What is the benefit of high grip tires for the street?

[Ohio Enthusiast]

I'm planning on getting new summer tires this season and wondering if I should get high grip tires (Max Performance or even Extreme Performance). The use case would be mainly street daily driving, with several canyon carving trips and some light HPDE and non-competitive autocross. Driving in the rain and standing puddles will happen.

Browsing forums of different cars it seems that there is a level of tires associated with each particular car. For example, the Lotus crowd use Extreme Performance pretty exclusively, while something like the MR2 Spyder use pretty much any brand/model of tire that fits with little consideration to grip other than preferring summer to all season tires. On here the consensus seems to be around Max Performance (MPS4S or ContiECS).

Thinking back to my usage of the car on the street, I don't really see a benefit of having significantly higher grip tires than the stock Primacies. I doubt I approach the limits of even those on the street, and grippier tires probably won't make me push harder on the street (i.e. won't really change my personal risk preference).

An example of this is a canyon drive I did with some Lotus enthusiast, where my stock BRZ on Primacies kept up perfectly fine in the corners with their Elises/Exiges/Evoras on Cup2, RE71 and A052 tires.

I know these kinds of tires have some drawbacks like lower tread life, higher cost to buy and harsher ride, but the only benefit for me that I can think of is a sportier feel from stiffer sidewall and tread blocks.

Is it just that I'm driving like a granny? Or is there an element of buying high grip tires "because racecar" while lower grip tires would work just as well?

[Cephas]

For me, even moving to an UHP A/S was an enormous upgrade from the stock Turanzas that came on my 86. More confident in the wet (which it basically always is here), way better braking, more predictable slides when they happen, etc.

IMO, going to a true summer tire 'round these parts is overkill for a daily driver, since the higher end all-seasons tend to be pretty darn close, wear longer, and tolerate the odd cold snap and wet conditions better.

[Desertnate]

On other vehicles I noted a big change when upgrading from an all season tire to a quality summer tire like the PS4S or Yoko V601.

I drive fairly conservatively on the streets too, but I noticed things like a more crisp turn in while maneuvering around corners, lane changes, etc and general better stability at any speed due to the grip and slightly stiffer sidewalls. On a twisty backroad the feeling of stability and agility was even greater since I was able to push it a bit more.

The real problem comes from those of us who live in areas where we see multiple seasons. Those great summer tires are totally unsuitable for the winter months and it drives a need for multiple sets of wheels/tires.

On my GTI I had two sets of wheels/tires. One for summer and autocross and one for winter. On my BMW I ended up with three sets. One for autocross/track, one for summer, and one for winter. It became a hassle to store all of those sets in the garage, although I didn't really mind doing the wheel swaps.

Depending on your life situation, multiple wheel/tire sets simply isn't possible. With performance all season tires getting so good, I'm going to simplify my approach. The plan right now is to run all seasons like DWS 06+ on my OEM wheels and then get a set for autocross/track. I'll probably be giving up a bit of performance to summer tires, but I think I can live with it on a daily basis.

[Ohio Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Cephas

For me, even moving to an UHP A/S was an enormous upgrade from the stock Turanzas that came on my 86.

Originally Posted by Desertnate

With performance all season tires getting so good, I'm going to simplify my approach.

That's an interesting argument. I currently have two sets of wheels, with performance winter tires on the stock wheels and the Primacies on RPF1s. I've read two main opinions on good all season tires - one that they are just as good as summer tires and another that they still miss out on things like progressiveness, steering feel, etc.
As I already have a winter set, I don't mind using summer tires. On the other hand, I don't do track and autocross enough to justify dedicated tires for that (even though I could relegate the RPF1 for that and run all seasons on the stock wheels).

Still, perhaps it does drive home the point that super grippy tires might not be needed for the street. I wonder if instead I should focus on feel, rather than outright grip - I know some Extreme Performance tires are known for excellent lap times but poor steering feel, for example.

[CedN]

Super wide grippy tyres for road use are fairly pointless imo, uncomfortable, and the car will not be as fun to drive, and expensive. I try to keep those for track use. On the road i want great steering tyres, that are predictable and not to grippy so i can feel the car move or an occasional slide

How about running a fairly good road tyre in similar to std tyre width, maybe try the new pilot sport 5.im thinking about trying those to replace my Goodyear f1 as3, which are pretty nice to drive on twisty roads with, but a bit to slidey and suffered on track. Wouldn't ever think of putting all season on a car like this, but everyone values things like steering feel differently. I have a spare set for winter use instead.

[Desertnate]

Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast

That's an interesting argument. I currently have two sets of wheels, with performance winter tires on the stock wheels and the Primacies on RPF1s. I've read two main opinions on good all season tires - one that they are just as good as summer tires and another that they still miss out on things like progressiveness, steering feel, etc.
As I already have a winter set, I don't mind using summer tires. On the other hand, I don't do track and autocross enough to justify dedicated tires for that (even though I could relegate the RPF1 for that and run all seasons on the stock wheels).

If you already have a set of winter wheel/tires, I don't see why you wouldn't go with summer tires for the warm months. While performance all seasons are good, I'll still admit a quality summer tire will still be better.

