Big Mistake

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by einzlr

Thank you for this info (entire post)!!! Can you make a brake pad recommendation for someone who uses the car for semi-frequent twisties drives on public roads and *occasional* track days?

Two sets of pads (and rotors if you prefer or your pad choice warrants it). IMO don't compromise on pads by running a "dual use" pad. Although I've been running track pads on the street for the last 4200 miles but I don't suggest it.

[Andor]

I can't believe no one has said this yet, but the number one thing I would be doing is getting an oil cooler.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Andor

I can't believe no one has said this yet, but the number one thing I would be doing is getting an oil cooler.

I don't think anyone has data logged oil temps on track yet but brake pads and fluid are a minimum requirement IMO. Oil cooler goes in the nice to have category for me.

[Andor]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

I don't think anyone has data logged oil temps on track yet but brake pads and fluid are a minimum requirement IMO. Oil cooler goes in the nice to have category for me.

So just because no one has data logged it, it's probably fine... right? Sound logic. All performance vehicles doing track work in anything other than COLD weather NEED an oil cooler. In my opinion this car should have one from factory. I suggest you look into the oil cooler threads.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Andor

So just because no one has data logged it, it's probably fine... right? Sound logic. All performance vehicles doing track work in anything other than COLD weather NEED an oil cooler. In my opinion this car should have one from factory. I suggest you look into the oil cooler threads.

Did I say it wasn't a good idea? I'd rather avoid glazing pads and boiling fluid, which would result in a serious crash, than make sure I cover oil temps first. This thread is about what he should do first, and for track use the clear answer is brake pads/fluid.

What oil temps are cars seeing on track? I'm used to over 300 degrees in florida on cars with smaller coolers, 270 or so with large coolers.

[dsgerbc]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

I don't think anyone has data logged oil temps on track yet but brake pads and fluid are a minimum requirement IMO. Oil cooler goes in the nice to have category for me.

Logging max oil temp is easy, so I'm surprised people haven't done it yet.

On topic - I don't plan on upgrading rubber. I go to track to have fun, and so far this car is plenty fun on stock rubber.

So, I might actually be picking up stock rubber people are getting rid of with the purpose of shredding it on the track.

[BlaineWasHere]

I see you're local to me, why don't you come out to some AutoX events first and get your feet wet (wetter?) with the car!

[coolhandluke]

Originally Posted by GoSharks

... I now want to try a few track events. In my area, the tracks are Thunder Hill, Infineon Raceway, and Laguna Seca...

I'm in the San Fran area. Let me know if you plan to make it to any of the tracks above. I'l do my best to attend-hopefully as a driver.

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by einzlr

Thank you for this info (entire post)!!! Can you make a brake pad recommendation for someone who uses the car for semi-frequent twisties drives on public roads and *occasional* track days?

The best is to have two independent brake pads such as Carbotech Bobcats (1521) and Carbotech XP10. Track pads are always on the CSG BRZ and my personal S2000 CR even though a lot of street miles are tossed onto them. They howl, scream, etc, but the initial bite, the fade resistance, and modulation are much better than OEM or OEM equivalent pads even when they're cold! Contrary to popular belief, track pads work fine in the cold, just not as well as when they're in the optimum operating temperature. The downside with running the track pads in cool/cold temperatures is the increase wear on the rotors and pads. Does that matter? Not exactly. The CSG BRZ has been through 14+ track days and 8000+ miles on a set of Carbotech XP10/XP8 combo in a short time frame of 2.5 months. The brake fluid hasn't been changed yet although the pedal is starting to feel a little softer than when first swapped out the factory fill. Another setup to try is the Project Mu HC+800. It is a great crossover pad that is about 70% of a track pad with full street capabilities. It won't take the heat very well at full track conditions, but I believe they will satisfy your aspirations for now. PM me if you want more information on pad selections (too much information to cover).

