Using higher quality brake fluid vs using cheap but changing more often

[ayau]

Ideally, we would all like use some fresh Project Mu or other extremely high temp brake fluids before each track event. Unfortunately, for your average track driver, this may be overkill/waste of money.

One option would be to run a high temp fluid for a couple of track events. The downside of this option would be that brake fluid boiling temp will decrease overtime. Another option would be to run fresh fluid before each track event, but instead of getting the expensive stuff, use something slightly less expensive. This way, you can almost guarantee that the dry boiling temp is rated at factory specs.

I've searched around for "cheaper" fluids and have found that the Prestone DOT 4 has a dry boiling temp of 500F. A bottle of ATE SuperBlue has a dry boiling temp of 536F. For the price one bottle of ATE, you could perform 2 Prestone fluid changes. Some may argue that even ATE isn't enough for a full track day event, but with all things YMMV.

What are your thoughts? Run cheaper fluid but change more often, or run the nice stuff knowing that the boiling temps will decrease? An important factor to consider is when brake fluid will actually start to boil on the BRZ/FRS, but there are probably way too many variables to come up with one solid answer.

[Dezoris]

I just dumped in the Project Mu fluid from Mike and yes at $50 its way over kill if you are the once a month track/autox person.

The way I think of it is if you are going to swap you might as well swap for a better fluid, as you likely won't have to do a full bleed as much if you are doing random events.

The amount of time it would take me to re-bleed cheaper fluid if I had to is worth the extra 25$ over AP racing, etc.

[rice_classic]

You're overthinking it. I understand if you had to flush the WHOLE system every weekend and you were running RBF660 how things might be a little price but keep a few things in mind:

1: ATE SuperBlue isn't expensive. If that's expensive to you then maybe track days and sports cars are already a bit beyond your financial means. Also, buy it on Amazon, it's cheaper and you can even buy it in bulk. (as low as $17 or $14.4/can if you buy a case of 10). [ame="http://www.amazon.com/ATE-Super-Blue-CASE-10/dp/B000UZ8K5W/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1366646793&sr=8-10&keywords=ate+super+blue"]ATE Super Blue - CASE (10) : Amazon.com : Automotive[/ame]


2: When you bleed your brakes you don't need to bleed the whole system. About 6 pumps out of each caliper and you're fresh. And you can bleed the rear calipers half as often as the fluid back typically doesn't see as much heat and doesn't degrade as often.

3: It doesn't degrade that quickly. How many track days are you planning on doing a year? 5? 10? I'd say replace your fluid once a year... maybe twice a year. We're talking 1 can ATE for initial flush and a quarter can per subsequent bleed.


I've been racing on ATE since 2004 in a car with tiny rotors and poor ducting. Trust me, it can handle it just fine. I have never boiled fluid.

[rice_classic]

2nd benefit of ATE is that it's blue. You KNOW when the old fluid out of the system and that the new fluid is in.

[CSG Mike]

Here's my example.

In my S2000, I'd have to bleed RBF600 after every track day; the pedal would feel like absolute mush driving home every time. It would recover a bit after sitting overnight, but never get back to the feel of fresh fluid until it was flushed out. Even through the track day, the pedal would already be spongy after the 1st session. On a competition day, I'll bleed between sessions. Seeing S2000's on jackstands with the brakes being bled isn't a rare sight around here.

I fought the jump to good fluid for years. Then I tried it, and discovered, that the pedal wouldn't deteriorate after 1 track day. Or 2. Or 5. Remember that while your pads can likely handle 1500F+, the fluid cannot, and that heat will eventually soak into your caliper. You don't want your fluid boiling.

Ultimately, it's a cost saving measure. RBF600 lasts 1 day for me. Project Mu G-four lasts 5+. The cost is roughly double RBF600 (per unit volume). That's a pretty good savings to me over the long term. What's $55 vs $20 over the course of a year?

Additional plus: I don't have to spend time bleeding my brakes between sessions or after a track day.

Another plus: Project Mu G-Four is Teal in color. It turns brown as it deteriorates, giving you a visual indicator of when to change it.

[iLuveKetchup]

I'd just run ATE fluid. Are you boiling now?

[Dezoris]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Here's my example.

In my S2000, I'd have to bleed RBF600 after every track day; the pedal would feel like absolute mush driving home every time. It would recover a bit after sitting overnight, but never get back to the feel of fresh fluid until it was flushed out. Even through the track day, the pedal would already be spongy after the 1st session. On a competition day, I'll bleed between sessions. Seeing S2000's on jackstands with the brakes being bled isn't a rare sight around here.

I fought the jump to good fluid for years. Then I tried it, and discovered, that the pedal wouldn't deteriorate after 1 track day. Or 2. Or 5.

Ultimately, it's a cost saving measure. RBF600 lasts 1 day for me. Project Mu G-four lasts 5+. The cost is roughly double RBF600 (per unit volume). That's a pretty good savings to me over the long term. What's $55 vs $20 over the course of a year?

Additional plus: I don't have to spend time bleeding my brakes between sessions or after a track day.

Another plus: Project Mu G-Four is Teal in color. It turns brown as it deteriorates, giving you a visual indicator of when to change it.

I somewhat shuttered, after I bought the fluid and in the video I am doing I make mention of the high cost. But this sums it up really. When you are on the track and you are stopping hard from over 100MPH finish your session and your pedal feel is still excellent at the end of the day and you don't have to worry about bleeding again before your next session or before your drive home that extra money soon becomes worth it.

[celica73]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

2: When you bleed your brakes you don't need to bleed the whole system. About 6 pumps out of each caliper and you're fresh. And you can bleed the rear calipers half as often as the fluid back typically doesn't see as much heat and doesn't degrade as often.

Does not compute.

The biggest evil for brake fluid is moisture. Where do you think the moisture gets in? It's not at the caliper, that's sealed. The moisture gets in at the reservoir cap. Consider everything in the reservoir contaminated after 2-3 months.

[Hanakuso]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

2nd benefit of ATE is that it's blue. You KNOW when the old fluid out of the system and that the new fluid is in.

They also have the same exact brake fluid in normal amber color. It's good so you can go back and forth between brake fluid jobs.

I've been using ATE for 6-7 years. Cheap and never gave me a problem. I noticed the cheapest places to buy is either tirerack or amazon.

[ayau]

Originally Posted by Hanakuso

They also have the same exact brake fluid in normal amber color. It's good so you can go back and forth between brake fluid jobs.

I've been using ATE for 6-7 years. Cheap and never gave me a problem. I noticed the cheapest places to buy is either tirerack or amazon.

Has your lines/reservoir stained blue from using ATE Superblue?

[Hanakuso]

Originally Posted by ayau

Has your lines/reservoir stained blue from using ATE Superblue?

I haven't used it in the FRS yet, but my S2000 I didn't noticed any stains. If so, it would be easy to clean up.

[CSG Mike]

ATE Superblue stains the reservoir, so it's difficult to see the color without opening the cap and possibly taking out the filter.

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by celica73

Does not compute.

Consider everything in the reservoir contaminated after 2-3 months.

Is this fact? Should I be replacing my fluid every 3 months regardless of track duty?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Is this fact? Should I be replacing my fluid every 3 months regardless of track duty?

We recommend replacing your fluid whenever it feels sub-par.