FR-S vs. 370z, end all be all of discussions

[NikostC]

Originally Posted by RRnold

+1 Comparing apples and oranges!

I don't think there are too many cars that can truely compare to the FR-S besides the Genesis coupe.

I would say a old nissan 240sx would qualify, since they are both around 2600lbs and rwd. Prolly the best comparison IMO.

Originally Posted by blewmax07

As much as I hated to read your post, I must agree with you. Those were some harsh facts, but correct me if I'm wrong. If this car came NA with around 200 hp, adding a turbo could easily put you around 250-275 with little boost. Doing that along with the price of the car will still be cheaper than a new Z. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that the subaru version will have a turbo. Not to mention, I'm sure the aftermarket as we speak have plans for this car once they can get their hands on one. So I guess what I'm saying is getting close to 370Z numbers shouldn't be too difficult. Not to mention have a back seat, better gas mileage, and a functional trunk. I'm no mechanic but those are just my thoughts, what do you think?

Correct me if i am wrong, but isn't it hard to achieve reasonable boost on an engine with a high compression like 11.0-12.0? hoping it makes 75hp over stock is a little much... more likely 30-40hp over stock.

I know on scion tC's with 10lbs of boost you could easily see 300whp with the right tuning. Dragon prolly know much more than me on that topic.

[WingsofWar]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

That's what's beautiful about boost though. Flick of a switch and you got more power.

I have to say the Gen Coupe 2.0T is the closest competitor to the FR-S. Then you can toss in the 2012 Civic SI even though it's not considered a sports car, it will be a buyers options due to the same price segment.

Although you would have to be a fool to pick the 2012 SI over the FR-S.

The RX8 is often in the same shootout as the 350z. So, if anyone is going to compare the FR-S to the RX8, then you are going to have to compare it to the 350z also. Which the Z is a brute of a car and I don't think the FR-S will have the balls to tackle the Z. The RX8 is just slow, so I can see why people would say it would be a competitor, but you can't ignore what else it competes with.

FR-S though with a little more power is going to be a BEAST...hence why I want 300whp in it.

NOOOOO! its not direct comparisons! its PERFORMANCE BRACKETS!!!!!!!

if Car A has a 1pt-3pt bracket and Car B has a 2-4pt bracket and Car C has a 4-6pt bracket, then Car A could be compared to Car B and vise versa but Car A cannot be compared to Car C. But Car B can compete with both A and C.

Get it?

This should not be about comparing 1:1 or apples to apples. The performance specturm is very wide when you bunch together all the cars globally into one list. This is why the FRS does have competitions in the market, but not in a direct comparison. This is why we can add discontinued vehicles to the list as they are still part of the buyers market.

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by EJ20

According to this BMI is no more
http://noriyaro.com/?p=6554

WTTTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


[U2B]WWaLxFIVX1s[/U2B]

No seriously, this can't be real!!! Not BMI!

[Cogito8888]

This car has no direct competitor, IMHO the closest are

Subaru WRX (pwr/weight, price, the suposed go to car if you don't want rwd)
Mini Cooper S (weight, size, price, pwr/weight, utility, fuel consuption)
Mazda Miata (weight, size, price, pwr/weight, rwd, fuel consumption)
Mazda RX8 (size, price, pwr/weight, utility)

I feel the genesis compares (very poorly) to the V6 mustang and Camaro
(really the genesis only compares to the FR-S in (Price, Utility, and RWD and being foreign which is irrelevant IMO)

I'm not considering the 370z either, some of us will need rear seats and 25K is literally the highest we CAN spend on this car

[Zaku]

T____T now if they cancel top gear too.... then I quit life! Hot version is gone too?

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by Zaku

T____T now if they cancel top gear too.... then I quit life! Hot version is gone too?

Yup....

[4agze]

Originally Posted by Zaku

T____T now if they cancel top gear too.... then I quit life! Hot version is gone too?

but top gear is UK based and very strong now we have top gear china lol

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by Cogito8888

I'm not considering the 370z either, some of us will need rear seats and 25K is literally the highest we CAN spend on this car

^

Its not exactly entry-level if the people who can only afford entry-level, can't afford it.

