Cost of STX VS. SSC build

[SON1C]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=34

As mentioned later in the thread that's near enough the 2019 champion car build. You can of course spend more money if you wish.

iirc SSC is nearly $4k, I think it comes down to if you like the Falkens or the faster pricier tires because STX will certainly have a higher cost per run on the bigger faster tire, by my math it's about $7-8/run for me in STX. The rear bumpstop travel snap oversteer issue is also a personal choice on SSC but a lot of people don't care about it. IMHO drive an SSC car or ride in one or at least buy a set of Falkens before committing to the class, STX plunge is also tough to know how deep is too deep for you personally but the parts may be a bit easier to sell in the future.

Whats the exact build of the 2019 champion car, aside from an obviously great driver mod?

On the topic of the ProParts STX Megan coils

One, how do they compare the the BC BR coilovers (i'm sure they're better but just curious here)

& two, are there other coilovers that would be considered better than these and if so.. which ones at what price?

[strat61caster]

@SON1C per Tony's comment after mine that's pretty much the exact build, I know he and Teddie talked a bit about setting that car up but I don't know what Bryan did in the few events of tweaking they had. You would have to reach out on Facebook to get an exact build/setup, I'm just second hand and I don't believe either post here. When buying the ProParts setup you'll get a short rundown on Jeff and Nicole's baseline that was a very successful year they had.

MCS like on M0nk3ys car offer some benefits, imho riding in a few other cars mostly Street comfort when turned down and they soak up irregular pavement a more nicely than the Megan's on course, likely due to the digression they can offer. The extra knobs can also fine tune car behaviour at different phases of the corner if you're skilled enough to figure it out.
KWV3 can also turn down for more comfort but I haven't been in them at speed and I fear their damping profile might be limited and they're not revalveable. Gill has been using these for years and consistently trophied.
The Chang Lugod car is another option, he worked with Mann engineering to setup AST dampers but I believe that setup relies on the OS Giken diff moreso than the others, 5k/9k springs on that car, a bit different than the others which float closer to 7k square give or take 1k.
Feal had some success early on, but I don't know anybody who has them now.

At less than $2k the Megan's get you in with camber plates and end links and the right springs, at $3k you get none of those things with the MCS and the same single adjuster so you need to mentally add about $500-$700 to their sticker price once you decide how many knobs you want. Fwiw the Megan's are adaptable to spring rate changes and are a good platform to 'build up' imho if you decide you want the fancy diff and sway bar and header and tune. ProParts is also good to work with, I asked a couple questions last night and got a bunch of setup suggestions based on this past weekend. I think the meat of STX build falls in between $5k-$10k how far you want to go is up to you.

Edit: most are using a 22mm solid bar from Perrin but a 25.4mm hollow front is close from either Megan or Eibach. Stock rear is common as is the Mann engineering rear which offers two holes softer than stock.

[tony_r]

Pretty sure Teddie's car for 2019 was:
Proparts Megan's w/ different camber plates
17x9 w/ 245 Yoko
OFT custom tune & UEL
Front bar & endlinks

Camber plates were changed because sometimes the Megan ones don't work right (bearing gets all seized).

Megan and BC's are the same internally. Change out the shock oil & go.

[SON1C]

Originally Posted by tony_r

Pretty sure Teddie's car for 2019 was:
Proparts Megan's w/ different camber plates
17x9 w/ 245 Yoko
OFT custom tune & UEL
Front bar & endlinks

Camber plates were changed because sometimes the Megan ones don't work right (bearing gets all seized).

Megan and BC's are the same internally. Change out the shock oil & go.

Would you mind explaining the difference in the shock oil? & change it out to what?


Is it ever beneficial to run 255 over 245? or is the increase in tread negligible

What front bar and endlinks did he run and/or do you recommend?

[SON1C]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

@SON1C per Tony's comment after mine that's pretty much the exact build, I know he and Teddie talked a bit about setting that car up but I don't know what Bryan did in the few events of tweaking they had. You would have to reach out on Facebook to get an exact build/setup, I'm just second hand and I don't believe either post here. When buying the ProParts setup you'll get a short rundown on Jeff and Nicole's baseline that was a very successful year they had.

MCS like on M0nk3ys car offer some benefits, imho riding in a few other cars mostly Street comfort when turned down and they soak up irregular pavement a more nicely than the Megan's on course, likely due to the digression they can offer. The extra knobs can also fine tune car behaviour at different phases of the corner if you're skilled enough to figure it out.
KWV3 can also turn down for more comfort but I haven't been in them at speed and I fear their damping profile might be limited and they're not revalveable. Gill has been using these for years and consistently trophied.
The Chang Lugod car is another option, he worked with Mann engineering to setup AST dampers but I believe that setup relies on the OS Giken diff moreso than the others, 5k/9k springs on that car, a bit different than the others which float closer to 7k square give or take 1k.
Feal had some success early on, but I don't know anybody who has them now.

At less than $2k the Megan's get you in with camber plates and end links and the right springs, at $3k you get none of those things with the MCS and the same single adjuster so you need to mentally add about $500-$700 to their sticker price once you decide how many knobs you want. Fwiw the Megan's are adaptable to spring rate changes and are a good platform to 'build up' imho if you decide you want the fancy diff and sway bar and header and tune. ProParts is also good to work with, I asked a couple questions last night and got a bunch of setup suggestions based on this past weekend. I think the meat of STX build falls in between $5k-$10k how far you want to go is up to you.

