Performance Brakes on 2022 BRZ

[weederr33]

Originally Posted by s30series

Shhhhhhh your experience means nothing to @ZDan @jvincent @OkieSnuffBox @NoHaveMSG and lots of other professional IMSA driver's saying that stock BRZ brakes are sufficient on the track with pads, fluid and (now) cooling ducts.

We're just dummies who don't embrace the power of cheap, single piston brakes on the 2022 BRZ. The lightning lap video drivers obviously didn't know how to drive....a good driver barely uses brakes! Glowing rotors at the Rolex24 are just figments of your imagination

You're still doing this BS? Lol

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by s30series

You not having issues on stock brakes (minus fluid/pads) means you didn't push the car hard and/or long enough. Period. Fact. Just sayin'.

Nah, it's not a fact, it really is just your opinion.

Many of the time attack class records were set by people who ran stock brakes (only upgrading pads and fluids), and still run stock brakes.
If you think they aren't fast, it shouldn't be that hard to you to come and beat their records.

On top of that, you're assuming better driver = brakes need to be "better".
In fact, the more speed one can carry into a corner, the less braking is required, and thus less energy the brakes need to absorb.
There are of course other factors that can change the thermal balance one way or another as one's skill increases.

Originally Posted by jvincent

Would the [have slicks, full aero, and are chasing lap time records] group need a BBK for performance reasons? Probably.

Funny you mentioned that.
Slicks increase the speed one can take the slowest corners of the track, and the drag created as a side effect of downforce typically reduces the speed the car can reach before the braking zone into that corner.
So in some cases those people might actually need "less" brakes than people who drive really fast on street tires.
Those NA Miata guys with slicks and wings probably don't need the brakes at all!

Slicks and downforce will however change the rate of deceleration and thus the applied forces, and amount of flex in the system.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by s30series

You not having issues on stock brakes (minus fluid/pads) means you didn't push the car hard and/or long enough. Period. Fact. Just sayin'.

God knows I've had students who were certainly "pushing hard" to a fault, in fact losing time due to overcooking every corner entry and having to overuse the brakes. Usually one of the later stages of driver development and lap time improvement is getting OFF the brakes more between turn-in and apex.

Every driver will have different needs from brakes and place different demands on them. Even drivers turning similar lap times in the same car. Ultimately pads and whether or not a BBK is desired or needed will be very driver-dependent and of course usage-dependent as well.

Not everybody wants or needs to do more than even 15 minute sessions. For track events I run, I'm usually on tires that are done after relatively few laps, there's nothing for me to be gained staying out more than ~10-12 minutes in practice so I'll typically come in early.

If people find they need bigger fixed-caliper brakes for their usage, they are available. And there are other benefits including longer pad life, more compounds that will work (lower temps), better "feel", etc, and easier pad swaps. Also they look cool...

But to suggest that anyone who tracks these cars needs big brakes is just wrong. Most won't.

Full disclosure I'm on PP Brembos, but I've taken out other FT86s on base brakes and run similar lap times without brake issues.

[trippinbillies40]

I absolutely love that everyone saying you don't NEED a BBK for track days reference videos of multi-time national champions driving twins at the limits for well over what a typical track day session would be, and then this dude references the Rolex 24 and their glowing brakes to tell us we're dummies. LOL.

For the 300th time: we agree there are benefits to big brake kits. We disagree that they're necessary for track days. For those wanting to go out and enjoy their car on track and push harder than they would on the street, assuming no major power modifiers, pads and fluid will be plenty to KEEP YOU SAFE for a 20 minute track session. Could you put a stopwatch on yourself and maybe shave a tenth at the end of a 20 minute session? I mean, maybe?

Either way, enjoy your trolling. You're quite the pro at it.

[s30series]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

I didn't have an issue on stock brakes with good pads/fluid and stock lines, but I melted down a set of XP10's with a BBK. What does that mean

Again, as was posted in the other thread about this, T4 cars are required to run stock calipers. They are allowed to run ducts and most do though ducts can cause more heat checking.

21's runoffs was a poor example of "endurance" due to the amount of carnage.

SpEc RaCInG!?!?!?

HoW DoEs It WoRk?!?!

HuuRRR DUURrrr

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by s30series

SpEc RaCInG!?!?!?

HoW DoEs It WoRk?!?!

HuuRRR DUURrrr

Well it sure as F doesn't work like that god forsaken excuse of a race!!

I spent way too much money and time getting the "miata" out of my car and I was one of the lucky ones.

But I digress. Since the rules require us to run OEM brakes I can say they do a great job with the right pads and ducting and we're only make 200 dynojet whp. I wouldn't talk someone out of bigger brakes for track day use if they wanted because there's a couple luxuries they offer for a car that remains street legal. That is of course being able to avoid install brake ducts and/or being able to run 1 pad for street/track. The other is that the heat is now further away from the hub/bearing which can be better for their lifespan.

I like the perspective that "Brakes don't stop the car, tires do, brakes are just an apparatus for converting kinetic energy into heat." If you add speed or weight or grip - you're just going to be converting more energy into heat. Do with that what you will.

Story time!
I raced a CRX in ITA for many years on OEM brakes w/ ducts and they were good enough racing at a min weight of 2150lbs and Toyo RA1s. Then the min weight got increased to 2250 and we started running hoosiers and man - we went through EVERYTHING faster. Brake rotors, every weekend. Pads every 3 weekends. Hubs/Bearings every 2 seasons. Then I sold it to a LuckyDog (enduro) team who took out the 100lbs and ran on 200tw tires in their series.. They were able to run over 50 hours on 1 set of pads simply as a result of removing weight and reducing grip.

Summary - Go spend your money and have fun, you only live once.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Well it sure as F doesn't work like that god forsaken excuse of a race!!

I spent way too much money and time getting the "miata" out of my car and I was one of the lucky ones.

P4 tho!

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by ZDan

P4 tho!

P3! Mx5 was DQd for illegal fuel which moved me up.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

P3! Mx5 was DQd for illegal fuel which moved me up.

Podium in the Runoffs, damn! Hats off to ya, that's an intense scene with 40ish(?) cars on the track in a "winner-takes-all" scenario.