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Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain.


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Old 09-29-2017, 07:57 AM   #1
Gloonge
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Clutch Swap Goals

I am rolling up on 60k miles on my second hand FRS, it had about 22k when I bought it. The clutch is to the point that is starts to engage just before the resting point of the pedal, and I am able to hear a kind of light grinding noise form it when idling in neutral.

My goals from this swap are as follows;
- More responsive clutch feel, I always felt the pedal was kind of light.
- Better engine response for rev matching my down shifts.
- Little less slop in the shifter

To attain these goals I intend to buy the following;
- ACT Clutch Kit (http://www.advancedclutch.com/sb7-hdss)
- 11.8lbs flywheel
- Perrin Shift Bushing
- Whiteline Trans Mount

Seeing as how this is a nearly $1000 purchase I was hoping to gain some insight from people here that might have done the same or similar swap, and take a few suggestions on parts that might be a better fit for my goals. Also, should I pickup a rear main seal since I will be in there already, and do I need an output/tail housing seal since I will be removing the drive shaft?

The car will not likely be modded heavily or have forced induction added any time within the next 50k miles. My daily drive is mostly highway, with maybe 4 stoplights.

Note: Sorry if this is the wrong section for this, nothing specifically said "clutch" but I figured "Drivetrain" fit the bill.
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Old 09-29-2017, 08:32 AM   #2
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Is the car stock? If so, a clutch failing at 60k suggests driver mod might be necessary. Unsure of the hardware listed tho. Good luck!
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Old 09-29-2017, 08:38 AM   #3
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The car is stock, but there are 20k miles of possible abuse un accounted for. I don't have the slightest clue if the previous driver knew what he was doing.

But I would definitely agree with you if I owned it from zero miles.
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Old 10-03-2017, 01:51 PM   #4
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If I can make a recommendation that will perform better and have less NVH:

1. ORC 309 or 400 Light Clutch Kit. I recommend the 400w/ Flywheel. It's fantastic. Part # 400 LD-TT 1213

2. Cusco transmission mount insert part # 965 912 A

You'll have a great feeling clutch that can hold tons of power and your shifting will feel very direct and solid. No other parts needed, although if you don't mind adding some transient NVH -- the Cusco engine mounts really round off the package but aren't necessary.
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Old 10-03-2017, 02:39 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by empower-auto View Post
If I can make a recommendation that will perform better and have less NVH:

1. ORC 309 or 400 Light Clutch Kit. I recommend the 400w/ Flywheel. It's fantastic. Part # 400 LD-TT 1213

2. Cusco transmission mount insert part # 965 912 A

You'll have a great feeling clutch that can hold tons of power and your shifting will feel very direct and solid. No other parts needed, although if you don't mind adding some transient NVH -- the Cusco engine mounts really round off the package but aren't necessary.
Pardon my ignorance, but the Cusco trans mount would replace the Whiteline Gearbox Mount ?

I appreciate the input though, I have been stressing over this for the last 2 weeks. I will look into the suggested parts.

Also, who sells ORC? I can't seem to find that part number that you listed, and naturally every website that seems to sell their stuff is in Japanese .

Last edited by Gloonge; 10-03-2017 at 02:57 PM.
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:14 PM   #6
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Pardon my ignorance, but the Cusco trans mount would replace the Whiteline Gearbox Mount ?

I appreciate the input though, I have been stressing over this for the last 2 weeks. I will look into the suggested parts.

Also, who sells ORC? I can't seem to find that part number that you listed, and naturally every website that seems to sell their stuff is in Japanese .
I'm not sure who does in the U.S but I am a Canadian based seller -- if you absolutely cannot find someone. I don't know if I am allowed to link or advertise our shop here though as this forum has strict vendor rules.

And yes, the Cusco insert is a standalone piece an doesn't really mix with the Whiteline one.
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:14 PM   #7
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I also have the SB7-HDSS kit installed professionally with a Velox fork and its starting to fail me after 8k.

I also come from a similar story, the TOB in these early cars have grease that can't withstand high temp -- they fail much earlier than the clutch. I had to replace mine around 63k, that's when I went with the ACT clutch kit.

8k later, I struggle to get it into gear from a stop. I love the feel of the lightened flywheel, but I would stick to an OEM clutch until ACT solves this issue.
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:21 PM   #8
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I'm not sure who does in the U.S but I am a Canadian based seller -- if you absolutely cannot find someone. I don't know if I am allowed to link or advertise our shop here though as this forum has strict vendor rules.

And yes, the Cusco insert is a standalone piece an doesn't really mix with the Whiteline one.
Your user name gives be a clue as to what to search for, I will take a look as I am not having any luck finding a US based seller.