Edit: most are using a 22mm solid bar from Perrin but a 25.4mm hollow front is close from either Megan or Eibach. Stock rear is common as is the Mann engineering rear which offers two holes softer than stock.

thanks for the lengthy reply, appreciate it

I remember reading about Feal a couple of years ago, but I fell off and.. seems like so did they lol xD

I don't want to turn my car into a money pit, but when I do build/replace things I want to use the competitive parts so I can blame my losses on myself rather than the car haha


STX seems to require 1 cat, currently my car is catless is there a concensus on the ideal cat location? ex. stock frontpipe or should I just weld a high flow one in at my point?

Also sorry for all the questions, long story short I built a street car basically, and looking to convert/revert some things to create a competitive STX build as it seems a good balance of performance/longevity with these cars & not a "massive" money pit

[steverife]

I think overlying theme is that you need certain things (more front bar rate, more spring rate, more camber, wider wheels, header/tune), but the specific parts are largely interchangeable and are going to depend on your budget/availability/etc.

ProParts takes the Megans as a donor and changes out the damper internals. Given the questions that you are asking, if you want to change shock oils, your best bet would be to order from ProParts. There is typically about a 3-4 week lead time.

Front sway bar. Karcepts makes a beautiful bar. It is designed around using MCS's, so may require some additional steps if you choose/have other dampers. The Perrin 22mm is good. Other solid 22mm or hollow 25.4mm bars work, too. The Karcepts bar comes with endlinks. The Megan coilovers come with endlinks. RacerX makes a beautiful product. You can piece together your own endlinks.

Most people seem to choose a catted front pipe.

[M0nk3y]

Originally Posted by SON1C

thanks for the lengthy reply, appreciate it

I remember reading about Feal a couple of years ago, but I fell off and.. seems like so did they lol xD

I don't want to turn my car into a money pit, but when I do build/replace things I want to use the competitive parts so I can blame my losses on myself rather than the car haha


STX seems to require 1 cat, currently my car is catless is there a concensus on the ideal cat location? ex. stock frontpipe or should I just weld a high flow one in at my point?

Also sorry for all the questions, long story short I built a street car basically, and looking to convert/revert some things to create a competitive STX build as it seems a good balance of performance/longevity with these cars & not a "massive" money pit

It sounds like you should take the time to read the Solo rules for Street Touring. Not trying to be a douche, but a lot of these questions are answered within the rulebook and it is pretty Black and White on if it's allowed (cliff notes, if it's not mentioned it's not allowed)

For the cat location, it has to be with 6" of OE location. You can consolidate 2 cats into one. So most people do catless header and have a cat in OE location where secondary resides.

[conehead]

The new Falken RT660 is now approved for SSC. The new tires are still cheap, but they aren't going to last as long, and that was a pretty big factor in keeping running costs low for SSC.

[racingfool]

Originally Posted by M0nk3y

(I'm also the stupid one that wastes money on their car)

Not stupid if it puts a smile on your face.

[Roadphantom]

Originally Posted by tony_r

Pretty sure Teddie's car for 2019 was:
Proparts Megan's w/ different camber plates
17x9 w/ 245 Yoko
OFT custom tune & UEL
Front bar & endlinks

Camber plates were changed because sometimes the Megan ones don't work right (bearing gets all seized).

Megan and BC's are the same internally. Change out the shock oil & go.

What kind of springrate were they on with the Proparts Megan?

Did you hear from Proparts that the Megan and BC Racing are the same internals?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

[tony_r]

Originally Posted by Roadphantom

What kind of springrate were they on with the Proparts Megan?

Did you hear from Proparts that the Megan and BC Racing are the same internals?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Same rate I had which was 6k/7k. They're made at the same factory. Might have slightly different valving but I doubt it.

[conehead]

Originally Posted by M0nk3y

So use the rear bar at it's stiffest position is NOT an optimized setup. You realize most people in STX either 1. Use OE Bar, 2. Install Mann Engineering rear Bar (which is softer than OE), or 3. Rip out and disconnect the rear bar.

We don't need to use massive rear bar to sacrifice grip to get the rear to rotate, as what you're required to do. The correct, conventional setup is that bar on soft. But in current form creates bind because no one who developed the rules thought that adjustment endlinks was a smart idea.

Necropost at this point, but this is misleading. There is no blanket answer for rear sway bars. It's one part of an interconnected system and depends on the rest of your setup. The only objective testing ive seen on this site suggests soft front with stiff rear. That is not typical for rwd cars, but it works and I have been winning with it in SSC. I am curious if allowing adjustable endlinks has changed the testing results though.

[steverife]

Originally Posted by conehead

Necropost at this point, but this is misleading. There is no blanket answer for rear sway bars. It's one part of an interconnected system and depends on the rest of your setup. The only objective testing ive seen on this site suggests soft front with stiff rear. That is not typical for rwd cars, but it works and I have been winning with it in SSC. I am curious if allowing adjustable endlinks has changed the testing results though.

You are speaking within the context of SSC. Kyle's point was that the SSC setup is compromised.

I haven't specifically talked to anyone about setup since I left the class, but I think most everyone is still running the rear bar stiff because of....drumroll please....

...the compromised setup. You use what you can to try to keep the car off the bump stops as much as possible.