topping off oil for track days?

[evanescent03]

i'm new here, but i did look around for an answer before starting a thread. I have seen some concerns about oil starvation (especially when using stickier tires). I really hate destroying street tires in a day or so at the track so i am looking at Advan AO52s, NT01, Pilot Sport Cup2s. But then it makese me slightly worried about this theoretical risk.

So, are you guys topping off throughout the day or just at the beginning of the weekend? seeing much consumption? i'm not used to checking oil all that often but i guess i'll make that part of my routine between session.

Thanks so much and really looking forward to getting this thing out on the track!

Matt

[eyeballs]

If it's foamy when hot it's too high. I've yet to own a car that an extra 1/4 qt caused an issue. Usually from "L" to "H" is 1 qt. If you're 3/4 to the "H" then add 1/4 qt. No need to overthink this.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by eyeballs

If it's foamy when hot it's too high. I've yet to own a car that an extra 1/4 qt caused an issue. Usually from "L" to "H" is 1 qt. If you're 3/4 to the "H" then add 1/4 qt. No need to overthink this.

do you find yourself adding throughout a weekend? and yeah - probably just paranoid but figured i'd ask to see how neurotic other people are about it ... normally i make sure the car is safe and then just send it so good to hear.

[EndlessAzure]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

i'm new here, but i did look around for an answer before starting a thread. I have seen some concerns about oil starvation (especially when using stickier tires). I really hate destroying street tires in a day or so at the track so i am looking at Advan AO52s, NT01, Pilot Sport Cup2s. But then it makese me slightly worried about this theoretical risk.

So, are you guys topping off throughout the day or just at the beginning of the weekend? seeing much consumption? i'm not used to checking oil all that often but i guess i'll make that part of my routine between session.

Thanks so much and really looking forward to getting this thing out on the track!

Matt

Oil starvation has more to do with pumping efficiency and flow rather than simply oil level. This is why many feel a full fledged air-radiator oil cooler is important for tracking on 1st gen cars. It helps keep the oil temperature at a range where the viscosity isn't too thin, which could lead to low engine oil pressure (which indicates poor pumping and lubrication).

Just keep it within the full and min lines on the dipstick, and you've done your part as far as having enough oil capacity

My engine happens to be a typical leaky Subaru engine, so I tend to keep my oil level at about 1/2 on the dipstick when I track. I find that if I fill up to full for a track day, the engine will lose 1/4 to a 1/2 quart right after the track day before stabilizing. Therefore, that's about the expectation you should have for oil consumption after a track day. Just keep your eye on it; it's not going to lose a whole quart out of no where in the middle of a track day (unless you whack the oil pan or blow a hole in your block)


The actual criteria that Subaru/Toyota use for oil loss before indication of an issue is pretty generous. It's something like 1qt per 3000 mi of normal driving.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

I really hate destroying street tires in a day or so at the track so i am looking at Advan AO52s, NT01, Pilot Sport Cup2s. But then it makese me slightly worried about this theoretical risk.

Get lower grip tires that don't fall apart at the track?

Have you looked at GT Radial SX2s?
260 tw, ~1 G grip, don't fall apart on track during 20+ minute sessions.

[evanescent03]

Appreciate the feedback! I haven’t put much thought into any of this before … just used the recommended “track” oil and I’ve never had issues with consumption or anything. Pretty fortunate but I know ignorance is bliss sometime. Which can be bad … or blissful haha

I’ll probably stay away from the NASCAR tracks as part of my mitigation strategy and make sure I use appropriate oil weights.

Originally Posted by EndlessAzure

Oil starvation has more to do with pumping efficiency and flow rather than simply oil level. This is why many feel a full fledged air-radiator oil cooler is important for tracking on 1st gen cars. It helps keep the oil temperature at a range where the viscosity isn't too thin, which could lead to low engine oil pressure (which indicates poor pumping and lubrication).

Just keep it within the full and min lines on the dipstick, and you've done your part as far as having enough oil capacity

My engine happens to be a typical leaky Subaru engine, so I tend to keep my oil level at about 1/2 on the dipstick when I track. I find that if I fill up to full for a track day, the engine will lose 1/4 to a 1/2 quart right after the track day before stabilizing. Therefore, that's about the expectation you should have for oil consumption after a track day. Just keep your eye on it; it's not going to lose a whole quart out of no where in the middle of a track day (unless you whack the oil pan or blow a hole in your block)


The actual criteria that Subaru/Toyota use for oil loss before indication of an issue is pretty generous. It's something like 1qt per 3000 mi of normal driving.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by timurrrr

Get lower grip tires that don't fall apart at the track?

Have you looked at GT Radial SX2s?
260 tw, ~1 G grip, don't fall apart on track during 20+ minute sessions.

Well I’ve read a bit about tires and you know how it goes, read four glowing reviews and the hear about someone who had a tire chunk apart or something after “normal track use and would never recommend them” (was leaning towards Azenis 660 before seeing some pretty negative reviews including photos). So figured I’d go with something that seemed really track proven … I may do pilot sport cup 2s but I’ll take a look at the SX2s also. I’m well aware of the fact that negative reviews are over represented compared to favorable reviews so I’ll probably just pick something available and go for it.

