Irace86.2.0's KPower Turbo K24 Swap

[Brz-123]

Gutted to see your flywheel go. As with any major mechanical project like an engine swap, it does come with a bit of a risk. The way you have journalled it will be useful for anyone attempting this and the learnings that come with it.
Enjoyed reading your posts and seeing your journey develop.

All the very best. The final working car is so so close!

Sent from my SM-G781B using Tapatalk

[BrahmaBull1990]

Moar powah baby!

Very nice - congrats and what’s success without at least one more hiccup haha you’ll be Summer-ready soon!

[jflogerzi]

This will be still "registered" on the street?

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by jflogerzi

This will be still "registered" on the street?

Yes, it is fully California-registered in a smog exempt area. It is not street legal.

[Irace86.2.0]

The flywheel should be here Wednesday. Depending on the time. I might get things back together Wednesday, but probably completed by Friday at the latest, assuming I don't run into any other snags.

I picked up the flywheel bolts from the dealership. They look about the same quality as the ARP flywheel bolts, but this is why I question whether these bolts are legit because the don't look better. The head is 19mm vs 17mm, but the part that actually makes contact with the flywheel is smaller.

If metallurgy of the metals is identical then the three factors that should determine clamping integrity are flange size/type, thread pitch/amount and bolt size. The larger the contact surface with the bolt and surface, the greater the shear resistance. The smaller the thread pitch, and subsequently, the smaller the angle, the greater the surface area for thread contact and the greater the resistance to backing out. Finally, the larger the head and the larger the bolt, the greater the torque that can be used to clamp down the bolt. A small Allen head on a large bolt is just going to strip, and a large hex, Torx or 12 point head on a small bolt will likely just shear the bolt off in the material.

The ARP bolts I bought are the same grade size and thread pitch, but the heads are different. The ARP bolts use a larger 19mm head, so more torque could be applied, but the grade is the same (M12 I believe), so I don't know if that makes much difference. I've seen 76 ft-lbs (TSX K24 and 5spd K20) vs 90 ft-lbs (RSX Type S K20 6spd and Kpower's instructions) for the OEM stuff vs 95 ft-lbs for the ARP bolts, which is what I did. The contact surface is clearly larger on the OEM bolts, which I have to believe is much better to prevent shear and backing out. I can't find it in the TSX manual, but I don't know if these bolts are stretch-to-yield and need replacing after each removal, even if some people do reuse them, but I know ARP's bolts are reusable, so perhaps different materials. The ARP bolts are probably finished with better tolerances and a smoother surface, so less binding on the head.

Regardless, the larger 19mm head leaves no room for a socket, unlike the 17mm head, so they don't fit without machining the flywheel. Just use the OEM bolts, and I bet they will do well. There might be a higher rate of failure with OEM bolts if someone was servicing/changing the flywheel often and using them, and if they do stretch-to-yield then probably a higher rate of failure from stretching over time and with higher power applications. In the short term, the extra flange size of the head could make them better, maybe.

[brzlegend]

Might be a good idea to check the interference fit of the flywheel to crank, against a factory setup.

[Irace86.2.0]

Thanks to Kpower on getting the flywheel out fast. I received it today, and I installed the transmission, and I got the car running again. In the back of my mind, I was hoping the vibrations would be gone, as if it was associated with the flywheel being loose, but in all likelihood, the flywheel was only part of the vibrations, and yet, there probably would have been more noises all along like there was at the end if the vibrations were mostly the flywheel. These things tend to build exponentially when they fail, so the flywheel probably came loose at 8k 135mph on successive dyno pulls.

The knocking noise is obviously gone, so it wasn't anything with the engine, which is a big relief. The car feels smoother than ever at idle with minor vibrations. The bolts should hold this time.

The machining on the flywheel wasn't great. I can't remember what my first flywheel looked like, but this one had machining that wasn't perfect. The machining scored into the flywheel surface, leaving it not entirely smooth. I looked up some pictures of some other flywheels. The steel flywheel on their website looks like they machined the surface after machining the reliefs for the bolts in the center, and they probably did that, so it looks nice for the pictures. The machining on hedtrip's aluminum flywheel doesn't look as bad, and it has machining into the surface like their website picture; it looks more even, but maybe that is aluminum cutting easier. Anyways, it felt decently smooth, so hopefully some red Loctite this time instead of the blue and triple checking the ft-lbs will be enough.

[toast]

Those relief cuts are terrible. I'm just a hobbyist with a mill and I would never let something that looks like that come out of the clamps. It's almost like the end mill they used to cut them were chipped toward the middle. The face of the bolt will only be clamping down on that inner ~2mm of steel where they stand a little proud of the rest of the cut.

[Irace86.2.0]

Yeah, it isn't great, but I didn't really have much choice. Hopefully the bolts are snug enough to hold. In the meantime, updating the Haltech's software and firmware bricked the car. I downgraded, and now I am able to turn over the car, but the car isn't firing up. I don't know if I don't have spark or fuel. I tested the coils for resistance, but I don't know what is normal, so I can't really say what I should expect, and I couldn't find any values online. The car is once again down, but at least it was towed back to the garage.

[redlined600]

It sucks you've run into some issues but such is the life with engine swaps. Stick with it, in the end you'll have built a pretty awesome car.

[captain awesome]

Hope you can get the issue figured out.



Is there no way to check spark by pulling a coil pack with a spare plug?


Also pulling a plug will show whether it's drenched in fuel, they may need cleaned?

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by captain awesome

Hope you can get the issue figured out.



Is there no way to check spark by pulling a coil pack with a spare plug?


Also pulling a plug will show whether it's drenched in fuel, they may need cleaned?

I did the spark plug test. No spark. No power is going to the coils, as far as I can tell. I have power to my injectors. I’m going to test the relays and fuses. The cylinder looks wet inside. The plugs don’t look drenched at all, but E85 evaporates fast and is clearer.

[Irace86.2.0]

Car is working.

Embarrassing error on my part. In my panic to pull a fuse before the battery died (AGM lightweight battery) to stop the car that was stuck in accessories and wouldn't start or turn off, I pulled a fuse and put it back in a spot that was suppose to be blank, flip-flopping the positions. I looked at the circuit diagram for the coils and saw that the only thing stopping the coils from getting 12v on one lead was a fuse and relay. It was the fuse.

[captain awesome]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

Car is working.

Embarrassing error on my part. In my panic to pull a fuse before the battery died (AGM lightweight battery) to stop the car that was stuck in accessories and wouldn't start or turn off, I pulled a fuse and put it back in a spot that was suppose to be blank, flip-flopping the positions. I looked at the circuit diagram for the coils and saw that the only thing stopping the coils from getting 12v on one lead was a fuse and relay. It was the fuse.

That one has to sting a bit. I did something similar-ish on an old e30 I had. It died on my last autocross run and it was obvious the fuel shut off. I swapped spare relays for the pump and no dice. I knew the fairly new DW300 pump was good but I started tearing the rear seats out and testing the pump like a ding dong anyway. Fuel pump worked fine but of course no power with the key on. A friggin 7.5a fuse was all that I needed. I guess we all get to have those days. I think I spent an hour or more on that when a 30 second fuse swap would have done the trick.