damn cupholder, lol, oh and make an actual usable tray out of the hump on the passenger side dash.

I doubt that they stick in any turbo motor, remember, lower center gravity and all that jazz, but that would also mean Toyota would need to clear emissions for a relatively small amount of sales since the engine isn't even based on any other engine being offered in the states. After all the talk about engines, I highly doubt hey even get a different tune at this point.

[boy_racer]

My opinion is that the car will have different drive gear,maybe more throttle feedback by making the ecu tune more aggressive,a slightly better 0-62 mph due to all those little things (like a 1sec faster from start ) and giving the feeling you are going faster but actually you are not.That will make the car a better performance car,a hardcore one out of the two ,so in the "eyes" of the buyers gr86 will be the choice,while the brz keeping a more civilized profile(like 2% more civilized, nothing special) just for the journalist to have something to say.In real life 75% of the buyers won't know the differences.I don't expect big changes and all i mentioned are enough to keep the car 1 year away from the sale start.

*If i had the chance to change something,i don't like the dashboard,even if quality is said to be better.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by FR-SWINK

Well $2000 difference also came with way better headlights and taillights

Honestly my biggest issue with the new designs has to be that hood slope. Makes it look much more sedan imo. Still can't wait to test drive one

But they would have had those if still Scions as well. They didn't get them because they became Toyotas.

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by boy_racer

My opinion is that the car will have different drive gear,maybe more throttle feedback by making the ecu tune more aggressive,a slightly better 0-62 mph due to all those little things (like a 1sec faster from start ) and giving the feeling you are going faster but actually you are not.That will make the car a better performance car,a hardcore one out of the two ,so in the "eyes" of the buyers gr86 will be the choice,while the brz keeping a more civilized profile(like 2% more civilized, nothing special) just for the journalist to have something to say.In real life 75% of the buyers won't know the differences.I don't expect big changes and all i mentioned are enough to keep the car 1 year away from the sale start.

*If i had the chance to change something,i don't like the dashboard,even if quality is said to be better.

No reason to think or believe any of that as history has shown us. Lol Different front bumper, a couple interior trim changes, adjusted dampers call it a day.

[Sport-Tech]

I can't imagine Subaru agreeing to the 86 being tuned or tweaked for comparatively better acceleration. And a one second reduction in the 0-60 time is far from minor and would require a substantial boost in engine output.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Different scenario.
This isn't a massive profit potental project. It barely qualifies as a side line and the CEO isn't going to throw money away on it to make it different from the BRZ in any substainal form.
Just antother clickbait write up to seperate the internet from their money when there is no real news to write.

I wouldn't say the scenario is entirely science-fiction, because something similar happened again to the first generation. I believe at that time the changes were not that critical and ended up to a slight revision of the suspension (spring rates). The question is if now the budget can be higher and the changes can be a bit more drastic. I wouldn't hold my breath for an engine revision, but they have now more available GR parts to work on.

[Lantanafrs2]

Originally Posted by Sport-Tech

I can't imagine Subaru agreeing to the 86 being tuned or tweaked for comparatively better acceleration. And a one second reduction in the 0-60 time is far from minor and would require a substantial boost in engine output.

Another 25lbft of torque for that.

[boy_racer]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

No reason to think or believe any of that as history has shown us. Lol Different front bumper, a couple interior trim changes, adjusted dampers call it a day.

Most reasonable scenario,but all that it is not a reason for a year delay.

Originally Posted by Sport-Tech

I can't imagine Subaru agreeing to the 86 being tuned or tweaked for comparatively better acceleration. And a one second reduction in the 0-60 time is far from minor and would require a substantial boost in engine output.

misstyped ,i meant 0.1sec