follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Delicious Tuning
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > Suspension | Chassis | Brakes -- Sponsored by 949 Racing

Suspension | Chassis | Brakes -- Sponsored by 949 Racing Relating to suspension, chassis, and brakes. Sponsored by 949 Racing.


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-24-2023, 11:50 PM   #113
churchx
Senior Member
 
churchx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Drives: 2014 GT86
Location: Latvia, Riga
Posts: 4,333
Thanks: 696
Thanked 2,086 Times in 1,436 Posts
Mentioned: 53 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Are higher boiling temps brake fluids more hygroscopic? Indeed, common trait. Do some raceteams (if they have means & budget) for high end racecars choose to flush after race because they intend to keep car in absolute top state, not even 1-2% worse? - probably. But that doesn't sound to me that fluid used became "unusable" or degraded past level most of us will consider as unusable "after single race". Also wet (degraded due absorbed moisture) temps of some brake fluids may still be high enough or higher then that of generic brake fluids. Due legal reasons (to keep street legal locally) i'm limited to stock brakes, pads/fluid is only thing i can upgrade, so that's what i do. From my experience, on my car, with my stock brakes, with my track use, cheaper aftermarket fluids like RBF600 needed more frequent flushing, while i used Pmu Gfour-355 for season. So "high end brake fluids must be flushed after every race, hence shouldn't be considered" imho is not exactly best conclusion to draw either. My limited (stock) brake thermal capacity means that with rest being same brakes vs BBK will run hotter and stay hot longer .. higher temp range pads & fluid seem to me as justified & needed in this scenario.
churchx is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to churchx For This Useful Post:
autoracer86 (05-26-2023), Captain Snooze (05-25-2023)
Old 05-26-2023, 11:38 AM   #114
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '23 BRZ
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 4,587
Thanks: 1,378
Thanked 3,893 Times in 2,034 Posts
Mentioned: 85 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by churchx View Post
Are higher boiling temps brake fluids more hygroscopic? Indeed, common trait. Do some raceteams (if they have means & budget) for high end racecars choose to flush after race because they intend to keep car in absolute top state, not even 1-2% worse? - probably. But that doesn't sound to me that fluid used became "unusable" or degraded past level most of us will consider as unusable "after single race".
In my experience, fresh high-temp "racing" brake fluid has only been usable for a single track day, which for me consists of 4x 10-15 minute sessions. While parts store DOT4/DOT5.1 lasts half a season or about 6 track days before caliper bleed.

Quote:
Due legal reasons (to keep street legal locally) i'm limited to stock brakes, pads/fluid is only thing i can upgrade, so that's what i do. From my experience, on my car, with my stock brakes, with my track use, cheaper aftermarket fluids like RBF600 needed more frequent flushing, while i used Pmu Gfour-355 for season. So "high end brake fluids must be flushed after every race, hence shouldn't be considered" imho is not exactly best conclusion to draw either.
Fact is 90% of us who track these cars will be just fine with "normal" parts store DOT4 or DOT5.1. IMO AP Racing's recommendation for a street FT86 doing HPDE makes perfect sense. Most likely there is no need for any special higher-temp "racing" brake fluid.

Quote:
My limited (stock) brake thermal capacity means that with rest being same brakes vs BBK will run hotter and stay hot longer .. higher temp range pads & fluid seem to me as justified & needed in this scenario.
But have you tried tracking with normal DOT4 or DOT5.1? For me, that has always been sufficient in every car I've tracked.
ZDan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2023, 05:31 PM   #115
churchx
Senior Member
 
churchx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Drives: 2014 GT86
Location: Latvia, Riga
Posts: 4,333
Thanks: 696
Thanked 2,086 Times in 1,436 Posts
Mentioned: 53 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZDan View Post
But have you tried tracking with normal DOT4 or DOT5.1? For me, that has always been sufficient in every car I've tracked.
Hmm .. hate to admit, but haven't exactly tried . As in my two very first trackdays ever, that were on stock primacies, stock alignment, stock fluid, stock brake pads .. imho brake fade experienced was more from overheated/glazed pads, not boiled fluid, though i might been wrong .. when started feeling braking degradation, just went for cool off lap and returned to pits .. while later i changed both pads & fluid, so hard to tell, which did hit limit first ..
churchx is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to churchx For This Useful Post:
ZDan (05-26-2023)
Old 05-26-2023, 06:34 PM   #116
strat61caster
-
 
