OFT "E-tuning"

[raven1231]

Originally Posted by IBill4You

You can make unsubstantiated claims about events that happened years ago or bandwagon on jokes about a car catching on fire as long as you're comfortable making decisions for your car (and leading others to do so as well) based on anecdote and group think and are content to assume that nobody has ever gained any appreciable amount of knowledge or business savvy over a 2 year period of their lives. It is inconceivable that one would still be in business after 2 years of this kind of behavior. It's pretty surprising that JV didn't turn his back on this platform with the socioeconomic status a of the average 86 owner on the East Coast...
I'm actually not obsessed with Visconti Tuning. I was pretty hesitant and ended up with a V-tune without my permission or knowledge because I originally had a remote tune from a large and reputable tuning vendor from this site that had resulted in severe knock, check engine lights, and left me stranded on the highway while travelling for work. John Visconti had to fix my car and had it running 10 times better with a hybrid MAF/speed density tune that accommodated boost creeping from 10-13psi with just a couple revisions.
I cannot name the vendor because of a verbal agreement that resulted in a refund, but if you search my post history you can find an obviously jacked up log that I had posted. I recently had my wastegate ported and wanted to turn up the boost to 12 psi now that there would be no boost creep, and withing 48 hours John Visconti added me to an already packed schedule of dyno tuning that resulted in him tuning the car after mine until after 3 am the next morning.
Prior to this dyno tuning session I used to think that tuning was really overpriced, but about 30 revisions (20 dyno, 10 street) later I couldn't believe how much work in 104*F weather was actually done for so little money.
Idc who does your E-tune and idc if you only paid $20.00. You aren't tuned until you have a dyno tune.

I respect that you've been around this forum and platform much longer than I have, but I have had vastly different first hand experience than you are describing, and I think it is important for the other members here to have more than just the "popular" opinions that were formed and solidified years ago.

Is the SBD group full of a lot of new guys to the game that have no idea what is going on and post a lot? Yes. Does that mean you can attribute those qualities to all or even a slight majority of owners running the SBD kit? Well I guess that depends on your personality and moral integrity. It might be possible that the people whom you say are obsessed with Visconti are just happy customers. It's so crazy I know. I have found quite a bit more meaningful discussion on the FB group than on this site with regards to installing your own FI kit. Probably because of the general discontent projected towards the SBD kit.
You guys need to give these smaller vendors some breathing room, because they are the ones providing you with inexpensive innovation.

I have no problem with whoever you decide to have tune your car that's on you. I also have no personal experience with JV and there is a reason for that. Regardless, of if he has changed or his work is now somehow better than it was in the past, the reality is he screwed over a lot of people, and refused to do anything to make it right, and that you cannot simply sweep under the rug. Obviously, it was a big enough deal to ban him from this site.

I'm not saying he doesn't do great by some people, and hell maybe his tuning and customer service has gotten better, but my "personal integrity" does not allow me to do business with someone like that. Being a smaller vendor and making mistakes is fine. Not fixing those mistakes or taking responsibility for them is not.

People on the forum warning new members is simply to try and make sure nothing happens to them. They tend to do very little research and for obvious reasons this can be a big problem.

As for e-tunes, I don't think anyone would disagree that they aren't better than a dyno tune. The reality however is most people who run the OFT just have basic bolt on's and the canned tunes are conservative enough to be safe for a lot of different setups and are great for most people's needs.

[P5yk0t1c]

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash

Sorry for the lack of communication. However, I have not gotten any emails from you directly. Perhaps it has something to do with the email addresses you are sending message to. My email address is shiv@openflashperformance.com, not shiv@openflash. Also, there is no rombinhood@openflash email address. While it is true that we do sometimes get backlogged with e-tuning work, we certainly don't make it a habit of ignoring any customer.

If you can email me (shiv@openflashperformance.com), I will get things sorted out today. Again, our apologies.

Regards,
Shiv

Thanks for your reply. I was sending all emails to sales@openflashperformance.com as it was the only email address that I knew. I will send you an email today.

[DAEMANO]

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash

With the exception of Subaru WRX/EVO business from 10+ years ago, we still support every model we ever developed parts for. I think many people mistake no longer being super active on a forum as not supporting the market. In this case, we have been so busy with OFT350, Abarth and ESC controller development that I simply don't have enough time to actively monitor forums. But we do our best to be available by phone/email to all customers. Some things do fall through the cracks from time to time but we do what we can to solve issues if they were to arise.

Regards,
shiv

Hey Shiv, where can I find more Fiat Abarth info? I see it on your website, but is there a forum you're participating in? The S.O. has a 2013 Abarth Convertible that is ready for upgrades!

[phrosty]

Originally Posted by themajesticone

Apparently the Vishnu team hops from one platform to the other.

