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Engine Swaps Discussion of engine swaps.


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Old 09-18-2021, 04:46 PM   #351
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I'm pulling out all the brz stock harness and remaking them as I only have a short list of circuits remaining in the car. The canbus is going to be amazing. My question is on the jumper board it looks like they are missing a lot of inputs from the ECU (white Plugs) even though it is going into the oem ECU case. Seems like there should be more connections for the white plugs and I don't want to start ripping up the harnesses until I see the diagram

They have some plugs for a fuel pump relay or something. I donít know if other stuff is omitted. The Haltech might replace features. Iím not sure. We will have to wait and see.
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Old 09-18-2021, 04:49 PM   #352
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Might be wishful thinking - but really hoping the next gen 86 transmission both bolts right up to the car/this kit and also takes quite a bit more power. That would definitely encourage me to build a torque focused supercharged K engine...
Itíll likely bolt up, but the word is all they did was shot peening, so expect mild improvements in strength.
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Old 10-11-2021, 08:22 PM   #353
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So WITHOUT the k24 engine, the complete kpower kit to get only the components needed to k swap our cars and still have AC is $11530.

For reference, that’s more than I paid for my 2013 FRS five or so years ago.

I get that the cost of everything is way up. But, wow, that is a lot.
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Old 10-11-2021, 09:57 PM   #354
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^^ Most business owners don't understand volume pricing. They want to make back R&D within a certain time frame. Plus they are have all these other outside vendors actually make parts once they did the R&D thus raising cost.


Still though. I would buy. Get a chassis with a blown engine, throw this kit on with a built K24 and you kicking some Mustang a$$ at the first exit out of Cars&Coffee!
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Old 10-12-2021, 02:00 AM   #355
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So WITHOUT the k24 engine, the complete kpower kit to get only the components needed to k swap our cars and still have AC is $11530.

For reference, that’s more than I paid for my 2013 FRS five or so years ago.

I get that the cost of everything is way up. But, wow, that is a lot.
A supercharger kit is a supercharger, a cast manifold, a radiator, a pulley, an intake and some piping, and it is $5-6k. This is a cast manifold, a welded oil pan, an aluminum driveshaft, a billet trans adapter, a flywheel, billet fuel rail, ac kit, an engine wiring harness and sensors, a stand alone engine management system, etc. I could buy an entire old car with a supercharger on it for the price of a new supercharger kit, and that has always been the case way before the pandemic.

Engine swaps aren't cheap. They never were. You are looking at low volume, custom parts that are often made to high standards or would require tooling that is only affordable at high volume by manufactures.

With that said, the price isn't that bad for what you get, and you could build the kit how you want. That $11,530 price includes headers, an aluminum driveshaft, a lightweight flywheel, cold air intake and premium clutch kit. Price those items for a FA20 and you could be looking at $2k+, so now the true difference in price is $9500. Sell the FA20 for fair market value around $3500-4500 or $2500 for a fast sale, and now there is a difference of $5000-7000, and now we are in the price of a supercharger kit, except we are taking off a hundred pounds of weight. Now the price isn't looking so bad.

Yeah, the supercharger is capable of adding more power, but some may want a platform for less weight and more NA power. The K24 will probably outperform a supercharged 86 in CARB/base form, and it will be much more reliable doing it, and it will be cheaper and easier to service and replace. Again, this makes the money proposition more appealing. I'm not saying it is cheap; I'm just saying it isn't as bad as you imply.
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Old 10-12-2021, 08:38 PM   #356
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That $11,530 price includes headers, an aluminum driveshaft, a lightweight flywheel, cold air intake and premium clutch kit. Price those items for a FA20 and you could be looking at $2k+, so now the true difference in price is $9500. Sell the FA20 for fair market value around $3500-4500 or $2500 for a fast sale, and now there is a difference of $5000-7000, and now we are in the price of a supercharger kit, except we are taking off a hundred pounds of weight. Now the price isn't looking so bad.
This right here is what people need to see. Not "OMG 11k for a swap, I could buy a whole car for that". I could have bought several cars for the cost of my swap....
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Old 10-13-2021, 01:52 AM   #357
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This right here is what people need to see. Not "OMG 11k for a swap, I could buy a whole car for that". I could have bought several cars for the cost of my swap....
And actually the weight is more. Most supercharger kits add 50-60lbs, and this kit may drop around 140lbs, so 200lbs difference in weight.

Some of that difference could be made up on the supercharged car by adding light weight items, but that is extra money too, so again, the price doesnít seem so bad.
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Old 10-13-2021, 01:26 PM   #358
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I track my car, a lot. Actually “a lot” in an understatement. In a typical light month, I might have eighteen, 20-25 minute sessions on any one of the four “good” tracks we have in the PNW. During the peak of the season, I might be on track 5-6 weeks in a row.

When my engine popped this weekend, we estimated that it likely had over 30,000 track and commuting to the track miles on it.

