Oil Cooler for a DD with track days?

[itschris]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

It's B.S. Properly installed, outside of a rock strike, the next highest danger for catastrophic failure is from chafing. Tie up your shit, inspect it periodically, profit.

Out of curiosity, what do you make of this? Pic came from a facebook group, and from what it sounded like they had been running events for at least a year prior to the failure.

Is this just from improper hose installation? I would expect a larger portion of the hose to be mangled up if it backed out, so maybe it was never seated properly? The right fitting also looks like it wasn't tightened fully. That could support the poor installation theory.

I don't really know what I'm talking about, other opinions welcome.

[new2subaru]

For those concerned about running an oil cooler in colder climates


https://jacksonracing.com/product/fr...toroil-cooler/

[Dububster]

Originally Posted by Petah78

To the OP, I have looked into this issue myself as I am in the same situation as you. My car is mostly a DD with 3-5 track outings per season. But each outing only nets me around 60 miles (1 total running hour) of actual track driving. I have concluded that you have to take everyone's comment with a grain of salt and see what fits your use case and more importantly, climate. Adding an oil cooler is not without risks; leakages, over cooling components failing etc. And the constant reminder in the back of your mind to always be checking for leaks/failure points. I can see how this can be a pain and can weary for some.

You have 2 school of thoughts on this subject matter and have supporters on both sides arguing their case. I live in a climate where winter is harsh, road salt is used everywhere and -15F temp is not uncommon. Even as a factory car, for your average winter commute, oil temps rarely gets up to full operating temps (190f). I can't imagine a longer oil warm up period. But this is not the same for someone who lives in Florida and are not subjected to the same winter conditions.

If my car was a full blown track car, or something that was heavily tracked, or if I was not using my car in the winter, I would then consider adding an oil cooler. But from what I have read on these forums and talking to a few locals, I am not sure if I have seen enough evidence that a causally track driven car (which mine is) will benefit from an oil cooler. To clarify, I am not saying that an oil cooler is not beneficial while you are on the track, but will it bring harm/risks on the remaining 363 days of the year while you are just putting around town? Will these casual track events result in any engine problems for the life of the car? While I agree that high oil temp is not ideal, same can be argued for cold oil temps. Aside from the factory style oil cooler, all other forms of oil cooler does lengthen oil warm up times. OE didn't add an OE style oil cooler just for cooling, they also sped up the heat up times. In fact, does the OE style cooler even do much during track conditions? Our engines are designed to operate in a certain temp range, anything outside is not ideal. You just have to guage what works best for you.

I have driven a total of 120 track miles this summer on 2 separate outings. I just changed my 5w-30 oil and plan on sending it in to get an UOA to see how my engine is wearing. If it shows signs of elevated wear, I will reconsider an oil cooler. But that is only because I am now working from home and I no longer need to drive my car in the winter but again, only if my UOA says I need one. Good Luck.

Very very helpful post, thank you very much. It really helped bring everyone's points full circle for me. I'd love to hear about the results of your UOA. Also, running 5w-30 what temps were you seeing at the track?

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by itschris

Out of curiosity, what do you make of this? Pic came from a facebook group, and from what it sounded like they had been running events for at least a year prior to the failure.

Is this just from improper hose installation? I would expect a larger portion of the hose to be mangled up if it backed out, so maybe it was never seated properly? The right fitting also looks like it wasn't tightened fully. That could support the poor installation theory.

I don't really know what I'm talking about, other opinions welcome.

Yikes. Not sure what happened there. Proper installation is definitely key. It takes practice and attention to detail to make custom plumbing. I use the same style of hose and fitting. It looks like the nut may not have bitten into the hose enough to pull it across the barbs. I especially don't like how the hose is bent at the fitting. That's already a no-no.

I don't know, maybe I give others too much credit. I've been guilty of that in the past. 'Proper' is a huge qualifier.

[Petah78]

Originally Posted by Dububster

Very very helpful post, thank you very much. It really helped bring everyone's points full circle for me. I'd love to hear about the results of your UOA. Also, running 5w-30 what temps were you seeing at the track?

I plan on sharing that info. Here in Canada, it’s a bit painful/expensive to get Blackstone labs to do a UOA so i am still waiting for my kit from amsoil. I will post the results here when I get them back. The used oil has already been collected and sitting in a sealed glass jar in my garage.

On both of my track outings, my oil temp got up to 270F and I would back off. Took anywhere between 7-10 mins to get there. I likely have another outing in Sept and I will try lapping for 15-20mins to see if the temp will keep climbing.

[NLSP]

I also just started tracking my DD recently and also just planning to go a few times a year. I decided to install the Forester oil cooler as a minimum precaution. Just the fact that it warms up oil quicker is nice to have for a DD anyway, especially since you mentioned you frequently make short trips. It's inexpensive and relatively easy to install (went with the under-the-throttle body route). Also easy to inspect the connections if you're worried about potential leaks.

On the two track days I've gone out to so far, oil temp peaked at around 240F; weather was between 95F-104F. Which leads me to my next point...

Because my car is equipped with tires and pads that are more for spirited street use and not dedicated track, I was alternating 1-2 hot laps to 1 cool down lap to prevent brake fade, so I'm obviously not driving 10/10ths for the full 20 minute sessions that we had, so that helps with the oil temp as well. Track days are a casual/just-for-fun thing for me, so the cool down laps give me a break too; driving 10/10 for extended periods can be tiring.