strat61caster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: '13 FRS - STX
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 10,367
Thanks: 13,741
Thanked 9,482 Times in 5,000 Posts
Mentioned: 94 Post(s)
Tagged: 3 Thread(s)
Arguing about people “wasting” $40/year on Castrol SRF for their >$15000 track car is silly.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guff View Post
ineedyourdiddly
strat61caster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2023, 06:50 PM   #117
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '23 BRZ
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 4,587
Thanks: 1,378
Thanked 3,893 Times in 2,034 Posts
Mentioned: 85 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by strat61caster View Post
Arguing about people “wasting” $40/year on Castrol SRF for their >$15000 track car is silly.
Not arguing, discussing.
I think it’s not a bad idea to let people know they have cheaper and easier-to-get options for trackworthy brake fluid, that will most likely last them for more events between bleeding flushing vs more expensive “racing” brake fluid. Just sharing my experience here…
ZDan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2023, 06:55 PM   #118
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '23 BRZ
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 4,587
Thanks: 1,378
Thanked 3,893 Times in 2,034 Posts
Mentioned: 85 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by churchx View Post
Hmm .. hate to admit, but haven't exactly tried . As in my two very first trackdays ever, that were on stock primacies, stock alignment, stock fluid, stock brake pads .. imho brake fade experienced was more from overheated/glazed pads, not boiled fluid, though i might been wrong .. when started feeling braking degradation, just went for cool off lap and returned to pits .. while later i changed both pads & fluid, so hard to tell, which did hit limit first ..
Wouldn’t risk much to try “normal” DOT4 or 5.1 at the track with your trusted racy brake fluid on hand for quick flush if you need it. I bet you won’t though!
ZDan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2023, 07:59 PM   #119
CSG Mike
 
CSG Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: S2000 CR
Location: Orange County
Posts: 14,535
Thanks: 8,927
Thanked 14,181 Times in 6,837 Posts
Mentioned: 966 Post(s)
Tagged: 14 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Snooze View Post
I recently spoke to the AP Racing distributor in Aus regarding their super duper Radi-CAL R4 Brake Fluid. I was told that it gets flushed after every race. I was told that the higher the performance of a brake fluid the more hygroscopic it becomes. After telling him I wanted to track my road car he recommended AP Racing 5.1.
When you're racing 6 figure cars, you're not gonna skimp on relatively small maintenance items. Similar cars will likely get a full fluid change, as well as fresh rotors and pads, and maybe even a caliper swap to a freshly serviced set of calipers *every race*.

You don't want to risk the car or a loss to something small, when you're spending 6-7 figures a year to run the car, and the operation of the car is measured in double digit spend per kilometer.
CSG Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to CSG Mike For This Useful Post:
Captain Snooze (05-26-2023), Ohio Enthusiast (05-26-2023)
Old 06-01-2023, 11:28 AM   #120
Muskoka800
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Drives: 2016 Scion FRS Release Series 2#439
Location: Chatham, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 688
Thanks: 3
Thanked 150 Times in 123 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
FYI All,
I messaged Torque yesterday asking for Canadian dealer info.
Last night Michael Wachholz replied.
Sadly he has no Canadian dealers at this time. But suggested ordering via their website and advised they are re-running their 4 for the price of 3 promo.
Food for thought.
__________________
Edelbrock S/C with CSG 94 & 91 maps
TRD Short Shifter, CTS/EvoX Brakes
Ohlin’s R&T Dampers, Hotchkis F/R Bars, Blox LCA & Toe Arms
235F/245R Conti ECS on TRD/Enkei wheels (street),
245/40 sq. A052 on 17x8 720Form GTF2 wheels (track)
Muskoka800 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2023, 11:02 AM   #121
Muskoka800
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Drives: 2016 Scion FRS Release Series 2#439
Location: Chatham, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 688
Thanks: 3
Thanked 150 Times in 123 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Any info/results for Motul RBF700?
I don’t see Torque RT700 on the CSG web store.
__________________
Edelbrock S/C with CSG 94 & 91 maps
TRD Short Shifter, CTS/EvoX Brakes
Ohlin’s R&T Dampers, Hotchkis F/R Bars, Blox LCA & Toe Arms
235F/245R Conti ECS on TRD/Enkei wheels (street),
245/40 sq. A052 on 17x8 720Form GTF2 wheels (track)
Muskoka800 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2023, 09:23 PM   #122
Lynxis
Senior Member
 
Lynxis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Drives: 2013 WRB BRZ 6MT
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 1,020
Thanks: 918
Thanked 604 Times in 387 Posts
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Garage
If you're having trouble getting a hold of RT700, I'm just going to recommend Canadians source Castrol SRF React which is a similar class of fluid. A single flush of the stuff is completely fine for a full year of regular autocross and track days for me. It also has the benefit of not getting highly viscous in low temperatures like many other fluids given that my brake pedal feels exactly the same in -30c as it does at the end of 20 minute sessions on the race track and that's not something I can say the same about with any other fluid I've personally used.



I'll note that I've run the same fluid for over 2 years without even partial bleeds and it's handled it just fine and although my last track day was totally fine, the fluid that came out last weekend was quite cloudy/milky so I'm not recommending anyone else actually do this, I think it should still be flushed annually at least, but if you're in a pinch, it looks like you can stretch it out a bit.
Lynxis is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Lynxis For This Useful Post:
bhmax (07-04-2023)
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
CounterSpace Garage - Authorized Dealer - Torque RT700 Racing Brake Fluid CounterSpace Garage Announcements, Contests, Giveaways 0 09-26-2013 07:33 PM
Brake fluid question barabia Suspension | Chassis | Brakes -- Sponsored by 949 Racing 8 07-31-2013 11:08 PM
Amount of Brake Fluid.... THEmailman Mechanical Maintenance (Oil, Fluids, Break-In, Servicing) 3 04-13-2013 11:46 PM
Brake fluid leak.. tintumz22 Issues | Warranty | Recalls / TSB 9 02-01-2013 03:20 PM
Racing brake fluid promo MillersOilsUS Brakes, Suspension, Chassis 0 12-31-2012 11:29 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:47 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.