Any Crypto fans here?

[IceFyre13th]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

Haha it's ok, let the adults talk. We don't need you do get it.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

Trust me I get it....



You have no FDIC protections.


You can be hacked, personally or even in any one of those "crypto-vault" things



You could forget your password / lose your encryption key


But the kicker is, its vapor-ware, not real money, just a promise of "money" that cost real money to get......or electricity if your a "farm" (and the cost of video cards).


Some even think (not me) its the harbinger for the return of the beast (666 and all that, or a cool Iron Maiden song).


Bottom line is, at least in my opinion, its a pyramid scheme. Someone at the top is getting stupid rich, the people below are going to lose their shirts when the pyramid comes crashing down.



But now its virtual, all smoke and mirrors with a few who will do OK and the rest getting hosed.


Your money, not mine, waste it as you will...........

[Milhouse86]

Who else was SHOCKED by Domino's pizza!!!!

[Milhouse86]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I get the analogy, but the same typically doesn't happen if you lose your wallet, and the thief uses your bank card. In most situations, the bank will return the money. I have had fraudulent charges on my bank cards and credit cards multiple times in my life, and every single time the bank closed the car and refunded me my money, or they didn't make me responsible for paying off the fraudulent purchases on my credit card.

The other thing about your analogy is typically people aren't storing large sums of cash in their wallet or their life savings in their wallet, but people do store large sums of money in cryptocurrency or their life savings in cryptocurrency, which is not protected from theft the same way I described above, correct? That is what I am asking.

I feel like banks are federally insured, and my money is safe. I feel like the stock market can go up and down, but my 401k or Roth IRA can't be stolen. By its very nature, isn't cryptocurrency like carrying or storing large sums of cash, and if so, isn't that the reason people secured money in banks in the first place because the money was safer in a bank than in a mattress or a home safe?

https://nypost.com/2019/04/13/hacker...ike-big-shots/

Yes its more like losing the cash in your wallet. Zero doubt its more risky now. DO NOT SINK ALL YOU MONEY IN IT OR ANY OTHER ASSET CLASS.

I am a high risk high reward kind of person. I just spend an enormous amount of time to educate myself along the way and take educated measured risk.

Some of the "centrally controlled" operations do have insurance on crypto funds now but only the crypto held on their system. The true "decentralized" platforms are a lot riskier and I keep very little capital there.

Blockfi has FDIC insurance on US dollar holdings and insurance on crypto holdings.


BTW I am a big real estate guy and my total cryptocurrency investments are less then 10% of my net worth. I went heavy into it but I am not dumb.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

If I could buy my morning coffee at the gas station with it, I think that would be a huge hurdle jumped. I understand computers and do appreciate the amount of "work" (by processors) that goes into it. However, I don't think the average human [insert George Carlin video about average stupidity] is going to see any value in it until they can use to get something they can hold in their hand without going onto the dark web. I shouldn't even say stupid because honestly until it's treated as a legit currency it's just a hobby with value only to those who want to play that game. And when it was bitcoin alone I would (and was made some money) buy into it but now even though it is seemingly on a short term upswing there are just too many other cryptos out there. What if Dogecoin or whatever becomes the currency you can buy a soda at 7-11 with? Bitcoin goes to zero. That plus the threat of being personally hacked, forgetting the password, the hardrive going bad, or quantum computers smashing encryption at record pace... they just all threaten the long term value of it. I think I'll stick to real estate even though I have clean up after people every couple years.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

I agree, and I remember watching a video talking about how companies were putting the words blockchain in front of their name/stock, whether they were a cryptocurrency or whether they were making toilet paper, and stocks were surging. Even one guy made up a cryptocurrency with a ridiculous name like GIJoeBlockchainCrypto or something, as a joke, and the coin/stock/whatever was surging because of buyers wanting to get in on early, cheap currencies before they surged, so the guy started acting like, "well shit, this could go somewhere...oh yeah, yeah, we are legit...this wasn't a joke."

I would love to invest early in something, anything, then have it blow up in value, but I'm just not the type of person who gambles with money. I also don't day trade or flip stocks constantly. I'm sure a smarter person could figure things out, but then again, I look at guys like Jim Cramer, and I ask, if I did nothing but follow all his advice, would I be rich? I don't know, but he is probably smarter than me about picking successful stocks, yet I have seen many articles say that following his advice would be a wash or worse. This tells me that playing stocks, like playing crypotcurrency, is like gambling, at least at my level, and I don't gamble.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/a-stati...s-skill-level/

[p1l0t]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

Good point! But here is the best part! I put gas in my car with Bitcoin yesterday. Check out the Crypto .com debit card. I get 3% "Cash back" paid in crypto. The crypto i am paid in is up 200% this year and they tripled the users to 3 million world wide. Anywhere visa is accepted. It needs improvement but its getting good.