I don't know OP's circumstances. There are always two truths to every story. This isn't a commentary on him or his experience, but a conversation with the folks who sent the thread off-topic.

I disagree with people saying OpenFlash has abandoned this community. But, I won't argue about that. Instead, let me make make an argument for why them dialing down attention is OK.

OpenFlash's whole schtick is that the tunes they put out are Open. Shiv even put a lot of time detailing his tuning process to the community. What's happened is that things only he could answer before are largely now self-service and built in to the community. Look in the "data logs" thread -- Shiv was very active in there at one point, and now there are a handful of regulars who've learned not just how to tell if a tune is safe, but how to diagnose issues and even tune themselves.

Legitimate issues people have with OpenFlash tend to be more around messed up tablets, and that is super rare and something I've always seen them respond to very quickly.

OpenFlash has us in a good place. We don't need them to be around 24/7 anymore. Without a newly launched project to restart the cycle of integrating knowledge into the community, they simply don't have much to contribute, and it makes sense for them to spend their time on other areas of their business. They've got more 86 stuff in the pipeline. They just need to finish up their other projects first. We should not act so entitled, but instead should be thanking them for enabling us. And we should not be disrespectful to other members of this forum by hijacking their threads to spew vitriol.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by P5yk0t1c

Thanks for your reply. I was sending all emails to sales@openflashperformance.com as it was the only email address that I knew. I will send you an email today.

Sounds good. Sorry for the miscommunication. I'll be on the Dyno for the next several hours but will be responding to email tonight

[tyrantcf]

I nominate @phrosty for Nobel peace prize.

[themajesticone]

Originally Posted by phrosty

I don't know OP's circumstances. There are always two truths to every story. This isn't a commentary on him or his experience, but a conversation with the folks who sent the thread off-topic.

I disagree with people saying OpenFlash has abandoned this community. But, I won't argue about that. Instead, let me make make an argument for why them dialing down attention is OK.

OpenFlash's whole schtick is that the tunes they put out are Open. Shiv even put a lot of time detailing his tuning process to the community. What's happened is that things only he could answer before are largely now self-service and built in to the community. Look in the "data logs" thread -- Shiv was very active in there at one point, and now there are a handful of regulars who've learned not just how to tell if a tune is safe, but how to diagnose issues and even tune themselves.

Legitimate issues people have with OpenFlash tend to be more around messed up tablets, and that is super rare and something I've always seen them respond to very quickly.

OpenFlash has us in a good place. We don't need them to be around 24/7 anymore. Without a newly launched project to restart the cycle of integrating knowledge into the community, they simply don't have much to contribute, and it makes sense for them to spend their time on other areas of their business. They've got more 86 stuff in the pipeline. They just need to finish up their other projects first. We should not act so entitled, but instead should be thanking them for enabling us. And we should not be disrespectful to other members of this forum by hijacking their threads to spew vitriol.

I respectfully disagree.

So are these people (non OpenFlash employees) volunteering to provide support for team OpenFlash doing this for free? No compensation? Kudos to them and much appreciated for the community's sake to take on that load but that only solidifies a faulty business model in relation to support and ongoing customer service in my opinion. They won't hire more staff to do what forum members are doing for free? Maybe I am wrong

For example, steve99, that guy has provided so much thorough content in specific places for people to understand and learn. Did he get compensated? Maybe he enjoys doing it for free and does not care...

Principally, however, I would structure some things differently.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by themajesticone

I respectfully disagree.

So are these people (non OpenFlash employees) volunteering to provide support for team OpenFlash doing this for free? No compensation? Kudos to them and much appreciated for the community's sake to take on that load but that only solidifies a faulty business model in relation to support and ongoing customer service in my opinion. They won't hire more staff to do what forum members are doing for free? Maybe I am wrong

For example, steve99, that guy has provided so much thorough content in specific places for people to understand and learn. Did he get compensated? Maybe he enjoys doing it for free and does not care...

Principally, however, I would structure some things differently.

For a company that has "abandoned" the GT86 community (as you repeatedly claim) we sure do spend a lot of timing working on them. 3 FRS here. Two for OFT350 upgrades, 1 for E85 mapping. Sitting in one, on a dyno right now. In fact, we just gave our Abarth to an FRS customer so that he has a daily driver while we have his turbo car. So you can see my point when I think you are full of hot air. Just because we don't have much time to post on the forum, doesn't mean that we have reduced our involvement in the platform. In fact, quite the opposite.

[DAEMANO]

Originally Posted by themajesticone

I respectfully disagree.