On a side note, the oil cooler would be an excellent addition to the BRZ/FRS motor since this motor runs HOT! It's a nice to have (like Dave said), but not an ABSOLUTE necessity. We're running 5W30 Motul 300V and it has helped up no problem at WOT on track. No performance issues even after a 110F day at ACS where you're basically 100% throttle 80% of the time on a 2 minute track.

To summarize, the list of priority for must haves should be:
1. Brake fluid and brake pads
2. Crash bolts
3. EHP Tires

Nice to haves:
1. Exhaust (sounds cool)
2. Oil cooler (oil temps are high, but not as high as one would think)
3. More power
4. Suspension

Power, suspension, bracing, etc. are nice to have but not necessary until the car becomes the limiting factor. CSG has taken the BRZ to new heights every single time we go out to the track. Small tweaks to the system makes for huge gains. The BRZ/FRS is a very good car out of the box so drive it for what it's worth with the stated setup.

[einzlr]

Dave and David - THANK YOU for the info!! :happy0180:

David, yes please, I will be pm'ing you later; kinda in a rush ATM lol

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Two sets of pads (and rotors if you prefer or your pad choice warrants it). IMO don't compromise on pads by running a "dual use" pad. Although I've been running track pads on the street for the last 4200 miles but I don't suggest it.

Is that for the same reasons David mentioned - because of cold performance and they screech and it's annoying, or are there other reasons as well?

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

I don't think anyone has data logged oil temps on track yet but brake pads and fluid are a minimum requirement IMO. Oil cooler goes in the nice to have category for me.

If you add an oil cooler without upgrading your brake fluid/pads wouldn't the brakes overheat way before the oil anyway?

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by coolhandluke

I'm in the San Fran area. Let me know if you plan to make it to any of the tracks above. I'l do my best to attend-hopefully as a driver.

Go get yourself a car out there first Ryan.LostCause...

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by einzlr

Is that for the same reasons David mentioned - because of cold performance and they screech and it's annoying, or are there other reasons as well?

Basically. They make noise and dust a lot. I agree with him as well for most track pads, cold performance is just fine. Some track pads (really high temp range pads) do suffer a bit at cold temps but they get hot enough quickly enough to not be much of an issue. Many track pads also eat rotors alive if you use them on the street.

Personally I don't mind the noise, nor do I care if my wheels/car are clean, so depending on my level of laziness after an HPDE will determine whether or not I change the pads back out.. Since the first track day I've left the track pads in so far though.. then again my rotors are basically dead now. My fault for not switching rotors with carbotech is some peoples opinion, heat related issues IMO. Either way, they are dead at 10k and I'm replacing everything up front.

If you add an oil cooler without upgrading your brake fluid/pads wouldn't the brakes overheat way before the oil anyway?

Oil can, in my other cars at least, hit 300F in Florida within a few laps, but that's not a point good oil will fail at. We run those temps in the Integra chump car for 14-24 hours straight (and often the gauge is pegged past 300F). Sure, it's not a BRZ, but 300F while not ideal doesn't scare me.

Boiled fluid and/or glazed pads does. I'd rather lose a motor than the entire car or my life. Over dramatization here.. yeah, but the point is I'd rather have brakes than cooler oil

Good info from David up there

[einzlr]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Basically. They make noise and dust a lot. [snip]

Thanks! I really appreciate the info. I'm I guess an advanced beginner at the track; did a handful of lapping days with an instructor a few years ago and want to get back into it. That was in the M Coupe which needed no mods to go back and forth from street to track without flinching, so now I'm trying to figure it all out in the case of a car that needs a little more attention to what it's being used for.

[Racecomp Engineering]

Brakes, alignment, seat time.

Tires are tricky....if you go with a "track" tire early on you won't learn as much. And with a stickier tire you will want at least some suspension work, even just a good set of springs. You'll have a lot more grip and thus want to control it a little more.

A good streetable sporty tire will do well though....resist the temptation to go superwide.

Focus on learning and not times.

- Andrew