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Old 09-01-2021, 01:40 PM   #281
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While I anxiously await the arrival of kit, does anyone have feedback on a good set of cams that won't disrupt any bottom end power for a stock K24a2? Or should I just stick with stock cams...
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Old 09-01-2021, 03:25 PM   #282
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While I anxiously await the arrival of kit, does anyone have feedback on a good set of cams that won't disrupt any bottom end power for a stock K24a2? Or should I just stick with stock cams...
06 TSX and up I believe are your best factory cams. Anything more extreme runs risk of timing chain adjuster failure from what I understand.

The 50 degree cam gear is your best upgrade using factory parts if you already have the better cams. The stock TSX only has the 25 degree gear.

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Old 09-01-2021, 04:18 PM   #283
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That is top class information. Truly. Is truly something to look at in the future. Not sure if I should save for a K-Swap or just a JRSC for the FA. I'm not overly ambitious as far as power goes, I would be more than happy with 250WHP.

The more I read your response the more pumped I get about considering a K-swap. Of course is easier said than done with most major projects and being a mechanical noob, but is great to know that there are people out there like yourself that document tons of information with a great level of expertise for people like me that aspire to embark in the same journey that you are in.

Godspeed man.
Honestly, any swap is still a big undertaking. If I was a noob to builds or if I was thinking of mild FI then I would totally start there. Buy a used JRSC kit, and install that yourself. It is just a bolt on affair with minimal electronics involved and basic refreshing of the ECU. That should net you a good power increase and introduce you to FI on this platform.

If you want more then you should consider E85 and consider adding supporting mods for the car that improve longevity, or even consider other performance mods like tires, breaks, cooling, aero, etc. If you want more than 300whp and don't want to flirt with a disaster near 350whp then consider the swap. At that point, you could sell your supercharger kit for close to what you paid because it is already used, and you could sell your working motor for $3500, which between selling those two things, it should get you closer to the cost of the full K24 kit. And before you jump on that boat, you would probably want to consider whether you would rather just boost a FA24 on the GR86 or if you want to stick with the first gen to do FI or go NA. A JRSC on the FA24 will probably hold 350+whp more reliably with a limit of 400+whp; we don't know yet what its potential will be.

Personally, I have invested in the interior, audio. exterior, brakes, suspension, etc on this platform and prefer the looks overall, so I am sticking with it for now, but honestly, a boosted FA24 is going to be a beast as is.
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Old 09-01-2021, 04:34 PM   #284
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While I anxiously await the arrival of kit, does anyone have feedback on a good set of cams that won't disrupt any bottom end power for a stock K24a2? Or should I just stick with stock cams...
I did the 50 degree gear, but if you go with that then you have to be careful when choosing cams because you could have too much lift in conjunction with timing changes that causes piston to valve interference. There are pins to limit the rotation of the 50 degree gear.

https://tractuff.com/products/tractuff-vtc-limiter

A TSX RBB will have a three lobe cam with decent lift as is. You can go more aggressive, or you could get the K20a head, which I think is a little more aggressive and flows better. For NA builds, just start with a K20A head on the K24 block, or get a 4 Piston head to put on your block. Port and polish work will open them up that much more. I don't think the K20a heads will be a problem with this wiring harness or intake manifold, but contact Kpower to confirm.

