Who will be first to swap new 2.4 into previous gen

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

In general my feeling is that some people are really not happy that Toyota went with a Subaru engine. Then they will just throw whatever kind of arguments and hypothetical facts, no matter the reasoning and what real facts indicate. It is what it is.

Originally Posted by why?

of course people are pissed Toyota went with a boxer 4 that has next to no development. Add in the torque dip and the fact it sounds like a farm tractor and you take one of the strengths of the original 86 and totally wreck it.

Kinda proving Nikitopo right there bud..

[Ernest72]

Just feel lucky we have these cars. They may not be around forever. The world is changing.

Funny people get all worked up about a cars faults, but really some of those faults give the car the character and a different experience.

The EVs of our future will start to bore you fast. After a few launches, you get car sick and you are done. Rarely do them again unless someone new is in the car. Then you just drive them like any other grocery getter. I find the experience of going slower with sound is better then faster with no sound.

Let’s hope they let me keep my old Subarus with all their faults.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by ZDan

In any context, your comment about JDM tS having "softer rear springs that transfer more weight to the rear" doesn't make sense. Softer rear springs don't transfer more weight to the rear under braking, acceleration, or cornering. If they went with softer rear springs, they moved roll stiffness distribution forward, which would further load up the outside front during cornering and keep the rears more evenly loaded. Good for drive, but bad for front grip...

My mistake. I wanted to say stiffer rear springs.

Originally Posted by ZDan

55/45 is crap for an FR performance car. Yes, the car is well set up and very fun to drive! But grip is *far* from optimized... With 50/50 weight distribution, I would have won my time trial easily on Sunday vs coming in 2nd by less than a tenth...

Sorry to hear this. Hope you have a better luck next time.

Originally Posted by ZDan

Could try to correct for that with more rear roll stiffness, but before long you'll overcome the Torsen diff's ability to deliver power to both rears, so kind of a dead-end. Even with a good ramp-type clutch diff, you're only going to be able to put so much power down on corner exit. This is already a minor issue even at stock 205hp.

Torsen is a trademark of JTEKT Corp. owned by Toyota. They have an improved Torsen diff., but they don't install it much. I have it in my car and I am quite happy with the result. Check attachment below for details.

[BrahmaBull1990]

Originally Posted by Ernest72

Just feel lucky we have these cars. They may not be around forever. The world is changing.

Funny people get all worked up about a cars faults, but really some of those faults give the car the character and a different experience.

The EVs of our future will start to bore you fast. After a few launches, you get car sick and you are done. Rarely do them again unless someone new is in the car. Then you just drive them like any other grocery getter. I find the experience of going slower with sound is better then faster with no sound.

Let’s hope they let me keep my old Subarus with all their faults.

I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately and it makes me sad. Last night I went to the local NASCAR races and had a blast. The cars are mean and so loud you can feel them on your chest. That all could be gone in a decade.

[Tokay444]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

If Toyota wanted a V4 engine, then they would look somewhere else or they would develop it themselves.


I didn't mention during acceleration, but let's leave it there.



Not sure why a car that is praised for its handling ability, has now a garbage weight distribution. 911's have an even more garbage weight distribution with the majority of the total weight on the rear, but they have worked with suspension geometry for decades and they are well established in car's history.

Subaru have their expertise on building boxer engines and it is what is. They don't have the capacity having different engine designs. I am mentioning it again that they even had a big trouble moving into direct injection! Something that looks a "fix" for you, could mean a (financial) disaster for them.

Yet Porsche's entry level vehicle has to be continually neutered in order to keep it from dethroning their halo 911, in just what, 10-15 years of existence, vs 60? They can't accept they made a mistake putting all that mass behind the rear axle, so they engineer around it.

[Ernest72]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

Yet Porsche's entry level vehicle has to be continually neutered in order to keep it from dethroning their halo 911, in just what, 10-15 years of existence, vs 60? They can't accept they made a mistake putting all that mass behind the rear axle, so they engineer around it.

Yes the new vette really shows that the mid engine is the ultimate winner. But do you really need to be the ultimate winner for 97% of the people who just buy cars and drive to be seen or at pretty regular speeds. If the car feels good and is fun to drive that’s all that really matters. It’s about experience and cars with different setups offer different experiences.

Plenty of un-neutered Caymans in the aftermarket.

[Arthur-A]

What's all the fuss about the COG? I'd owned/driven several Subarus WRX/STIs and they're all felt like pigs compared to my EVO X, which probably has higher COG than an STI (by a negligible amount probably).
The 86/BRZ is an amazing car and I love it. However, I'd take inline 4 over a boxer any day.

[Tokay444]

Originally Posted by Ernest72

Yes the new vette really shows that the mid engine is the ultimate winner. But do you really need to be the ultimate winner for 97% of the people who just buy cars and drive to be seen or at pretty regular speeds. If the car feels good and is fun to drive that’s all that really matters. It’s about experience and cars with different setups offer different experiences.

Plenty of un-neutered Caymans in the aftermarket.

If your argument is need, then no one needs a car at all.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

If your argument is need, then no one needs a car at all.

I am supposed to walk for 6 hours to get to work? I am afraid that for many a car is a total necessity. Now of course how elaborate a car needs to be for basic transportation is a whole different matter.

[RToyo86]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

If your argument is need, then no one needs a car at all.

Not a valid argument unless hou live inisde a city with good timely public transportation and your work is in the same zone.

[Tokay444]

There are a great many things a person can do to eliminate a car from their lifestyle. Therefore, not a need.
Keep in mind, I didn't bring up the need argument, but if humans NEEDED cars, they'd have been around a lot sooner than they were. You may THINK you need one, but you don't.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

There are a great many things a person can do to eliminate a car from their lifestyle. Therefore, not a need.
Keep in mind, I didn't bring up the need argument, but if humans NEEDED cars, they'd have been around a lot sooner than they were. You may THINK you need one, but you don't.

Sure we could all move to within a mile of where we work or just quit our jobs and work where we can take public transportation.
You have it backwards anyway. People have always had a NEED for transportation. That is why cars were developed in the first place. They couldn't make what there was no tech for earlier though so they could not have been around sooner. In fact that is a really silly idea.
You can wax philosophical all you want there is a distinct need for many people.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Ernest72

Yes the new vette really shows that the mid engine is the ultimate winner. But do you really need to be the ultimate winner for 97% of the people who just buy cars and drive to be seen or at pretty regular speeds. If the car feels good and is fun to drive that’s all that really matters. It’s about experience and cars with different setups offer different experiences.

Plenty of un-neutered Caymans in the aftermarket.

See this all the time in the car community. People want to brag about lap times for some car they just bought, but they never actually take their car to the track, much less compete in time trials or w2w. I think it was James May who pointed out how pointless Nurburgring lap times are for 99 percent of buyers. How a car feels or functions in your actual usage is more important, although there are no bragging rights for that.

[Sasquachulator]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Sure we could all move to within a mile of where we work or just quit our jobs and work where we can take public transportation.
You have it backwards anyway. People have always had a NEED for transportation. That is why cars were developed in the first place. They couldn't make what there was no tech for earlier though so they could not have been around sooner. In fact that is a really silly idea.
You can wax philosophical all you want there is a distinct need for many people.

I definitely want to uproot my family and move downtown to pay more for smaller living quarters so i can walk to work and get rid of my cars.....