Blew my motor

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by SoCal80six

Heard you were going back to stock cr your having outfront do your build correct?

I've been working with Outfront for close to a year and a half on the FA20.
I'm finally testing one of the closed deck blocks. We tried a new sleeve design first now the closed deck with head stud upgrades. I can honestly say there is a real difference in the way it runs. More torque and better idle qualities then the 10.5 sleeved motor.. I have to put a few miles on the closed deck then I will be on the dyno around the 20th of May. I don't think 700hp + will be a issue.

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by GsxrMe

I kinda agree with frs Justin, in the fact. When I lowered my CR on my hayabusa to 9:1, I felt the bike was a gsxr 600 before boost. When I hit boost, snap.... it was nasty, nasty, nasty.

I think the tuner can advance timing with the much lower CR to help before boost and start to pull timing as needed as the turbo starts to spool. The plus side to lower CR is just less room for error and with valve and piston clearance. Also with lower CR we can run 93octane at much high hp.

For the people running a gtx28 the factory CR with stronger rods and valves might be idle but for the members running much larger turbos such as the gtx30 I or gtx35s with hp goals over 400, I'd say lower CR is required.

Find your hp goal and talk to a real tuner that has great reviews not just a ecutek stamp on the ecutek website.

I'm still intrested in what psi this motor was blow at.

On my 10.5 motor I went 644whp 521wtq but it came on like a 2stroke dirt bike. It would creep up to 3800 rpm and start to go crazy till you let off the gas I hit 8400 a couple of times. It hit super hard but I'm running a twin scroll t4 gen2 6266 on it. Delicious tuning did the tuning on it. I don't see this engine having any problems with this closed deck going 35 psi. I'm going to talk to Jeremy about building a test motor out of my spare parts and just boost it til it blows......Then we will have answers. I need a spare set of heads, rods, and a crank....

[SoCal80six]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

I've been working with Outfront for close to a year and a half on the FA20.
I'm finally testing one of the closed deck blocks. We tried a new sleeve design first now the closed deck with head stud upgrades. I can honestly say there is a real difference in the way it runs. More torque and better idle qualities then the 10.5 sleeved motor.. I have to put a few miles on the closed deck then I will be on the dyno around the 20th of May. I don't think 700hp + will be a issue.

Let me know how it is when finished and some pros and cons. Definitely want to know more about built with stock cr!!

[#maverick#]

I think I am going with 12.5:1 in my closed deck as well. Less boost to make the same power is going to equal lower temperatures, thats my way of thinking atleast. I am going for 800+

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by #maverick#

I think I am going with 12.5:1 in my closed deck as well. Less boost to make the same power is going to equal lower temperatures, thats my way of thinking atleast. I am going for 800+

Well if my math is right that's 36PSI for 807hp. Outfront says their V4 EJ block has taken 50PSI so that would be 1030hp on your FA20........Isn't your Turbo rated at 900hp? That's 42 PSI to hit 902HP... Question is how much boost you want to run.....

[SoCal80six]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

Well if my math is right that's 36PSI for 807hp. Outfront says their V4 EJ block has taken 50PSI so that would be 1030hp on your FA20........Isn't your Turbo rated at 900hp? That's 42 PSI to hit 902HP... Question is how much boost you want to run.....

Shit!! Let's hope everything goes good keep us updated I just ended up getting a 10.1 cr and can feel the difference ahah. The only thing I was worried about on running stock cr was how much boost can you run... but with the stock cr the is less room for mistakes with tune correct?

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by SoCal80six

Shit!! Let's hope everything goes good keep us updated I just ended up getting a 10.1 cr and can feel the difference ahah. The only thing I was worried about on running stock cr was how much boost can you run... but with the stock cr the is less room for mistakes with tune correct?

The two main things I noticed between 12.5 and 10.5 is 10.5 has less torque from 1000 to 3000 RPM it's livable but it is a difference you can feel. The other thing is the power on a 10.5 motor comes on hard and fast when the 12.5 is smoother and broader. on WOT to make the same power 10.5 to 12.5 is about 3.2 psi less on the 12.5. I will confirm on dyno tune coming up.
Running a lower compression has a lot of pros and cons as listed above.

Try not to get caught up in the boost numbers game. 640 hp at 29PSI is the same as 640 HP at 25.8 PSI. It's not the boost that kills a motor its the pressure boost makes in the cylinder. It takes the same pressure in the cylinder to make the 640HP no matter how much boost is applied..... Example if you have a glass and you want 6 inches of water in it and the glass is empty you add 6 inches of water to the glass. (10.5)
Now take the same glass pour a inch of sand in it (12.5) to get 6 inches of water in the glass you add 5 inches of water. Both glasses still have a 6 inch level even tho you only added 5 inches to the last glass....
Granted this is a very simplified way of explaining it but makes the point to a degree.......