So are these people (non OpenFlash employees) volunteering to provide support for team OpenFlash doing this for free? No compensation? Kudos to them and much appreciated for the community's sake to take on that load but that only solidifies a faulty business model in relation to support and ongoing customer service in my opinion. They won't hire more staff to do what forum members are doing for free? Maybe I am wrong

For example, steve99, that guy has provided so much thorough content in specific places for people to understand and learn. Did he get compensated? Maybe he enjoys doing it for free and does not care...

Principally, however, I would structure some things differently.

Imagine if the hood of your car was welded shut. All service must be provided by the dealer/factory. No modification allowed. No upgrades. Your car is an appliance. That's what locked tuning was like before companies like OpenFlash. You pay for a single tune, you run it. If you want some modification to the tune you pay the tuner again.

No offense, but you don't seem to understand the business model.

Shiv's OpenFlash tunes are not locked. His primary business model doesn't revolve around selling tunes (like a typical tuning house). His revenue is generated by selling the hardware that allows people to tune their own cars. Try to understand this. He provides base OTS tunes. Guys like the awesome @steve99 can be considered "non-certified" OpenFlash "tuners". Steve chooses to give them away instead. Good on him. If anyone should be paying guys like @steve99 it should be people that choose to use his tunes and tune mods.

This is no attack, but I feel the need to say this to you. I have refrained from posting directly to you because you seem to comment strongly about a lot about things you have very little first hand knowledge of. I don't know why you feel the need to engage in discussion this way. That's why you're the only person I've ever not given a test drive in my car upon asking. Your motivations don't seem to be true and I don't know why.

[Koa]

^^^^^

big ups, anyone who needs tuning advice on this platform can find a lot of great help in the software threads.

I've individually helped just south of ten people with their tunes or modifying their existing tunes, and it has compensated ME with a better understanding of not only OFT, romraider, and the like.. but tuning and how modern engines work in general.

Compensation is not strictly about money, and as an aside, this should be an argument brought up in the discussions around "livable wages" in general today. There's MUCH more to growing, professionally or as a hobbyist, than getting the reward at the end of the period.

Shiv and crew shouldn't be hiring more staff to respond to social media, they should be focused on their products, as Daemano has thoughtfully pointed out is not to talk with us on social media

[Bader]

Originally Posted by themajesticone

I respectfully disagree.

So are these people (non OpenFlash employees) volunteering to provide support for team OpenFlash doing this for free? No compensation? Kudos to them and much appreciated for the community's sake to take on that load but that only solidifies a faulty business model in relation to support and ongoing customer service in my opinion. They won't hire more staff to do what forum members are doing for free? Maybe I am wrong

For example, steve99, that guy has provided so much thorough content in specific places for people to understand and learn. Did he get compensated? Maybe he enjoys doing it for free and does not care...

Principally, however, I would structure some things differently.

I'm sorry that you don't understand the idea behind something being open source.

The threads and efforts contributed by Steve and others like him are the reason I frequent these forums. They help other members grow in knowledge over time.

My profession has nothing to do with the auto industry, I bought this platform to have something fun to drive and learn more about cars. I've been able to do that with the help of the OFT and the amazing contributions by members of this forum.

Now I know enough that I can diagnose issues on this platform for other 86 owners in my area before they take their cars to the dealership.

@Shiv@Openflash
I know you are very busy but I was wondering if you guys will have an e-tune option for your SBD kit for us people living so far away overseas.

[tonystewart]

I'm outta here

[themajesticone]

Originally Posted by DAEMANO

Imagine if the hood of your car was welded shut. All service must be provided by the dealer/factory. No modification allowed. No upgrades. Your car is an appliance. That's what locked tuning was like before companies like OpenFlash. You pay for a single tune, you run it. If you want some modification to the tune you pay the tuner again.

No offense, but you don't seem to understand the business model.

Shiv's OpenFlash tunes are not locked. His primary business model doesn't revolve around selling tunes (like a typical tuning house). His revenue is generated by selling the hardware that allows people to tune their own cars. Try to understand this. He provides base OTS tunes. Guys like the awesome @steve99 can be considered "non-certified" OpenFlash "tuners". Steve chooses to give them away instead. Good on him. If anyone should be paying guys like @steve99 it should be people that choose to use his tunes and tune mods.

This is no attack, but I feel the need to say this to you. I have refrained from posting directly to you because you seem to comment strongly about a lot about things you have very little first hand knowledge of. I don't know why you feel the need to engage in discussion this way. That's why you're the only person I've ever not given a test drive in my car upon asking. Your motivations don't seem to be true and I don't know why.

can I get a ride still though?

[P5yk0t1c]

This thread got out of hand.


Shiv has been gracious enough to extend a hand and personally help me with the e-tune.


I would also like to apologize for making this thread in the first place. I let my emotions get the best of me and lashed out in a forum. I for one should know that everyone is busy these days and this was not the right way to go about getting some help. Lesson learned.