[iff2mastamatt]

Didn't some Toyota exec mention a while ago that the FT-86 would be "thousands cheaper than the Z"? That sounds like a comparison to me.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by Cogito8888

This car has no direct competitor, IMHO the closest are

Subaru WRX (pwr/weight, price, the suposed go to car if you don't want rwd)
Mini Cooper S (weight, size, price, pwr/weight, utility, fuel consuption)
Mazda Miata (weight, size, price, pwr/weight, rwd, fuel consumption)
Mazda RX8 (size, price, pwr/weight, utility)

I feel the genesis compares (very poorly) to the V6 mustang and Camaro
(really the genesis only compares to the FR-S in (Price, Utility, and RWD and being foreign which is irrelevant IMO)

I'm not considering the 370z either, some of us will need rear seats and 25K is literally the highest we CAN spend on this car

This post is so retarded it's not even funny. The genesis doesn't compare poorly to the cars you mention especially the Camaro. And then you went and added a WRX? and a mini cooper? as a closer competitor?

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by NikostC

Correct me if i am wrong, but isn't it hard to achieve reasonable boost on an engine with a high compression like 11.0-12.0? hoping it makes 75hp over stock is a little much... more likely 30-40hp over stock.

I know on scion tC's with 10lbs of boost you could easily see 300whp with the right tuning. Dragon prolly know much more than me on that topic.

Yeah I'm hoping the compression isn't terribly to high. I forget what the SI is (11's somewhere). If the FR-S is in the 11's then a small amount of boost 8lbs will be safe enough. It's a trade off, you can't run a lot of boost, but due to the high compression it makes more power. The 2011 tC will make 330whp at 8lbs of boost and it runs 10's for compression (it's also a 2.5L). The 2005-10 tC will make around 300whp at 8-9lbs as it runs 9:6.1 and 9:8.1 depending on year. At the same time, you can get away with 14lbs of boost on a 2005-10 and survive were as the 2011 would probably detonate before making 14lbs of boost on stock internals.

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

NOOOOO! its not direct comparisons! its PERFORMANCE BRACKETS!!!!!!!

if Car A has a 1pt-3pt bracket and Car B has a 2-4pt bracket and Car C has a 4-6pt bracket, then Car A could be compared to Car B and vise versa but Car A cannot be compared to Car C. But Car B can compete with both A and C.

Get it?

This should not be about comparing 1:1 or apples to apples. The performance specturm is very wide when you bunch together all the cars globally into one list. This is why the FRS does have competitions in the market, but not in a direct comparison. This is why we can add discontinued vehicles to the list as they are still part of the buyers market.

Huh? BHAHAHAA! You started to lose me when I got to 1pt, 2pt....etc... There is no regulatory committee that puts cars in a "performance bracket", so isn't that subjective as well?



PS....as I mentioned before the 2011 Mustang is 300hp and runs high 13's in the 1/4 mile with a price of $22k. Some sites are already saying the 2011 Mustang and Camaro are going to be the FR-S competition.

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

PS....as I mentioned before the 2011 Mustang is 300hp and runs high 13's in the 1/4 mile with a price of $22k. Some sites are already saying the 2011 Mustang and Camaro are going to be the FR-S competition.

Hahaha, both car's weigh in at ~3800lbs.

I'm sorry, but muscle heads won't even be looking at the FR-S to begin with. If you want an overweight torquey whale then by all means, go buy Mr. Needstogoonaseverediet

The FR-S is DESIGNEDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD, to be a completely different sports car.

I'd expect a track head like yourself would understand the different benefits of owning a nothing but power cinder block, and a quick and agile responsive sponge (I unno, both similar shapes...).

The fact they can get car's that are so much larger and so much heavier to be as cheap makes me severely question their quality and longevity.

But, it works out for the better if you ask me. It forces Toyota/Scion to seriously consider the FR-S' MSRP against those car's to win over sales. They'll HAVE to keep it low low $20k.

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

Hahaha, both car's weigh in at ~3800lbs.

I'm sorry, but muscle heads won't even be looking at the FR-S to begin with. If you want an overweight torquey whale then by all means, go buy Mr. Needstogoonaseverediet

The FR-S is DESIGNEDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD, to be a completely different sports car.

I'd expect a track head like yourself would understand the different benefits of owning a nothing but power cinder block, and a quick and agile responsive sponge (I unno, both similar shapes...).

The fact they can get car's that are so much larger and so much heavier to be as cheap makes me severely question their quality and longevity.

But, it works out for the better if you ask me. It forces Toyota/Scion to seriously consider the FR-S' MSRP against those car's to win over sales. They'll HAVE to keep it low low $20k.

Wait now, I didn't say "I" would be considering a Mustang/Camaro...lol. I'm just saying.

Come on now, do I look like a Muscle head? 69 Mustang, yeah I'll take that though..

[dalli]

wait the 2011 mustang weighs in @ 3.8k lbs @ 300 HP?

If the FR-S comes @ 2.8k lbs @ 200 hp.. wouldn't it beat it... by a lot.. ( i guess it depends on torque?)