Are components worth the investment?

[Cmeehleib5280]

I already have most of my set up.
I have a sub and amp in the trunk. As well as a 4 channel amp powering the stock door speakers and 4 inch speakers in the dash. And an Audison bit10 processor installed also.

I would like to replace my stock system.
I am torn between getting some quality components or just getting better coaxial door speakers and upgrading the 4" speakers in the dash and running them with my amp and processor.

I'm no car audio expert so would someone be able to tell me which would be the better route?

I figure my second option should be much cheaper than getting components.

Would the components make a big difference?

[soundman98]

i don't have a confident answer for either side of that question.

generally speaking, component sets will have better quality crossovers then their coaxial counterparts, but there are 'convertible coaxials' that have some of those better quality parts, though i've never been a big fan of any of the convertible speakers on the market..

so i guess the above point is one in favor of components..

in favor of coaxials, keeping the mid and tweeter together reduces the area that sound is being emitted from, which will make for a better sonic image of the audio.

the main advantage to components is being able to separate the tweeter from the mid-- in the case of these cars, that would mean that you could mount the tweeter under the grille by the 4" speaker.. maybe this is an advantage, maybe it's not-- i'm not exactly clear what you're going for with your install.

what is the bit10 used for in your setup? oem integration?

[Cmeehleib5280]

Originally Posted by soundman98

i don't have a confident answer for either side of that question.

generally speaking, component sets will have better quality crossovers then their coaxial counterparts, but there are 'convertible coaxials' that have some of those better quality parts, though i've never been a big fan of any of the convertible speakers on the market..

so i guess the above point is one in favor of components..

in favor of coaxials, keeping the mid and tweeter together reduces the area that sound is being emitted from, which will make for a better sonic image of the audio.

the main advantage to components is being able to separate the tweeter from the mid-- in the case of these cars, that would mean that you could mount the tweeter under the grille by the 4" speaker.. maybe this is an advantage, maybe it's not-- i'm not exactly clear what you're going for with your install.

what is the bit10 used for in your setup? oem integration?

I'm looking to try and get my car to have some sort of "studio" sound. I just want it to be able to get loud but mostly clarity, cleanliness and sound quality. I want to be able to hear as much detail and frequencies I can.
Right now the bit 10 is mostly used for time alignment. As least that's what the installer told me

[wheelhaus]

I would say they are a good investment if your system has the capacity to actually utilize them. (edit- The bit 10 allows for exactly this). Having coaxial door drivers and separate midrange drivers in the dash creates essentially the same problem that can be more or less resolved with proper DSP TA and EQ, but it's an odd arrangement.. I've never liked the tweeters to be low in the doors, highs are so directional that when someone is in the passenger seat (or even my own leg) gets in the way of the soundwave, it really changes the stage. Mids are less affected by obstruction, so the OEM door location is fine.

So my personal preference is components (at least a decent 2-way- mid woofer and tweeter), with the highs approximately dash/mid dash high as to not be obstructed, and then everything time aligned on individual channels.

[Cmeehleib5280]

Originally Posted by wheelhaus

I would say they are a good investment if your system has the capacity to actually utilize them. (edit- The bit 10 allows for exactly this). Having coaxial door drivers and separate midrange drivers in the dash creates essentially the same problem that can be more or less resolved with proper DSP TA and EQ, but it's an odd arrangement.. I've never liked the tweeters to be low in the doors, highs are so directional that when someone is in the passenger seat (or even my own leg) gets in the way of the soundwave, it really changes the stage. Mids are less affected by obstruction, so the OEM door location is fine.

So my personal preference is components (at least a decent 2-way- mid woofer and tweeter), with the highs approximately dash/mid dash high as to not be obstructed, and then everything time aligned on individual channels.

Thanks for your answer!

Would you recommend upgrading the stock tweeters and keeping them where the stock tweeters are located?

Should I get components and replace the 4" speakers? Or just look for some components?

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by Cmeehleib5280

I'm looking to try and get my car to have some sort of "studio" sound. I just want it to be able to get loud but mostly clarity, cleanliness and sound quality. I want to be able to hear as much detail and frequencies I can.
Right now the bit 10 is mostly used for time alignment. As least that's what the installer told me

then i would recommend that you should consider component speakers, and run them as full active off the 4 channel amp, ditching the rear excuses, er, speakers in the process.

[Cmeehleib5280]

Originally Posted by soundman98

then i would recommend that you should consider component speakers, and run them as full active off the 4 channel amp, ditching the rear excuses, er, speakers in the process.

Sounds good thanks!
I'm already doing that with the stock speakers. The rears are just an afterthought haha

[wheelhaus]

Originally Posted by Cmeehleib5280

Thanks for your answer!

Would you recommend upgrading the stock tweeters and keeping them where the stock tweeters are located?

Should I get components and replace the 4" speakers? Or just look for some components?

You have a lot of options. I went the simple route (2-way set) and placed a component tweeter in the 4" location (made a custom bracket), and placed the mid woofers (6.5") in the doors with 3/4" spacers. Deadener was also added to the doors, but admittedly, not enough.