[TommyW]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

Well I’ve read a bit about tires and you know how it goes, read four glowing reviews and the hear about someone who had a tire chunk apart or something after “normal track use and would never recommend them” (was leaning towards Azenis 660 before seeing some pretty negative reviews including photos). So figured I’d go with something that seemed really track proven … I may do pilot sport cup 2s but I’ll take a look at the SX2s also. I’m well aware of the fact that negative reviews are over represented compared to favorable reviews so I’ll probably just pick something available and go for it.

think seriously about NT01’s.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

Well I’ve read a bit about tires and you know how it goes, read four glowing reviews and the hear about someone who had a tire chunk apart or something after “normal track use and would never recommend them” (was leaning towards Azenis 660 before seeing some pretty negative reviews including photos). So figured I’d go with something that seemed really track proven … I may do pilot sport cup 2s but I’ll take a look at the SX2s also. I’m well aware of the fact that negative reviews are over represented compared to favorable reviews so I’ll probably just pick something available and go for it.

Probably hundreds of people on this forum have been using SX2s for track days at this point, and many of them still use and enjoy those. This is a "spec" tire for many 86 Cups in the US.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

Well I’ve read a bit about tires and you know how it goes, read four glowing reviews and the hear about someone who had a tire chunk apart or something after “normal track use and would never recommend them” (was leaning towards Azenis 660 before seeing some pretty negative reviews including photos). So figured I’d go with something that seemed really track proven … I may do pilot sport cup 2s but I’ll take a look at the SX2s also. I’m well aware of the fact that negative reviews are over represented compared to favorable reviews so I’ll probably just pick something available and go for it.

How much experience do you have on track? Over tiring early is a mistake that can stunt your growth as a driver.

I have never had oil consumption on this car, I run it at the full mark.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

How much experience do you have on track? Over tiring early is a mistake that can stunt your growth as a driver.

I have never had oil consumption on this car, I run it at the full mark.

I have just enough experience to be dangerous lol jk… safety first. About 12yrs with ups and downs for seasons but have done 20-30 days over the past 2 years. My last couple Camaros (SS1LEs) I ran the Super car 3s which were awesome. i destroyed the stock tires on a 718S in a two days (1 day each at Sonoma and Laguna Seca). I also wrecked the stock tires on an Audi S3 after one day at Thunderhill … I’m not a hot shoe looking for sponsors but I do push my cars pretty hard and probably don’t respect my tires enough.

That said, I went with some pilot sport cup 2s this time… discount tire’s site was geeking out so I gave up on the advans and bought these from … Costco

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

I have just enough experience to be dangerous lol jk… safety first. About 12yrs with ups and downs for seasons but have done 20-30 days over the past 2 years. My last couple Camaros (SS1LEs) I ran the Super car 3s which were awesome. i destroyed the stock tires on a 718S in a two days (1 day each at Sonoma and Laguna Seca). I also wrecked the stock tires on an Audi S3 after one day at Thunderhill … I’m not a hot shoe looking for sponsors but I do push my cars pretty hard and probably don’t respect my tires enough.

That said, I went with some pilot sport cup 2s this time… discount tire’s site was geeking out so I gave up on the advans and bought these from … Costco

Oh shit, yeah you got a lot of seat time then. I mean, what are you looking for out of a set of tires? Hot lap, or just trying to get consistent performance out of a tire during a session? The Nt01's are not any faster than the super 200's that are out there, but you can put in more consistent laps with them as they will hold up to the heat. I have been contemplating them. Tires like the A052 or RT660 are hot lap tires. Bring them up to pressure/temp, put in a flyer, cool them down. A 200TW like the RS4 will tolerate a full session but are slower. SX2's are slower still, but wear better and will tolerate a session, they are also fun to slide around on. It really depends on what you are trying to do and if you are trying to fit within a set of rules.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

Oh shit, yeah you got a lot of seat time then. I mean, what are you looking for out of a set of tires? Hot lap, or just trying to get consistent performance out of a tire during a session? The Nt01's are not any faster than the super 200's that are out there, but you can put in more consistent laps with them as they will hold up to the heat. I have been contemplating them. Tires like the A052 or RT660 are hot lap tires. Bring them up to pressure/temp, put in a flyer, cool them down. A 200TW like the RS4 will tolerate a full session but are slower. SX2's are slower still, but wear better and will tolerate a session, they are also fun to slide around on. It really depends on what you are trying to do and if you are trying to fit within a set of rules.

No rules constraints … just track days with Chin/HOD/PCA trying to go 20min without getting super greasy or chunking apart … I used to be able to run my SC3s hard for 30-40min with an occasional 1/2 lap cool down before hammering it again in the Camaro. That car was heavy though. I’ll run the sport cup 2s and go up/down from there. Being a lighter and pretty low torque car I’m really interested to see how it does. I’m not positive I’ll keep it a real long time so holding off on the other wheels, suspension stuff etc for now. i just didn’t want to struggle getting through a weekend with the primacies and stock pads so I figured I’d upgrade those at least (obv dot4 fluid too).

Thanks for the input .. pumped to try this thing out! Might try to head to road Atlanta in a few weekends .. if not then MidO and NCM in April

[14stu]

RS4's are the best non-competitive track tires. They're cheap and last for a long time while being fast enough to use at the track. It isn't uncommon to get 20days out of a set of RS4's (or even more if you don't mind running them after they're heat cycled).

Fill oil to the full line, replace as needed throughout the day. If you have to add more than a quart, find out why.