Now let me blow your mind a little lol 20PSI on a 6266 is not the same as 20PSI on a 5858.... but this is a another discussion best saved for later lol.....

[SoCal80six]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

The two main things I noticed between 12.5 and 10.5 is 10.5 has less torque from 1000 to 3000 RPM it's livable but it is a difference you can feel. The other thing is the power on a 10.5 motor comes on hard and fast when the 12.5 is smoother and broader. on WOT to make the same power 10.5 to 12.5 is about 3.2 psi less on the 12.5. I will confirm on dyno tune coming up.
Running a lower compression has a lot of pros and cons as listed above.

Try not to get caught up in the boost numbers game. 640 hp at 29PSI is the same as 640 HP at 25.8 PSI. It's not the boost that kills a motor its the pressure boost makes in the cylinder. It takes the same pressure in the cylinder to make the 640HP no matter how much boost is applied..... Example if you have a glass and you want 6 inches of water in it and the glass is empty you add 6 inches of water to the glass. (10.5)
Now take the same glass pour a inch of sand in it (12.5) to get 6 inches of water in the glass you add 5 inches of water. Both glasses still have a 6 inch level even tho you only added 5 inches to the last glass....
Granted this is a very simplified way of explaining it but makes the point to a degree.......

Now let me blow your mind a little lol 20PSI on a 6266 is not the same as 20PSI on a 5858.... but this is a another discussion best saved for later lol.....

Ahah thanks for breaking it down lol keep us updated when you throw it on the dyno!!

[GsxrMe]

What's the limitations of e85 with a build motor using 12.5cr? Fuel is always a factor based off of CR for sure.

Can one hit 500+ using stock CR with e85? If I recall 9:1 blocks can.

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by GsxrMe

What's the limitations of e85 with a build motor using 12.5cr? Fuel is always a factor based off of CR for sure.

Can one hit 500+ using stock CR with e85? If I recall 9:1 blocks can.

Easy 500hp I hit 644whp on E85 and will shoot for 700+ Again a lot of factors are involved in in this... I know guys pushing 1500hp with V8s on E85

[#maverick#]

Originally Posted by GsxrMe

What's the limitations of e85 with a build motor using 12.5cr? Fuel is always a factor based off of CR for sure.

Can one hit 500+ using stock CR with e85? If I recall 9:1 blocks can.

There are people hitting 500+ on stock motor with E85, the weak link being rods. So theoretically, using stock CR depending on turbo/Tuner you could easily hit 500+whp on Stock CR with less boost than on a lower CR motor. If you are keeping it open deck this plays in your favor since the open deck block is iffy around 30 psi give or take, not saying there arent people pushing more.

[GsxrMe]

Oh ok, seeing e85 isn't an issue how much as 93 octane push on stock CR?

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by GsxrMe

Oh ok, seeing e85 isn't an issue how much as 93 octane push on stock CR?

Even tho I have flex fuel I stick to E85. I haven't run gas run 91 or 93 in my car in over 2 years.... So I have no idea .....

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

The two main things I noticed between 12.5 and 10.5 is 10.5 has less torque from 1000 to 3000 RPM it's livable but it is a difference you can feel. The other thing is the power on a 10.5 motor comes on hard and fast when the 12.5 is smoother and broader. on WOT to make the same power 10.5 to 12.5 is about 3.2 psi less on the 12.5. I will confirm on dyno tune coming up.
Running a lower compression has a lot of pros and cons as listed above.

Try not to get caught up in the boost numbers game. 640 hp at 29PSI is the same as 640 HP at 25.8 PSI. It's not the boost that kills a motor its the pressure boost makes in the cylinder. It takes the same pressure in the cylinder to make the 640HP no matter how much boost is applied..... Example if you have a glass and you want 6 inches of water in it and the glass is empty you add 6 inches of water to the glass. (10.5)
Now take the same glass pour a inch of sand in it (12.5) to get 6 inches of water in the glass you add 5 inches of water. Both glasses still have a 6 inch level even tho you only added 5 inches to the last glass....
Granted this is a very simplified way of explaining it but makes the point to a degree.......

Now let me blow your mind a little lol 20PSI on a 6266 is not the same as 20PSI on a 5858.... but this is a another discussion best saved for later lol.....

yeah, because power made has nothing to do with boost. It has to do with airflow at the boost level.

boosting the air increases the volumetric efficiency so you can put more air into the same amount of space, but if you can only flow 42 lbs/min you will only make the power that the fuel and air of 42lbs a minute, whereas if you're flowing 60 lbs a minute at the same pressure, you'll be making the power that 60 lbs of air a minute and it's correct amount of fuel can make.

Jaden