NA water meth injection?

[Ingen]

Random question time, and I am pretty tired and on my iPad so... It might not make a lot of sense.

Anyway. I have been a bit jealous of folks with tunes on e85 getting extra power. I want some too, but I don't have e85 readily available.

Would it be possible to add a water meth injection kit to avoid detonation with an aggressive tune on 93 octane? I have heard of it in turbo applications but never in a naturally aspirated car.

People who know more than me, please help!

[JoeBoxer]

It's being researched to see if it will make any power for the same reason you stated, not everybody can get E85.

I don't know if it's been installed yet or tuned but the plan is out there. @FA20Club.com

[FA20Club.com]

The kit is here just have to find some time to get it installed on a stock car for testing....?

[chutrain]

I would be against it. It's not as safe in a way as E85. Why people are shifting away and going the E85 route. If for any rain the pump goes, there goes the motor. Not sure it would be as beneficial going this route in NA as a turbo.

[jdzumwalt]

Running a straight Methanol no water would be best. Water is used to cool the charge. Since there is no turbo present it doesn't really do much. Meth on the other hand give more fuel and will keep detonation at bay so I could see some benefits to it. Lean out the GAS add Meth make more POWER.

[uspspro]

Originally Posted by chutrain

I would be against it. It's not as safe in a way as E85. Why people are shifting away and going the E85 route. If for any rain the pump goes, there goes the motor. Not sure it would be as beneficial going this route in NA as a turbo.

It's possible to program in failsafes for cases like the pump dying or the water lever drops too low... such as map switching.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by uspspro

It's possible to program in failsafes for cases like the pump dying or the water lever drops too low... such as map switching.

Or you know, just pressing on the accelerator a little less.

[invisage]

Originally Posted by FA20Club.com

The kit is here just have to find some time to get it installed on a stock car for testing....?

Don't tease like that

[Grishbok]

Theres only so much you can advance the timing in the window... not sure methanol injection would be worth it, it would increase the octane rating, but not sure youd really be able to do much with it. If your gonna spray methanol, you might as well spray nitrous, safer and bigger power numbers.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Grishbok

Theres only so much you can advance the timing in the window... not sure methanol injection would be worth it, it would increase the octane rating, but not sure youd really be able to do much with it. If your gonna spray methanol, you might as well spray nitrous, safer and bigger power numbers.

Spraying nitrous sounds a lot more dangerous than spraying methanol to me...methanol is just fuel, and it's "better" for the engine than gasoline since it cools the air more. Nitrous is adding oxidizer, and thus increasing burn temperature significantly. Of course, this gives you a ton more power as well.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by Grishbok

Theres only so much you can advance the timing in the window... not sure methanol injection would be worth it, it would increase the octane rating, but not sure youd really be able to do much with it. If your gonna spray methanol, you might as well spray nitrous, safer and bigger power numbers.

91 octane oxygenated American beer is what we get for gas here. Any help with raising the effective octane would be great.

[Grishbok]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Spraying nitrous sounds a lot more dangerous than spraying methanol to me...methanol is just fuel, and it's "better" for the engine than gasoline since it cools the air more. Nitrous is adding oxidizer, and thus increasing burn temperature significantly. Of course, this gives you a ton more power as well.

Injecting nitrous is much safer. I explained in another thread, but will do so again, that nitrous is n2O, meaning two nitrogen and an oxygen atom. During the combustion process the nitrogen is seperated form the oxygen, leaving free floating oxygen in the combustion chamber, oxygen is air, meaning your doing nothing more than putting more air into the combustion chamber, the free floating nitrogen acts as a buffer to prevent detonation and compressed nitrous sprays at a temperature of +- -127*F
The increased power comes from the combustion of the pure unbonded oxygen. Obviously trying to shove 500hp shot is not safe, but a 50shot would be perfectly fine. even a 25 shot or a 20 shot if they made nozzels that small would be able to produce more of a hp/tq # than methanol.

[invisage]

Difference is nos is a limited use application while a meth/water kit is continously running. There are other great benefits to meth/water kits too like that it helps with carbon build up in parts or the engine like the combustion chamber. They work best in high compression engines and because they lower the air temp coming in they are even better when combined with FI. But we will see soon wont we FA20Club.com

[S1000rr]

Originally Posted by jdzumwalt

Running a straight Methanol no water would be best. Water is used to cool the charge. Since there is no turbo present it doesn't really do much. Meth on the other hand give more fuel and will keep detonation at bay so I could see some benefits to it. Lean out the GAS add Meth make more POWER.

100% meth is not very safe. Water also helps dilute the meth in order to keep things safe under the hood. As you said though water is used for cooling which actually sweats on the cylinder walls. A 60-40 mix would probably be good, but in our case E85 would probably be a lot easier to accomplish the power gains.