EVO: GT86 TRD vs Miata MX-5 BBR Turbo

[ST185RC]

Dumb comparison. In Canada the first year I bought my car:

2013 FRS = $25999 let's say $26000

2013 base MX5 GX = $29250

Let's assume all other costs and insurance amounts are the same.

Dollar for Dollar, if EVO is going to compare this way, throw in a sticker set of Starspecs on the FRS let's see who wins; even with the price of the tires, you can still throw on a TRD sound changer, TRD shift knob, TRD sunshades, TRD seatbelt pads, BRZ trunk liner and a multiples of squash scented air fresheners and still have money left over for steak and 'tatoes after.

If you're gonna compare third-party modified cars with factory optioned cars, there's no credibility on performance comparisons.

[n2oinferno]

Huh, I had no idea that the BBR MX5 existed. I just skimmed the video, didn't listen, at work. But looks like 221 bhp 175 lb. ft tq. That's a pretty decent improvement. Here's some more info on it: http://www.bbrgti.com/product_details.php?id=11646

I love the 86, but I'd say the MX5 did pretty well for a car that hasn't had a major update since 2006. It'll be more interesting when we get a comparison between the twins and the soon-to-be-released ND MX5.

[Sonolin]

I actually thought it was a decent comparison. You can tell evo likes the car with all the videos they do on it. The only real complaint I've heard from them is the lack of power and sudden oversteer (which more applies to FRS/GT86 from what I understand).

I liked how he actually talked about the tires & how they didn't upset the balance and fun to drive nature of the car. The video just highlights the obvious that the FRS would be much funner with more power (look how much fun he was having in that little miata, which handles more similar to the FRS than most cars).

[DarkSunrise]

By the way, for those curious how a FI GT86 would have done, Evo just so happened to have tested the Litchfield BRZ at Blyton Park.

Litchfield BRZ Spec S
- 1:07.5
- 29,477 GBP
- 280 bhp

BBR Miata GT270
- 1:08.9
- 29,995 GBP
- 268 bhp

The prices are nearly identical, their power output is very close, both cars were tuned by reputable 3rd party shops, and Evo had previously tested both cars.

This would have been the more logical matchup. I guess Evo conveniently forgot about the Litchfield BRZ they tested three months ago.

[thill]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

By the way, for those curious how a FI GT86 would have done, Evo just so happened to have tested the Litchfield BRZ at Blyton Park.

Litchfield BRZ Spec S
- 1:07.5
- 29,477 GBP
- 280 bhp

BBR Miata GT270
- 1:08.9
- 29,995 GBP
- 268 bhp

The prices are nearly identical, their power output is very close, both cars were tuned by reputable 3rd party shops, and Evo had previously tested both cars.

This would have been a more logical matchup. I guess Evo conveniently forgot about the Litchfield BRZ they tested three months ago.

I don't know. Evo has gone downhill. Maybe they actually think that adding bodykits and stickers to a car increases performance.

[suaveflooder]

Originally Posted by Meehow86

Your comment is dumb and you should feel dumb.

1. "Run what ya brung"

.... or bring cars that can actually be fairly judged against each other. Stock MX-5 vs GT86 or SIMILARLY modded MX-5 vs GT86.


2. "Mazda had a better car in this case."

Did you miss the part about the third party tuner that threw a turbo in that car?! Mazda's got nothing to do with that.


3. "you can make excuses all day long as to why it lost."

Refer back to #1 and #2


4. " It still lost, and rightfully so in this case."

Refer back to #1... and #2. Maybe you and EVO can get together and have a GT86 vs 370 Z comparison and this time the Toyota only gets 3 tires. Idk, seem like you just missed everything that's obviously wrong with this video.

So, not sure if I want to argue with you here, because you missed my entire point. I hardly feel dumb. The comparison was between two rear wheel drive sports cars that had the same amount of money (or approximately) put into them.

I had a nice long response written for you, but it's honestly not worth getting into a big, long STUPID debate

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by thill

I don't know. Evo has gone downhill. Maybe they actually think that adding bodykits and stickers to a car increases performance.

Yeah this is why Evo has lost credibility for me. Instead of just admitting they screwed up with all their initial BRZ bashing, they pull stunts like this. It's like they're trying to handcuff the Twins in tests to justify their initial bashing of them and save their own reputation.