For reference, at the Ridge, by the end of the season, I’m running consistently in the 1.57 with a few forays into 1.56 territory when I can get a clean lap in and not have to point anyone by which is almost never. On 225 R888R which are poor, but we’re sponsored so that’s the why. Not saying this to boast; there are many faster 86 drivers in the PNW. Rather, it’s data that my engine, whatever choice I make, will see a ton of g-forces and live in the 5k to redline RPM range.

I’ve been running a stock FA20 with a HKS header and OFT tune. The 4.56 rear diff was my most important mod.

The car came to me with an Innovate Supercharger. We promptly removed it and installed it on my friends BRZ. Coincidentally, his motor popped in the morning; mine in the afternoon.

I have ZERO interest in a supercharger, turbo or anything not NA.

My choices are between a built FA20 and the kswap. Element says that they have 10k+ race miles on their test car. Going that route would be cheaper and easier even adding their oil accumulator’s kit for protection.

BUT the 200 lbs weight savings and cheap and plentiful k24 engine availability is hugely appealing.

I don’t build motors, but I can do everything else that doesn’t require custom fabrication.

If I went the k route, I’d keep at least one engine on hand as a spare. I haven’t done it obviously, but once the k swap is complete, it looks like we could do a pull and replace of the engine is just a few hours. Like pop it during a Friday session and be ready to go again by Saturday morning. This is hugely appealing; do let me know if that’s fantasy.

That’s the discussion direction I would like comments on. Thank you.
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Old 10-14-2021, 05:38 PM   #359
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I emailed Kpower Industries today for a timeline on shipping the kits. Some people might have just ordered a few parts. Some people might have ordered most of the kit like me, where I ordered everything except the exhaust manifold, intake and clutch. Some people obviously ordered everything. I assumed someone who just ordering engine mounts or just ordering that and the trans adapter, for instance, would have already received those parts, but I have a feeling nothing has shipped. Has anyone seen parts on anyone's car from the internet or in person yet? Has anyone received anything yet?

I was told that they are waiting on a few items still. They said once they are ready to ship everything then they will start shipping partial orders too. Sounds like they are going to prioritize complete and large orders over small or individual-part orders, which is good; that is also consistent with how they only sell the Honda OEM parts like the RSX Type-S oil pump to people who have purchased their swap kits.

I was told they are working on the install guide. They purchased and assembled a new engine for their new shop car, which is on the lift and getting photographed for the install guide. I was told this should be finished in a week or two. I'm looking forward to seeing the guide just to see how everything comes together.

I'm hoping to receive the kit before the Thanksgiving holiday break, so I can work on installing the engine and transmission and maybe work on fabrication then. I won't be able to finish everything, including tuning, until my winter break.
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Old 10-14-2021, 05:51 PM   #360
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Funny you typed this up. I emailed them a day or so ago about a timeline for when they will start shipping as well. I for some reason had it in my head a 30-45 day window and not 45-60. Got just a general response they are hoping to get them out soon. The wait is excruciating.
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Old 10-14-2021, 08:38 PM   #361
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Funny you typed this up. I emailed them a day or so ago about a timeline for when they will start shipping as well. I for some reason had it in my head a 30-45 day window and not 45-60. Got just a general response they are hoping to get them out soon. The wait is excruciating.
It was released with a 45-60 day shipping time. I was expecting delays from there because I was originally told a mid July release, and that didn't happen, so I figured there would be more delays. Here is me saying 45-60 days:

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...&postcount=240

Realistically, they probably want many kits to ship all at once, so no one is left feeling bad that their kit is taking a lot longer than other people's kit, and this is probably why partial kits and small/individual orders haven't been fulfilled yet. Moreover, just going off their MO, I would expect closer to a 60-90 shipping time, and then expect 1-3 weeks for shipping depending on where someone lives in the world.

Like I said, I just hope I can get it before Thanksgiving, so I can get part of it installed, and then I hope I can get it before Christmas because I only have a six week break before I start my next semester of nursing school, and I won't have the time to finish the kit until summer break. That would be a huge bummer, but I joked earlier in this thread that I should just wait for a Christmas, holiday discount to order the kit because that is when it would probably ship anyways.
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Old 10-15-2021, 01:08 PM   #362
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Does anyone know if the current electronic package (wiring and ECU) works on a 17+ car? As well, does this swap retain factory traction control?
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Old 10-15-2021, 05:54 PM   #363
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Does anyone know if the current electronic package (wiring and ECU) works on a 17+ car? As well, does this swap retain factory traction control?

I think they are still confirming 17+ compatibility, but a quick email could confirm that. Luckily they respond in a respectable amount of time for any questions I have sent so far.



Factory traction control should be good to go regardless.
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Old 10-15-2021, 09:09 PM   #364
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Does anyone know if the current electronic package (wiring and ECU) works on a 17+ car? As well, does this swap retain factory traction control?
It works. It is only for manual transmission vehicles though.
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