I use a 4.1ch amp to drive everything (1-4 for mains and tweeters, and the mono channel for the subs). Everything is XO'd EQ'd and TA'd from the head unit (Pioneer DEH-80PRS) which is kinda nice, since I have a single point of interface for everything. It all sounds rich and clear, with the stage centered just right of the steering wheel somewhere over the dash.

You don't need 4" drivers in the mix unless you really want them. THey certainly can help, but not critical. More of a preference I think. You could run 4" with the tweeters with a separate crossover module (post amp), but treat them as a single channel. This works well if they're side-by side, they sound like a single driver. You could build pods for better directional control. You could build the 4" into the doors. If the 4" are placed too far apart from the tweeters, you'll probably want to TA them separately as their own pair of channels.

[soundman98]

^+1 to all of it. planning on using the same hu because of it's feature set. i came from a car-computer controlled full active setup, and this hu is going to be my first foray back into the hu world in 4 years... i left because i was tired of the extra expense, and limited options(my last deck was a pioneer p7500 with t/a that no matter how i set it gave me a headache in 10 minutes, and modified high-bitrate media to sound like low-bitrate conversions).. so far, i've heard good things about the 80prs, and i really hope they are all true..

if you're considering going to a 3-way active setup, try to demo a 3-way setup somewhere before going through with it.

i demoed a hertz mille 2way/3way setup side by side a couple years ago, and found that i wasn't crazy about how the 3way setup seems to enhance the upper midrange of vocals.. it made vocals seem oddly deep all the time, even with higher-pitched female vocals

[wheelhaus]

Originally Posted by soundman98

.. so far, i've heard good things about the 80prs, and i really hope they are all true..

It's a solid head unit (besides the cheapish feeling faceplate) but the auto TA can be a little off, I personally think it's the difference between where the mic is placed vs. your actual ears in the listening space. If/when you go this route, try placing the mic in different places on the head rest, low, center, high, left/right until you find a spot that creates the most accurate stage for your preferred seating position. I just slapped it dead center and ran with it, but occasionally thought it wasn't quite there. After a few attempts, I found I had to go high center on the headrest, and it was like a switch was flipped on and suddenly all was right with the world...

[Cmeehleib5280]

Originally Posted by soundman98

i demoed a hertz mille 2way/3way setup side by side a couple years ago, and found that i wasn't crazy about how the 3way setup seems to enhance the upper midrange of vocals.. it made vocals seem oddly deep all the time, even with higher-pitched female vocals

I was actually considering those. I have yet to here them though. I'm glad you mentioned them. I was also considering the JL Audio C5s. Any thoughts on those?

[thill]

Originally Posted by Cmeehleib5280

I was actually considering those. I have yet to here them though. I'm glad you mentioned them. I was also considering the JL Audio C5s. Any thoughts on those?

I am running C5's in my WRX and had Hybrid Audio Imagine series in my BRZ. I actually prefer the sound of the C5. I find them to be very neutral sounding (the Hybrid Audio speakers were just a tad too bright for me). The JL's do need decent power to sound their best though so you will want to make sure you are powering them with a 100 watt @4 ohm RMS per channel amp. They are also pricey, but I found mine brand new on Ebay for just under $300. Honestly the cheaper JL component speakers sounded pretty good to me as well.

I would try to demo some different speakers. You will get lots of opinions and usually people will recommend what they own My installer was really pushing Hertz speakers on me, but I really liked the JL C5's, just not at the price he was quoting me (MSRP).

[Cmeehleib5280]

Originally Posted by thill

I am running C5's in my WRX and had Hybrid Audio Imagine series in my BRZ. I actually prefer the sound of the C5. I find them to be very neutral sounding (the Hybrid Audio speakers were just a tad too bright for me). The JL's do need decent power to sound their best though so you will want to make sure you are powering them with a 100 watt @4 ohm RMS per channel amp. They are also pricey, but I found mine brand new on Ebay for just under $300. Honestly the cheaper JL component speakers sounded pretty good to me as well.

I would try to demo some different speakers. You will get lots of opinions and usually people will recommend what they own My installer was really pushing Hertz speakers on me, but I really liked the JL C5's, just not at the price he was quoting me (MSRP).

Did you get to 2-way or 3 way C5s
I also have been getting the Hertz pushed on me by my installer. But the prices are way up there.
I've heard the C3s and I thought they sounded good.
I want to listen to the JLs and hertz a little more before I decide.
I just wish they were at the same retailer haha

[thill]

Originally Posted by Cmeehleib5280

Did you get to 2-way or 3 way C5s
I also have been getting the Hertz pushed on me by my installer. But the prices are way up there.
I've heard the C3s and I thought they sounded good.
I want to listen to the JLs and hertz a little more before I decide.
I just wish they were at the same retailer haha

I went with 2-way. Sometimes less is simpler to integrate

The first time I heard the C5's vs the C3's, they were both powered off just a stock head unit and I actually thought the C3's sounded just as good if not better. Then I was told to listen to the C5's with a real amp powering them. The C5's sounded much better to me. I can drive mine loud and they don't distort. The midbass is not as good as the Hybrid Audio Imagine component speakers but the tweeters are less bright.

I am driving my C5's with a 100watt RMS (@4 ohms) per channel Rockford Fosgate Punch amp and I am using a Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS head unit. Very happy with everything and all told for the speakers, amp, and head unit, it cost me under $850.