I understand why they're doing it (and all the flip-flopping & backtracking going on in their long-term GT86 updates), but they've lost my respect. I would have been fine with them if they had just admitted they misjudged the car to begin with, but the whole cover-up is annoying.

[Ganthrithor]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Let me guess, another Evo review where the GT86 loses? Typical Evo. For a magazine that purports to dislike the GT86/BRZ as much as they do, they sure are obsessed with it.

And why would you compare a factory TRD GT86 against a 3rd-party tuned Miata? Obviously a Miata built by an aftermarket performance shop is going to be cheaper and faster than a GT86 fitted only with TRD pieces.

I feel like Evo just does it to troll at this point.

Pretty much this. Litchfield BRZ vs this car would have been much more appropriate, but no-- they had to compare that to a Cayman and the TRD to a tuner car...

Again I think this guy is good at drifting but I don't think his "hot lap" looks fast. It looks really jerky, like he's trying to flick the car into a drift the whole time.

[Frost]

This whole comparo is a double face palm.

[brzmaybe]

Originally Posted by thill

It is a pointless comparison. They should do third party Miata tuned to third party GT86 tuned.

Like one of these cars that Top Gear looked into:

http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/s...ive-2013-10-16

Well, well, well. The Top Gear guys claim the Litchfield super charged GT 86 can be had for 30,000 pounds. Add a couple of thousand for good brake pads and wheels/tires, and you have a fair (price to price) comparison.

I'm surprised and saddened. I had thought better of EVO. Have to conclude they cooked the comparison or.... just simply got lazy.

[Frost]

So I finally clicked and watched the video - it's still stupid. I want my time back.

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by Sonolin

I actually thought it was a decent comparison. You can tell evo likes the car with all the videos they do on it. The only real complaint I've heard from them is the lack of power and sudden oversteer (which more applies to FRS/GT86 from what I understand).

I liked how he actually talked about the tires & how they didn't upset the balance and fun to drive nature of the car. The video just highlights the obvious that the FRS would be much funner with more power (look how much fun he was having in that little miata, which handles more similar to the FRS than most cars).

According to figures posted somewhere on this board the GT 86 fits softer rear springs than the BRZ or the FRS. The rear springs are stiffer on the FRS and the front springs are stiffer on the BRZ.

This would explain why those UK testers get oversteer in the wet. The FRS oversteers even more.

The Litchfield also oversteers.

That modified Miata has also been tested against the stock gt86 by Autocar and found to handle less well but of course it is faster than a stock gt86.

The turbo engine will also monster the naturally aspirated engine on torque which is probably the source of the time advantage. Turbos punch out much higher torque and over a lower rpm range.

Still, bang for your buck the BBR modified MX5 is a better car than the TRD GT 86. Forged wheels are very expensive and way overkill for a car in this category. It's not as if the gt86 suffers from an excess of unsprung weight. Dunno if those sparco wheels on the MX5 are forged.

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by brzmaybe

Well, well, well. The Top Gear guys claim the Litchfield super charged GT 86 can be had for 30,000 pounds. Add a couple of thousand for good brake pads and wheels/tires, and you have a fair (price to price) comparison.

I'm surprised and saddened. I had thought better of EVO. Have to conclude they cooked the comparison or.... just simply got lazy.

If you just want the supercharger. If you want the wheels and so on its more like GBP 35,000 according to Evo.

Also, Litchfield didn't tune the suspension for a hot lap time but to preserve the existing balance of the BRZ. Whatever that means.

[Meehow86]

Originally Posted by suaveflooder

So, not sure if I want to argue with you here, because you missed my entire point. I hardly feel dumb. The comparison was between two rear wheel drive sports cars that had the same amount of money (or approximately) put into them.

I had a nice long response written for you, but it's honestly not worth getting into a big, long STUPID debate

So you think adding a body kit to one car and a turbo to another make them comparable... Thank you for not wanting to add more nonsense here.


btw, if you ever learn how to use the internet correctly you would know that its not hard to look up MX-5's on the Mazda website, pick the one which lines up the closest to the GT86/FR-S/BRZ OR throw turbos on both and do a fair comparison. But that's just too hard for you to understand huh?