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12-23-2021, 11:37 AM | #15 |
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That helps A LOT. I had started to piece all of that together through previous replies, but the wiring diagram sure clears it up.
The crossover to eliminate high frequencies going to the door speakers - that must be an integral part of the OEM amp, right? |
12-23-2021, 11:57 AM | #16 | |
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https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...39#post3436339 |
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12-23-2021, 12:46 PM | #17 | |
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Those OEM mid-range drivers should naturally roll off around the same frequency that the tweeters are designed to begin playing sound. The high-pass filters for the tweeters are rated at about 14.7 kHz @ 6db/octave. Also, when you have separates in your system, they are normally rated as a set. For instance: a 4-ohm tweeter matched to a 4-ohm woofer in a matched set is rated at 4-ohms. The filters are what keep the set of speakers' impedance value at 4 ohms. To further explain this, if you had a 4-ohm 6" driver in parallel with another 4-ohm 6" driver with no filtration to act as a crossover for this set, you would have a 2-ohm load....on the other hand, if you were to add a high-pass filter at....let's say.... 5kHz to the first speaker, and a low-pass filter to the second speaker also at 5kHz, then that set would be rated at 4 ohms because the first speaker can't play much above the crossover point of 5kHz, and the other speaker can't play much below the crossover point of 5kHz. This would result in the total impedance value of the set to be 4 ohms. |
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12-23-2021, 12:47 PM | #18 | |
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12-23-2021, 01:55 PM | #19 | |
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I just got curious about it one day when I had more time to research these things. Not so much anymore since I've changed careers. |
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12-23-2021, 07:27 PM | #20 |
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So to go back to the original question, I think you should stick with your Rockford component set and get these things instead. I'm assuming you want to go with that headunit because it has Apple car play, but if that is not extremely important I would actually leave the stock head unit and just buy a DSP and amp. I recommend these items:
Amp for mids and tweeters. https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item...RZ4-1200D.html Adapters for tweeters. They will go in the 3.5" space in your dash. You already had mid adapters on the list so you're good on that. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...A1LAPRHCR7XHF0 A DSP for controlling speaker level, EQ, and crossovers. This Dayton unit will act as a high level converter and has 6 channels incase you want to add a sub. https://www.amazon.com/Dayton-Audio-...s%2C354&sr=8-2 If you don't plan on running a sub, MiniDSP is always a good option too and a little bit cheaper, keep in mind you will have to run a high level converter or LOC for this. https://www.amazon.com/miniDSP-2x4/d...s%2C117&sr=8-2 And just a personal suggestion, if you decided to ditch the HU you'll be able to spend a little more on speakers. So I would recommend these over the Rockfords for just a little bit more. Alpine Type S. https://www.amazon.com/Alpine-S-S65C...s%2C165&sr=8-4 You can use this guide to tap into the factory wiring and run power to the doors. You will need to run power directly from your amp to the tweeters though. https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42239 Good luck! |
12-23-2021, 09:06 PM | #21 | |||
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but i don't think that a full-on audio install with a bunch of extra wiring and a DSP that needs programming is really what's necessary here for a street-driven race car. it's completely up to davidzemon, but the K.I.S.S. method, and lack of in-depth audio interest is specifically why i recommended the HU first, and potentially the amp bypass (this would get rid of the filtering of the oem amp, which stands to make the door speakers work a little more to clear up the audio spectrum). i respect his thought process and willingness to 'just get it over with' and spend big enough to replace all of it, but feature-creep recommendations are real, and i don't get the impression that david is the kind of guy to fantasize over playing with 12db/oct and 18 db/oct slopes, or tweaking driver phasing for soundstage improvements like you or me. Quote:
the more technical answer is because it doesn't have adjustable levels, isn't very powerful to begin with in aftermarket terms, uses speaker-level inputs instead of the more preferable low-level inputs of aftermarket gear, and makes the door speakers into subwoofers via integrated filtering that lack external adjustment. the deep dive thread into it was hoping to clear some of that up, but as you can see, we mostly got stuck at the filtering aspect. with more experimentation, it's possible that one might be able to manipulate the amp's audio filters to work better, but that's only 1 negative attribute in a much longer list, a list that any aftermarket amp easily overcomes with simple external industry-standard adjustable features.
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12-24-2021, 01:10 AM | #22 | |
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OP feel free to message me directly if you have any questions. I got you brother. |
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12-28-2021, 02:24 PM | #23 |
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Thank you all for the great feedback. You both have good points. For a bit more clarity:
Spec'ing out parts and performing mechanical-based installations are well within my wheeelhouse. I'm a car guy and computer guy, so _that_ is easy. But I'm also pretty well tone deaf, so the idea of tweaking the phase of a speaker or measuring anything in "db/oct" is, quite literally, laughable to me. I'm glad you guys have ears and musical backgrounds fine enough to hear and appreciate those kinds of differences... but I don't. I can't even hear the difference between a 192kbps MP3 and a CD on a quality home stereo. I installed the Sony HU Christmas eve and went for a few drives with it. The audio quality still isn't _great_, but I think it might well be "good enough." Just having a usable head unit has drastically changed my outlook. I will probably keep this for a few months (because it will hardly be driven in this cold weather) and re-evaluate over Spring or Summer. One last question before this thread gets buried for a bit: is the old, stock HU worth anything? I'm guessing it's just ewaste, especially since the right-part of the screen (1/2" to 1") is unresponsive, but I'd certainly be happy to post it for free somewhere if there's actually a market. |
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12-28-2021, 07:26 PM | #24 |
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glad to hear about the head unit. if you haven't already, play with the different baked-in eq settings, sometimes they're enough to make everything work.
another simple/cheap option would be to build the amp bypass harness. some of the muddiness of the sound is due to the dash speakers picking up around 3-5khz, and the door speakers only working as 100hz-and-lower subwoofers. so by installing the bypass, it would make the door speakers play all frequencies, which stands to clear up the audio signal. no, the factory unit, especially one that isn't working right is all but worthless to most people. ebay sold head units show an outlier at $250, but most being sold between $40 and $150 for properly working units.
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