Top Fuel / Voltex S2000 Does 51.762 at Tsukuba

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by Re_Invention

Well according to the WTAC 2015 rule book - open wheel, kit, and clubman vehicles are not allowed, so there's that.

Sideways, I'm going to offer some unsolicited advice.

There is no "we" or "they" following you into thread(s) facetiously - you're making a mountain out of a mole hill. Relax.

It isn't necessary to understand the rationale behind folks posting opinions which aren't positive reinforcement to the topic. It's great that it's happening and abusive censorship isn't occurring. Everyone has been respectful and on topic thus far, if people don't share your opinion or aren't sympathetic to your cause - doesn't matter - it's an automotive off-topic section of a car forum.

Thirdly, the ignore feature is fantastic to filter political differences - Buddha knows I use mine liberally.

Well, WTAC is just one track in Sydney, Australia. Anybody can come to Tsukuba and lap and have their times recorded whether they are adhering to the spirit of the various leagues like WTAC or not.

And I wasn't saying people are following me around, but I've had similar comments on previous threads about time attack cars. Personally, I find time attack far more interesting than wheel to wheel racing, because it's about pushing the limits of engineering and the driver putting down as near perfect of a lap as possible, where as wheel to wheel racing often involves luck, misfortune, being slowed down or taken out by other peoples' accidents, etc.... often things that are out of the hands of the driver... and budget still plays a huge role there too.

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

I like the car, I like the engineering and I like time attack. Still don't get it.

From a contextualized standpoint, I don't get calling what IT IS, a "production class". So the suspension pick up points, monocoque and dashboard are the same... Big whoop, nothing else is remotely "production". So maybe it's just the semantics I don't get but still.

It's like it answers a question nobody was asking. "Can we make an s2k do 51 sec laptime at tsukuba?"... Well, the answer is almost yes followed by, "how big is your bank account?". The only limits that are really being pushed are financial ones frankly.

It's so far gone from its original self that this record lends little to no credibility to the car it was built from... At least for me. I wonder what $150k fully bespok v8 Atom can do. As for it setting faster laptimes than a race car.. Well that's no surprise, race cars are built to maximize a rule set as opposed to maximizing 1 flying lap with unubtanium aero. So the race car comparison holds little water.

I'm just typing all this cuz I missed my flight and I'm trapped at the airport with little to keep me occupied.

You're missing the point. Many other higher end cars like Corvettes, GTRs, etc. are also free to compete in these events, and yet they often lose! They are free to spend just as much money, and many of them do. That's the point. Sure, it's expensive, but it shows how great cars like the S2K, Silvia, RX7, Evo, etc. are as PLATFORMS. It's just impressive. It's satisfying to see underdog cars show the full potential of their platforms and set awesome times.

And the racecar comparison holds a ton of water. For fuck's sake, they are purpose-built racecars developed by professional teams backed by huge companies with huge budgets, and they are on full racing slicks. I don't know how anyone could not find that impressive.

[Joakim3]

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

You're missing the point. Many other higher end cars like Corvettes, GTRs, etc. are also free to compete in these events, and yet they often lose! They are free to spend just as much money, and many of them do. That's the point. Sure, it's expensive, but it shows how great cars like the S2K, Silvia, RX7, Evo, etc. are as PLATFORMS. It's just impressive. It's satisfying to see underdog cars show the full potential of their platforms and set awesome times.

There cheap relatively small light weight cars.... what do you expect? Hell and those aren't even the best platforms. Get yourself a used caterham/atom, LS swap it, throw as much retarded aero as physically possible on it and there you go!

There platforms are good for this respective type of competition. It's the same way I wouldn't pick an S2000 over a Foxbody Stang if I wanted to compete in 1/4 drags.

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

And the racecar comparison holds a ton of water. For fuck's sake, they are purpose-built racecars developed by professional teams backed by huge companies with huge budgets, and they are on full racing slicks. I don't know how anyone could not find that impressive.

It's not that it's not impressive in what it's capable of doing..... but the fact is you cannot compare time attack car to a racecar that has to adhere to regulations despite how similar they look (i.e F1 vs Indy).

Let me put it this way....

If you allowed lets say Ferrari racing with it's full budget to just "have a go" at time attack for a season and see the damage, you'd end up with a car that looks like this (with some wheel covers because "rules")



... and that would run circles around any F1 car and require a G-Suit to drive, but the reason you don't is because current F1 is more regulated than an death row inmate locked up in a American prison




When it comes to this type of racing (i.e no rules and go balls to the wall), bigger budget = winning

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by Joakim3

There cheap relatively small light weight cars.... what do you expect? Hell and those aren't even the best platforms. Get yourself a used caterham/atom, LS swap it, throw as much retarded aero as physically possible on it and there you go!

It's not that simple. If lightweight + a torquey v8 was everything, you'd see LSx Miatas beating these cars, but they don't.

Originally Posted by Joakim3

There platforms are good for this respective type of competition. It's the same way I wouldn't pick an S2000 over a Foxbody Stang if I wanted to compete in 1/4 drags.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyCugGQCfNU"]Worlds FASTEST Honda S2000 - 7.17 @ 192.92!!! - YouTube[/ame]

[Joakim3]

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

It's not that simple. If lightweight + a torquey v8 was everything, you'd see LSx Miatas beating these cars, but they don't.

Do those people running those cars have the same budget as Voltex? If the answer is anything other than yes, then the point your making is moot.

Voltex is sponsored by evasive motorsport... relative to this type of auto racing (where a lot of the cars are independently funded rather than sponsored) they have very deep pockets, which is necessary to develop aero for cars

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tSE9Vz2gak"]World Fastest Mustang 6.57 @ 227 - YouTube[/ame]

Your point? anything can be made to go fast, it's just a lot easier do so in a stang than it is in a S2000

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by Joakim3

Do those people running those cars have the same budget as Voltex? If the answer is anything other than yes, then the point your making is moot.

Voltex is sponsored by evasive motorsport... relative to this type of auto racing (where a lot of the cars are independently funded rather than sponsored) they have very deep pockets, which is necessary to develop aero for cars

Like I said earlier, look at the Scorch Racing S15 or the MCA Hammerhead S13 (before the full carbon body in the new s13, which helped them cut only a second off their time @ Sydney). Both are top tier cars. One is built by a privateer, and the other a very small team. Money helps, but money isn't everything. The fact is these guys choose the platforms they do for a reason. Miatas are cheap as hell. If they thought it would be as good of a platform, they would use one. Like I said, you can exaggerate and say money is everything and stuffing a v8 in the lightest chassis you can find would equal the same results, but you would be wrong or else there would be proof. End of story.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

You're missing the point.

I concur. Missing the point is much the same as "not getting it" of which I have stated.

If someone said: "I saw a car do a 51 second lap time at Tsukuba!". I'd say wow! Then if they told me, it had 150+k worth of development and the square foot aerodynamic equivalent of an upside down crop duster then I'd be like.. "Oh, well that makes sense then."

Sideways, don't fret that I enjoy something I don't understand. Accepting that reality, that you can enjoy things without having to understand them, makes life a lot easier to enjoy.

[Tim Radley]

To put the lap time into context, here are production car lap times.
http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/tsukuba
Some of these cars cost considerably more money than that little S2000 even with all it's development. Yet they are a world apart on lap time. Nismo GT-R for example, a whole 10 seconds slower.
Hats off to the team for pulling a lap time like that, its nothing short of phenomenal.