A cam lobe can have any reasonable shape, and because the cam physically changes to a different "high" lobe when VTEC is activated, there are plenty of possibilities; the low lobe could stay identical and the high lobe could be larger, or whatever. You will need to select the cam profile based on your goals and your build. I have the RSX Type S oil pump that raises the risk of cavitation beyond 8k, but I don't really plan on revving the stock motor past 7.5k until I do a build on the bottom end. Even then, 8k is probably fine, but we will see. With that said, a high rpm build will require a cam lobe with not only high lift but also high duration, so the valve is open as long as possible because the piston speeds will be so high that there just won't be enough time for the valve to be open to deliver air and fuel. The point is: it depends, but just remember that between VTEC and variable valve timing there is a lot of potential for variation.
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Old 09-02-2021, 09:17 AM   #285
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i was talking to a shop that sell engines, he was telling me that doing the k20 head swap is waste of money on N/A build because you only gain a like 10hp and wasting close to 1k, now he told me that if you plan a turbo build then the k20 head is way better for turbo builds. I am still learning on K engines since there is so much info. probably i will do N/A build with 250hp or 230hp is fine.
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Old 09-02-2021, 10:24 AM   #286
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Unless someone is wanting to be different, doing this swap for NA street driving with a mild build, assuming someone has a good FA20 motor, is just not economical. For track builds, depending on the expendables and the class requirements, this build can make a lot of sense. For high powered NA builds, this is almost a necessity, and still be so with the GR86. There are off the shelf 400-460+whp NA builds for the K24 for $13k+ (see 4 Piston), but you just won't find that on the FA platforms. Those builds could be done, but they just aren't prevalent or as easy on the FA20, so for those people, this swap makes sense. For mild FI builds sub 300whp, just add FI to the FA20. For mild FI builds on the track, or for FI builds in excess of 350whp, this starts to look better.
This. I really love the K series engines and would love one in the 86 chassis but for my needs, mostly street driven with 3-4 track outings a season, it's just not economical. Better to just buy to Gen2 and be done with it if you want more power. But if you are a serious track goer and want more reliability while upping some NA power or want to add boost for big power later on, the K24 makes a lot more sense.

I am not entirely sure how reliable would a SC FA20 be, even for a lightly tracked car and I don't think it's something I want to venture into.
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Old 09-02-2021, 10:42 AM   #287
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i was talking to a shop that sell engines, he was telling me that doing the k20 head swap is waste of money on N/A build because you only gain a like 10hp and wasting close to 1k, now he told me that if you plan a turbo build then the k20 head is way better for turbo builds. I am still learning on K engines since there is so much info. probably i will do N/A build with 250hp or 230hp is fine.
In terms of the head swap, I think that is only true if you already have a RBB? K24 (TSX engine, true VTEC on both I/E side). If you have a different variation of the K24 which only have VTEC on the intake side, you will benefit form the head swap.
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Old 09-02-2021, 12:25 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by Petah78 View Post
This. I really love the K series engines and would love one in the 86 chassis but for my needs, mostly street driven with 3-4 track outings a season, it's just not economical. Better to just buy to Gen2 and be done with it if you want more power. But if you are a serious track goer and want more reliability while upping some NA power or want to take add boost later on, the K24 makes a lot more sense.

I am not entirely sure how reliable would a SC FA20 be, even for a lightly tracked car and I don't think it's something I want to venture into.
Csg people and other member have track superchraged fa20 for a while and like 10 track per years, and the support is really good. If you plan to keep less 300hp I would look it jackson racing supercharger.
The issue i am having is my motor is at 130k miles and dont know either go the supercharged route or k24.
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Old 09-02-2021, 12:49 PM   #289
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Csg people and other member have track supercharged fa20 for a while and like 10 track per years, and the support is really good. If you plan to keep less 300hp I would look it jackson racing supercharger.
The issue i am having is my motor is at 130k miles and don't know either go the supercharged route or k24.
My motor is very young with only about 17k miles. And while I am very mechanically sympathetic to the car. (very frequent oil changes, light load until engine is warm, no lugging etc), I do spirited drives often along with tracks days hence I am not sure if a SC'd FA20 can handle it. I could be wrong but from what I have read, the general consensus is that the FA20 in NA form is very reliable but it becomes a problem when you start adding boost.