See we don't remember when the car was slower then horses, more expensive, did not work as well on the dirt/mud roads, hard to find gas to fill up..... until the infrastructure is built new tech seems silly.

Development in the crypto space is blowing up right now. Not really ready for mainstream yet but I think its coming next year to some degree regardless.

And the use case for blockchain is MUCH wider then just use as money. That's a pretty boring use in my opinion.

https://www.investopedia.com/news/ho...g-real-estate/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/emilsay.../#7bd286994aad

Its not just nerds in there basement anymore. Did you know that 97% of all bitcoin sold today is in the profit?? Investors look for the fastest horse in the race and for the past decade nothing has outclassed Bitcoin. (Disclaimer - Not sold on a $1 million per bitcoin price in 5 years personally. The cycles are getting longer and decreasing in % swing from bottom to top.)

https://www.forbes.com/sites/billyba.../#694f6fc8157d

You still need go manually sell your crypto before spending it. That's not different than me selling some off my Robinhood account and using my Robinhood debit card.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

Who else was SHOCKED by Domino's pizza!!!!

People be trading in Domino's is like people be trading in tulips.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

Really though, their revenue is in the billions, so their stock is legit. How can one of the worst pizzas have the most revenue, regardless of stock? Then again, the top performing chains are all crap pizza selling in volume franchises, but Domino's is even doing better than Pizza Hut with less locations, so I guess we gotta give it to them.

I just don't eat fast food or in restaurant chains, but I guess a lot of people do.

[Milhouse86]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I agree, and I remember watching a video talking about how companies were putting the words blockchain in front of their name/stock, whether they were a cryptocurrency or whether they were making toilet paper, and stocks were surging. Even one guy made up a cryptocurrency with a ridiculous name like GIJoeBlockchainCrypto or something, as a joke, and the coin/stock/whatever was surging because of buyers wanting to get in on early, cheap currencies before they surged, so the guy started acting like, "well shit, this could go somewhere...oh yeah, yeah, we are legit...this wasn't a joke."

I would love to invest early in something, anything, then have it blow up in value, but I'm just not the type of person who gambles with money. I also don't day trade or flip stocks constantly. I'm sure a smarter person could figure things out, but then again, I look at guys like Jim Cramer, and I ask, if I did nothing but follow all his advice, would I be rich? I don't know, but he is probably smarter than me about picking successful stocks, yet I have seen many articles say that following his advice would be a wash or worse. This tells me that playing stocks, like playing crypotcurrency, is like gambling, at least at my level, and I don't gamble.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/a-stati...s-skill-level/

Yah day trading or timing the market is not a great strategy. I always recommend Dollar Cost averaging into a position and Laddering out at set targets. Bitcoin is just a hard money, like gold. It's a hedge and even the worst time to start is profitable. How many investments do that?

https://cointelegraph.com/news/inves...e-a-618-return

As long as you are not in cash and own assets you are protected from the Fed printing dollars at unprecedented rates.

How much do you trust the bankers that created this debt system with ever increasing bubbles? In 2008 people lost their minds at $800 billion in stimulus. We just did $3 trillion and are gonna double down. I'm not a dooms day person but I like to hedge my bets.

[WildCard600]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

Yah day trading or timing the market is not a great strategy. I always recommend Dollar Cost averaging into a position and Laddering out at set targets. Bitcoin is just a hard money, like gold. It's a hedge and even the worst time to start is profitable. How many investments do that?

https://cointelegraph.com/news/inves...e-a-618-return

As long as you are not in cash and own assets you are protected from the Fed printing dollars at unprecedented rates.

How much do you trust the bankers that created this debt system with ever increasing bubbles? In 2008 people lost their minds at $800 billion in stimulus. We just did $3 trillion and are gonna double down. I'm not a dooms day person but I like to hedge my bets.

Money printer go BRRRRRRR

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I get the analogy, but the same typically doesn't happen if you lose your wallet, and the thief uses your bank card.

Well.... that's why I said cash, not credit/debit cards, but maybe what you are saying is that you can lose your wallet with no impact with the right protections.

[p1l0t]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

Yah day trading or timing the market is not a great strategy. I always recommend Dollar Cost averaging into a position and Laddering out at set targets. Bitcoin is just a hard money, like gold. It's a hedge and even the worst time to start is profitable. How many investments do that?

https://cointelegraph.com/news/inves...e-a-618-return

As long as you are not in cash and own assets you are protected from the Fed printing dollars at unprecedented rates.

How much do you trust the bankers that created this debt system with ever increasing bubbles? In 2008 people lost their minds at $800 billion in stimulus. We just did $3 trillion and are gonna double down. I'm not a dooms day person but I like to hedge my bets.

Problem is it's not a hedge either. It seems to move with the market rather than against it.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

Yah day trading or timing the market is not a great strategy. I always recommend Dollar Cost averaging into a position and Laddering out at set targets. Bitcoin is just a hard money, like gold. It's a hedge and even the worst time to start is profitable. How many investments do that?

https://cointelegraph.com/news/inves...e-a-618-return

As long as you are not in cash and own assets you are protected from the Fed printing dollars at unprecedented rates.