I'm going with all seasons because the winters have become mild enough I don't need winter tires any more and I can telework if things get truly awful. Also, I don't want more than one extra set of wheels/tires, so a set of track/autocross wheels win out. I can live with the compromise in performance by running all seasons on a daily basis. If I want ultimate grip on the road for some reason, I'll swap the wheels. It's a quick job.

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast

An example of this is a canyon drive I did with some Lotus enthusiast, where my stock BRZ on Primacies kept up perfectly fine in the corners with their Elises/Exiges/Evoras on Cup2, RE71 and A052 tires.

just take every article/column/post/thread on why everyone NEEDS winter tires, and apply the same reasoning to this concept.

tldr: you don't NEED any extreme performance tire for any weather. but if you slide off the road in anything less than a situation-specific-extreme-performance-tire while pushing the vehicle beyond that tires capabilities, everyone will tell you that you're a moron for not buying the better tires, and they would've saved you from yourself.

[TommyW]

You want to think about tire noise as much as anything else. It isn’t worth it for a street car to have more grip than necessary and having loud tires. Plus be careful not to go too wide. I found 225 to be the perfect width for the street.

[Ohio Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by soundman98

just take every article/column/post/thread on why everyone NEEDS winter tires, and apply the same reasoning to this concept.

tldr: you don't NEED any extreme performance tire for any weather. but if you slide off the road in anything less than a situation-specific-extreme-performance-tire while pushing the vehicle beyond that tires capabilities, everyone will tell you that you're a moron for not buying the better tires, and they would've saved you from yourself.

That's a very good point. On the other hand, I don't think most people recommend extreme performance tires solely for safety's sake, which led me to ask the original question.

Originally Posted by TommyW

You want to think about tire noise as much as anything else. It isn’t worth it for a street car to have more grip than necessary and having loud tires.

It's less of a concern for me since I almost only drive on the high way on the way to the twisties or the track. Under 40 MPH I doubt there's much of a difference, but I already don't like long highway drives so I'll consider noise as well, thanks!

Originally Posted by TommyW

Plus be careful not to go too wide. I found 225 to be the perfect width for the street.

Yep, the RPF1s are 17x7.5 so I'll probably stick to 215 or maybe 225. Definitely not any wider.

[radroach]

Benefit for regular city driving is that grippy summer tires are nicely affordable. Much cheaper than the stock Primacy.

There aren't too many downsides other than they aren't as fun trying to slide about. But the feel of grip helps driver confidence and raises the potential of the car quite noticeably, and actualizing on this can be more fun.

One downside I have noticed, you might get some additional tramlining or weird steering feel over low speed bumps or grooves in the pavement as your suspension wears and ages.

[sygfrid]

I live in Vancouver, Canada where we have lots of canyons & twisty back roads that I like to take for pleasure all-year round. I used to have Nokian WRG3 which is an All-Weather/4-Season tire. Though traction is quite good in the dry, wet, snow, & ice, it's no where near the performance of my MPS4S I use in the spring & early fall (Apr-Oct) & MP Alpin PA4 for mid-fall & winter (Nov-Mar). There's just confidence in stopping earlier, going faster, & being stable through the bends these dedicated Max Per. summers & winters as you can really feel the grip even on wet or snow/freezing temps.

I wouldn't go with Extreme Performance tires for streets/canyons as they tend to have lesser grip on the wet & they tend to aquaplane. Especially on canyons where the weather can change abruptly & you suddenly have inclines/declines that turn from dry to wet or from snowy to slushy, you really want to have that extra grip that Max Performance Summer & Performance Winter tires can deliver in order to have a safe & fun drive all-year round.

If you'll just be driving on relatively flat city streets at safe speeds, then there's no need for a major upgrade on your tires & all-seasons will be fine.

[Westen86]

What youre looking for is a 500TW All-Season. Anybody willing to ship ME a set of Continental SportContact 7's from out of the country?

[Lynxis]

If you don't hoon, then 99% of your driving will be within the limits of any streetable tire. The only real benefit is improved panic stop braking distances.

[Dzmitry]

I agree with several folks here on the idea that for DD, a more comfortable, less noisy, and a touch of fun ride brings more joy than extreme performance; as it is rarely obtained on the street. I think the pro's outweigh the con's in this type of situation. With A/S, you'll likely find cheaper tires that are still great. They'll likely be less noisy, which may come to play a significant role over time as you find yourself doing the average drive more often vs. a spirited one. They'll last longer, also contributing to the cheaper factor. They will likely be more comfortable if you do your research and get the right set - also contributing a good role to your regular DD drives. Lastly, they can be more playful - which I have learned to appreciate more with my usual DD drives. Originally, I too had thought I would want to go with more grip and enjoy the tighter quicker curves. But getting the tires to spin without much difficulty has made me realize I don't really want much more grip than that. I have already taken curves at "my comfortable limits" on the streets and haven't exceeded them when it comes to the tires, so there's no need.

This can obviously vary significantly based on the style of driving with each person. So in the end it's about what you enjoy more. But I would also like to add a side of caution when it comes to wanting extreme performance tires for the reason of better stability and grip in corners and such. If you're pushing the limits that far... you're likely not doing anything legal on the streets anyway, or possibly creating a more dangerous situation that you just don't need to create. This type of mindset has allowed me to settle on my choice of A/S tires.