So point being, driving style and the way your car is setup are also factors to consider.

If your scenario sounds like mine, the Forester oil cooler is great.

On the contrary, if you have dedicated track pads and sticky tires that will allow you to drive 10/10ths for most of the session, the Forester oil cooler may not be sufficient and the Jackson Racing unit would be more suitable.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They also added a cooler at the detriment of their margins to the FA24 for a reason. It's not because FA24's have higher oil temps.

This got me curious. Can you please elaborate what you meant?

Also I'd imagine FA24's do produce more heat at full power due to extra horses.
After all, heat is byproduct of making power.
I'm assuming FA24 isn't just magically more thermodynamically efficient.

Originally Posted by itschris

Out of curiosity, what do you make of this? Pic came from a facebook group, and from what it sounded like they had been running events for at least a year prior to the failure.

Is this just from improper hose installation? I would expect a larger portion of the hose to be mangled up if it backed out, so maybe it was never seated properly? The right fitting also looks like it wasn't tightened fully. That could support the poor installation theory.

I don't really know what I'm talking about, other opinions welcome.

Looks like a Series.Yellow 2017 BRZ? Does the owner's name start with F.?

Either way, I know someone who had a Series.Yellow 2017 BRZ and his name was F., and he had his oil cooler fail at T1 at Thunderhill on the first out lap of the day.
That happened before I decided to get an oil cooler for myself, so of course I was worried.
I asked him what he had and he said he had a cheap oil cooler that's known to have bad fittings, and he installed it himself with friends.

I personally went to a well known reputable local shop that specializes on 86's and they gave me a warranty on the install of a Jackson Racing cooler.

YMMV.

[itschris]

Originally Posted by timurrrr

Looks like a Series.Yellow 2017 BRZ? Does the owner's name start with F.?

Either way, I know someone who had a Series.Yellow 2017 BRZ and his name was F., and he had his oil cooler fail at T1 at Thunderhill on the first out lap of the day.
That happened before I decided to get an oil cooler for myself, so of course I was worried.
I asked him what he had and he said he had a cheap oil cooler that's known to have bad fittings, and he installed it himself with friends.

I personally went to a well known reputable local shop that specializes on 86's and they gave me a warranty on the install of a Jackson Racing cooler.

YMMV.

Yeah, pretty sure it's the same person. Never met them but saw the post. It's the MAPerformance kit, which I thought used Vibrant fittings. Do you know if 'first lap out' was also the first lap out after the installation?

I home-brewed mine, been totally trouble free but if there's something to learn from a failure I'd like to learn it.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by itschris

Do you know if 'first lap out' was also the first lap out after the installation?

No, it was a couple of years after.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They also added a cooler at the detriment of their margins to the FA24 for a reason. It's not because FA24's have higher oil temps..

All equal, (same plumbing, oil paths, pump, lack of oil cooler, etc.), it wouldn't be surprising if the FA24 would have seen higher oil temps given greater displacement and power. So yeah, that *could* be one reason.

Main reason is likely the same as why they have this type of oil cooler on Foresters, which are not likely to become track cars: Quicker oil warmup in cooler/colder temps.
Another reason could be they can say "now it has an oil cooler!" which in light of all the boo-hoo-hooing over 270-275F temps on this forum is at least some consideration for them, I bet.
And it wouldn't be a bad idea for them to ensure that oil temp is cool enough that running the specified 0w20 oil wouldn't be problematic at higher oil temps while tracking.

Anyway, it's a part for them that's off-the-shelf and doesn't occupy a whole lot of space, tons of experience building cars with it, so not that big a deal to implement and not a big cost impact to them.
For sure the OEM-installed oil cooler is going to be a lot less problematic on the new car than aftermarket oil coolers have been on 1st-gens.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Petah78

On both of my track outings, my oil temp got up to 270F and I would back off. Took anywhere between 7-10 mins to get there. I likely have another outing in Sept and I will try lapping for 15-20mins to see if the temp will keep climbing.

When I first took my car to the track, I figured I'd be getting an oil cooler but wanted to see what oil temps did for my usage first. 1st session I watched oil temp climb steadily to 270F indicated and honestly up to that point I assumed that yeah, I'd *have* to get an oil cooler. Was watching it and ready to back off and come in, but it quit climbing at just over 270 and held. I keep an eye on it every time I'm on track, it always holds just over 270F indicated, even in 95F ambient temps.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by ZDan

I keep an eye on it every time I'm on track, it always holds just over 270F indicated, even in 95F ambient temps.

The OP is in SF Bay Area, where many people go to tracks like Thunderhill and Buttonwillow, where "95F ambient temps" at night are not unheard of.

I personally logged 110F ambient temp and 255F oil temp post cooler at Thunderhill in early June.

[NoHaveMSG]

Oil coolers, like most parts, are not install and forget. I check mine regularly(along with the rest of the car) and have had a fitting come loose.

[CSG Mike]

Don't forget, heat exchange with the environment happens *at the cooler*.

If you don't have some sort of oil cooler aka radiator for the oil (heat exchanger), your heat exchange with the environment, for your oil, is literally conducting through the engine block, and then radiating into the engine bay.

Ambient temps and oil temps on track have very little correlation without a heat exchanger.