How much do you trust the bankers that created this debt system with ever increasing bubbles? In 2008 people lost their minds at $800 billion in stimulus. We just did $3 trillion and are gonna double down. I'm not a dooms day person but I like to hedge my bets.

That is what I don't get, obviously if the dollar drops in value or the economy dives then stocks dive, but I'm sure Bitcoin's value will also drop. How is it special? People always say they need to buy gold or silver when the stocks start to drop, as if it is protected from a market collapse. Like yes, gold will always bounce back and Telsa or Apple stock could have been destroyed, but isn't that just an argument to diversify? I mean, it isn't like a bar of gold is going to buy anyone anything if food and water was scarce in an apocalypse; it only holds value as long as people give it value. I'm rambling, but I guess I just don't see how the rewards outweighs the risks for me.

[Milhouse86]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

That is what I don't get, obviously if the dollar drops in value or the economy dives then stocks dive, but I'm sure Bitcoin's value will also drop. How is it special? People always say they need to buy gold or silver when the stocks start to drop, as if it is protected from a market collapse. Like yes, gold will always bounce back and Telsa or Apple stock could have been destroyed, but isn't that just an argument to diversify? I mean, it isn't like a bar of gold is going to buy anyone anything if food and water was scarce in an apocalypse; it only holds value as long as people give it value. I'm rambling, but I guess I just don't see how the rewards outweighs the risks for me.

No your actually hitting the main argument right on.

So blockchain is just a ledger. Every 10 min give or take a new "block" is created. That block is just a list of the transactions on the network. Every movement is tracked.

Every computer on the network is constantly verifying the validity of every transaction on the network. For completing these blocks miners are rewarded with Bitcoin.

There will only ever be 21 million Bitcoin. Hard cap, unlike the dollar or even gold. That is why Bitcoin is concerned the hardest of money.

If you study the history of what is called fiat currency or any paper money then you know that every currency controlled by people or more appropriately Bankers has failed. Mainly through banker greed and debit. The United States has had over 8,000 failed currency's. The dollar was only created in 1913 along with the fed and the IRS so you had to go collect dollars to pay the tax man.

So the theory is that Bitcoin has value because we can verify where each Bitcoin is. But not just where each Bitcoin is. One Bitcoin can be broken into 100 million pieces or satoshis. At any point you can go and look at the blockchain and verify where each Satoshi is.

And well yes something only has value if people believe in it. You have thousands and thousands of computers supporting this network. Even Goldman Sachs earlier this year admitted to that after the Corona virus crash the fact that Bitcoin was the first asset back to even shows its store of value.

To understand the scale of the computational power being used on the network to support this The network is doing over 25 quadrillion equations per second. There's about seven quadrillion grains of sand estimated on Earth.


Sorry if I missed anything. I wrote half that waiting in a parking lot but it's a high level overview. I'll re-read it tonight and might expand if I shorted something.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Milhouse86

No your actually hitting the main argument right on.

So blockchain is just a ledger. Every 10 min give or take a new "block" is created. That block is just a list of the transactions on the network. Every movement is tracked.

Every computer on the network is constantly verifying the validity of every transaction on the network. For completing these blocks miners are rewarded with Bitcoin.

There will only ever be 21 million Bitcoin. Hard cap, unlike the dollar or even gold. That is why Bitcoin is concerned the hardest of money.

If you study the history of what is called fiat currency or any paper money then you know that every currency controlled by people or more appropriately Bankers has failed. Mainly through banker greed and debit. The United States has had over 8,000 failed currency's. The dollar was only created in 1913 along with the fed and the IRS so you had to go collect dollars to pay the tax man.

So the theory is that Bitcoin has value because we can verify where each Bitcoin is. But not just where each Bitcoin is. One Bitcoin can be broken into 100 million pieces or satoshis. At any point you can go and look at the blockchain and verify where each Satoshi is.

And well yes something only has value if people believe in it. You have thousands and thousands of computers supporting this network. Even Goldman Sachs earlier this year admitted to that after the Corona virus crash the fact that Bitcoin was the first asset back to even shows its store of value.

To understand the scale of the computational power being used on the network to support this The network is doing over 25 quadrillion equations per second. There's about seven quadrillion grains of sand estimated on Earth.


Sorry if I missed anything. I wrote half that waiting in a parking lot but it's a high level overview. I'll re-read it tonight and might expand if I shorted something.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

I don't really understand what you mean by failed currencies. Currency older than 1913 is still legal tender, and in fact, the coins I have in my collection are worth more than their face value in trade. Currency failed or evolved? This needs more explanation because the way you said failed currency seems like I could use it in the same sentence like this: every generation of every model car that was ever created has failed.

[IceFyre13th]