And maybe I am silly to think this but after watching the speed academy JRSC FRS, it kind of left me underwhelmed as their bolt on AP1 (F22c powered) kept up pretty good with it. Anyways, if I was planning to add power to this car, it probably wouldn't be a FA20.
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Old 09-02-2021, 01:01 PM   #290
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i was talking to a shop that sell engines, he was telling me that doing the k20 head swap is waste of money on N/A build because you only gain a like 10hp and wasting close to 1k, now he told me that if you plan a turbo build then the k20 head is way better for turbo builds. I am still learning on K engines since there is so much info. probably i will do N/A build with 250hp or 230hp is fine.
Like Petah said, buy the $200 k24 from a CRV and do the K20 head, and the cost is justified. In the NA world, 10hp for a 4 cylinder on a light chassis is also going to be worth the cost. Getting to 300-350whp might cost $5k for FI, but will cost $15k for NA. That is the nature of the beast. People should just plan ahead if they want to go NA to maximize their performance with their budget.

If I was going NA then I would buy the K24 from an Accord or CRV at the pick n pull for nothing, get a K20 head, do pistons n rods n bearings n ARP head studs while it is all apart with high compression and E85, do RSX type s oil pump, 50 degree cam with limiter, port n polish the head, upgrade the valvetrain for 8k+ redline, a/c delete, water pump delete to electric pump, lightweight flywheel and let er rip.

If I ever do a NA build like that, it will be for a track focused RF Miata.
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Old 09-02-2021, 01:01 PM   #291
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My motor is very young with only about 17k miles. And while I am very mechanically sympathetic to the car. (very frequent oil changes, light load until engine is warm, no lugging etc), I do spirited drives often along with tracks days hence I am not sure if a SC'd FA20 can handle it. I could be wrong but from what I have read, the general consensus is that the FA20 in NA form is very reliable but it becomes a problem when you start adding boost.

And maybe I am silly to think this but after watching the speed academy JRSC FRS, it kind of left me underwhelmed as their bolt on AP1 (F22c powered) kept up pretty good with it. Anyways, if I was planning to add power to this car, it probably wouldn't be a FA20.
Not to get off topic but I have been tracking a JRSC for the past 2 years @ 265hp, and its fast, but its nothing amazing. It is reliable until its not, blown valve seal and snapping belts is the biggest issue I've had but wouldn't want to push the motor much more.
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Old 09-02-2021, 01:44 PM   #292
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A TSX RBB will have a three lobe cam with decent lift as is. You can go more aggressive, or you could get the K20a head, which I think is a little more aggressive and flows better. For NA builds, just start with a K20A head on the K24 block, or get a 4 Piston head to put on your block. Port and polish work will open them up that much more. I don't think the K20a heads will be a problem with this wiring harness or intake manifold, but contact Kpower to confirm.
I believe the RBC head from a K20Z3 (2006-2011 Civic Si) will fit KPower's K24A2 RWD intake. I emailed Kpower and they said the RBC is compatible with the swap kit.

Luke from 4Piston told me that their ported TSX head is good for a bit over 300 HP NA with the right build. He said if you want to get to closer to 350 HP NA you would need to go to an RBC head with the 4P Pro 163 and their RR4 cams. Of course, this also requires the right valve and spring upgrades.

4Piston offered to swap out my RBB TSX head core for an RBC for $100 when I send my head for porting, so that might make the K20 head swap more viable for someone looking for more NA power.
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Old 09-02-2021, 02:14 PM   #293
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In terms of FA20, 1k for 10hp sounds like a decent deal lol.
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Old 09-02-2021, 02:14 PM   #294
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I believe the RBC head from a K20Z3 (2006-2011 Civic Si) will fit KPower's K24A2 RWD intake. I emailed Kpower and they said the RBC is compatible with the swap kit.

Luke from 4Piston told me that their ported TSX head is good for a bit over 300 HP NA with the right build. He said if you want to get to closer to 350 HP NA you would need to go to an RBC head with the 4P Pro 163 and their RR4 cams. Of course, this also requires the right valve and spring upgrades.

4Piston offered to swap out my RBB TSX head core for an RBC for $100 when I send my head for porting, so that might make the K20 head swap more viable for someone looking for more NA power.
Good first post! Welcome to the forum
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