Thank you for your help!
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:25 PM   #9
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I also have the SB7-HDSS kit installed professionally with a Velox fork and its starting to fail me after 8k.

I also come from a similar story, the TOB in these early cars have grease that can't withstand high temp -- they fail much earlier than the clutch. I had to replace mine around 63k, that's when I went with the ACT clutch kit.

8k later, I struggle to get it into gear from a stop. I love the feel of the lightened flywheel, but I would stick to an OEM clutch until ACT solves this issue.
Well that is not good news at all, I have not had any slippage as of yet, but starting 1st gear is a PITA with the clutch catching at essentially the resting point, and shifting is dodgy at best at the moment.

Is it possible to pair the OEM clutch with a lighter flywheel? I feel like I could deal with the OEM clutch if rev matching was a little easier.

I wonder if a faulty TOB caused the premature wear of the clutch as opposed to faulty driving.
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:31 PM   #10
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Alternative path:
1. Remove clutch helper spring
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103157
2. Check pedal height adjustment, previous owner may have messed with it
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8040
3. Flush clutch fluid

If you're not happy after those three then go buy a clutch.

I would also suggest performing the 60k tuneup before lightweight flywheel to increase engine responsiveness, spark plugs and air filter may be at the end of their usefulness and can perk an engine right up. Sloppy shifter feel depends on what's happening, if it's the transmission moving around yes those bushings will help, if it's the stick feeling loose then you'd probably want to look into replacing the springs, I believe "mtec shift springs" are the popular choice but there may be alternatives.

63k miles on my original clutch and driveline, hundreds of hard launches 5x track days and I have no complaints or need to buy parts for them. I pulled the clutch helper spring a few months back and it was a nice stiffening of the pedal but I got used to it in a week or so and only notice jumping back and forth between cars.

Edit there's also the clutch slave cylinder swap to improve feel, not too expensive.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77390
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:54 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strat61caster View Post
Alternative path:
1. Remove clutch helper spring
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103157
2. Check pedal height adjustment, previous owner may have messed with it
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8040
3. Flush clutch fluid

If you're not happy after those three then go buy a clutch.

I would also suggest performing the 60k tuneup before lightweight flywheel to increase engine responsiveness, spark plugs and air filter may be at the end of their usefulness and can perk an engine right up. Sloppy shifter feel depends on what's happening, if it's the transmission moving around yes those bushings will help, if it's the stick feeling loose then you'd probably want to look into replacing the springs, I believe "mtec shift springs" are the popular choice but there may be alternatives.

63k miles on my original clutch and driveline, hundreds of hard launches 5x track days and I have no complaints or need to buy parts for them. I pulled the clutch helper spring a few months back and it was a nice stiffening of the pedal but I got used to it in a week or so and only notice jumping back and forth between cars.
I will definitely remove that helper spring, that is likely to be a quality of life change.
I have tried the clutch adjustment in the past, its a little lower than factory ATM, but still the pedal travels 90% of the way up before the clutch bites.
I will also do a flush tonight or tomorrow and see if that gives any results, at the very least I will have a freshly flushed system to go with my new clutch.

I change/clean my air filter every 3rd oil change, and I was unaware that the plugs were listed as a 60k service, I will definitely pull them and check em out.

The engine responsiveness is only an issue when trying to blip the throttle to rev match down shifts, and that "lag" if you will seems to be an electronic throttle issue so the flywheel would likely not be of any help there anyway.
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Old 10-03-2017, 04:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gloonge View Post
Is it possible to pair the OEM clutch with a lighter flywheel? I feel like I could deal with the OEM clutch if rev matching was a little easier.

I wonder if a faulty TOB caused the premature wear of the clutch as opposed to faulty driving.
I know Exedy makes a lightened flywheel, but how well it works with the OEM clutch, I'm unsure.

Depends on how bad the TOB is, if it completely fails, you'll be stuck. Mine was squealing like a pig when the car was cold.
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Old 10-03-2017, 04:24 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Gloonge View Post
The engine responsiveness is only an issue when trying to blip the throttle to rev match down shifts, and that "lag" if you will seems to be an electronic throttle issue so the flywheel would likely not be of any help there anyway.
I concur and decided it was a characteristic of the car I would have to live with.

If you're bothered by the lag between pedal and engine response then yeah, flywheel won't help, if you're bothered by how long it takes for the engine to spin up that's a flywheel change. Downside of the lighter flywheel loses revs more quickly as well potentially making upshifts awkward.
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Old 10-03-2017, 07:34 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strat61caster View Post
Alternative path:
1. Remove clutch helper spring
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103157
2. Check pedal height adjustment, previous owner may have messed with it
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8040
3. Flush clutch fluid

If you're not happy after those three then go buy a clutch.

.............]
@Gloonge ........there ya go .......


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