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FR-S / BRZ vs.... Area to discuss the FR-S/BRZ against its competitors [NO STREET RACING]


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Old 07-21-2014, 09:02 PM   #85
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It's my favorite car that I've ever owned, and that includes star studded list of cars like the NSX, FD RX-7, 300ZXTT, S2000, M3, M Coupe, etc.

It needs a little more power, but few cars have given me as much confidence and are as enjoyable to drive.
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Old 07-21-2014, 11:35 PM   #86
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It's my favorite car that I've ever owned, and that includes star studded list of cars like the NSX, FD RX-7, 300ZXTT, S2000, M3, M Coupe, etc.

It needs a little more power, but few cars have given me as much confidence and are as enjoyable to drive.
Better than the NSX, RX7, and S2000?! Were they broken? :P
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Old 07-22-2014, 01:17 PM   #87
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Want more power, don't want to void warranty so early in the cars life.

Having to wait so long to give her the power she should have had off the lot is my biggest regret.
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Old 07-22-2014, 01:40 PM   #88
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Want more power, don't want to void warranty so early in the cars life.





Having to wait so long to give her the power she should have had off the lot is my biggest regret.


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70552
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Old 07-22-2014, 03:01 PM   #89
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Everything about this car is brilliant except for the engine. If you can live with that you'll love this car. Unfortunately the engine is the beating heart of a car for most of us so it's difficult to overlook. Others' opinions may vary, but a 2 liter engine that redlines at 7400 rpm is not "high revving" to me, so I dislike seeing that adjective used to describe the FA20. Regardless of how it is come by, 200 hp is nothing special these days, given how portly all cars are becoming. 200 hp in this car would be easier to accept, however, if the engine was 1) more reliable and 2) actually sounded good at high rpm (subjective). I think given the (hypothetical) choice most people would prefer to have a K20 under the hood.

When I owned one I thought the amazing handling would offset the power deficiency. But it bothered me way too much so I supercharged it. Car was much, much better but unfortunately I soon thereafter totaled her. At that point I didn't feel like buying another one and adding forced induction again so I moved on. I'd be lying if I said I didn't miss the car at times though.

I think if this car had come with a 2.5 liter engine it would be close to perfect (assuming similar hp/liter ratio and redline). With 200 hp and a forgettable engine the FT86 has a glaring fault, that I fear it may never overcome.
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Old 07-23-2014, 10:29 AM   #90
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Shame about the engine. Why couldn't they go with a Toyota Celica GTS engine like the Elise.
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Old 07-23-2014, 10:40 AM   #91
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Shame about the engine. Why couldn't they go with a Toyota Celica GTS engine like the Elise.
Probably the same reasons the k20 was killed off -- emissions and fuel economy. Regardless, I wouldn't want the torqueless 1.8L 180hp GTS engine in a car as heavy as the FR-S/BRZ.

Maybe a K24 or something else in the 2.4-2.5L range.
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Old 07-23-2014, 11:23 AM   #92
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The only reason why I asked about the GTS engine is because of Subaru's partnership with Toyota. Subaru hasn't made a reliable engine since 06.
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Old 07-23-2014, 11:37 AM   #93
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The only reason why I asked about the GTS engine is because of Subaru's partnership with Toyota. Subaru hasn't made a reliable engine since 06.
Yeah I agree, it would be most practical if it was an engine from their existing range. The GTS engine would likely be a no-go for emissions and fuel economy reasons, and I wouldn't want a 180hp, 1.8L non-DI engine anyway.

Subaru currently has a 2.5L engine in their Forester, but only making 170 hp and not sure how easily that would slot in or how it would affect weight/handling/balance, or what it would take to get 200+ hp out of it. Can't think of an existing engine from Toyota that would be ideal either.
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Old 07-23-2014, 05:52 PM   #94
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The engine gets a lot of shit but all the alternatives really don't live up to it in some aspect, the Honda K20 and Toyota GTS wouldn't pass emissions standards and got mediocre at best fuel economy, the idea of a 6 or 8 would add noticeable cost both in terms of $$ and weight (likely a beefed up powertrain).

The only two options available imo for this car to be more powerful stock would be either FI or larger displacement. FI was thrown out due to character reasons from the engineering team, there's definitely a cost factor there of at least a couple thousand dollars worth of parts, tooling, R&D, reliability testing, meeting emissions. Larger displacement would have increased the cost of around 2/3's of the units due to taxes on engine displacement, likely to the point where it would have hurt sales, I don't need to link the articles about how the European arm of Toyota isn't impressed with the sales as it is citing it isn't powerful enough for the price.

Hopefully I'll get the chance to try the WRX with the FA20DIT in the next month or two, maybe that is all the car needs I have a hunch it may not have the same playfulness though...
@WolfpackS2k in the broad spectrum of motors, yes 7,400 rpm is kind of old hat but if you take 'high-revving' or 'rev-happy' to be a descriptor of character and less based on paper stats I think it's very applicable to most people's definitions. The thing really doesn't come online until you're over 5k rpm, you could own this car forever only hitting 4,000 rpm and think it's the biggest farce to hit showrooms in the last decade, it feels like a boring tin-can of a Toyota at regular cruising speeds and rpms and I have a hunch that's why so many people felt underwhelmed.

It's really easy to test drive this car, wait for a hole in traffic and put your foot down in third gear and nothing at all interesting happens, meanwhile in the Mustang you can test drive not three blocks away you'll get pushed back in your seat hear a nice grumble and make the salesman a bit nervous.

Sure the engine's a snoozefest under 5k rpm but I can't think of anything that could realistically do a better job.
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Old 07-23-2014, 05:58 PM   #95
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Not concerned about the engine's power but it's reliability. I guess I'm just spoiled by the s2ks F22 engine. The s2k ruined cars for me. Now the only cars that compare have a +$70k price tag (new).

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Old 07-23-2014, 06:03 PM   #96
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The 2ZZ-GE wasn't the most reliable engine either. I think that title is reserved for Honda 4-cylinders. Yes, I would probably be happy with a K20 in this car.

At least a 7800 rpm redline would be nice though. I figure if the rods and valvetrain were strong enough to withstand higher RPMs, yet it kept the powerband characteristic of an E85-tuned FA20, there would be few complaints.
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For that price anyone could get a c6z and have money for a simple heads cam package and make a bunch more power and have a superior handling car. This seems overpriced to say the least. "Have it your way" is basically offering someone a massive dildo to shove up their ass BUT they have the option of choosing the method in which it is inserted....
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Old 07-23-2014, 06:29 PM   #97
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Old 07-23-2014, 07:36 PM   #98
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I want another s-chassis. Maybe it's the community or maybe it's the fact that it's a new car and the parts all carry new-car prices but I'm getting bored. Dreadfully bored. There's only so many things you can do to your car when you're married and have to pay for a house in San Diego. I am by no means rich...I just know that the money I spend/spent on this car would go lightyears further on an s-chassis and QUALITY parts for it. I also wouldn't feel as bad about tracking it or sliding it. I'm intimidated by it being a new.

I just wasn't meant for these times man, I swear.
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