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Old 07-19-2021, 04:08 PM   #2661
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Yep, that is what I am basing my comparison off of. I meant like a real analysis of incidents using telemetry and/or video overlays.

Oh gotcha. I think it would be wise to release but I doubt we will see. Maybe an overlay but I don’t think we will get telemetry.


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Old 07-19-2021, 04:49 PM   #2662
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It was in an IROC race at one of the ovals - Talladega or Daytona. . They ran two sprint races more or less back to back. Johncock punted Foyt in the first one. In the second Foyt was ahead of Johncock; he slowed enough to let GJ get ahead of him, waited until they got onto the backing got good run going and slammed into the back of GJ's car. Backed off and did it again. Second time Johncock spun up into the wall. As he was sliding down the track Foyt ducked underneath him and went by with his finger out the window.

When I was a kid I knew Foyt ever so slightly. In my memory he was not a very nice guy. I was just some shop rat hanging around but he tolerated me - a little. His dad was a really cool guy.

I like these racing stories,

The human side comes out , None are angels but most respect the other to be doing some clean racing but they all draw the line somewhere.
The rest of the season is where we will see if Mad Max has matured or will return to his former past driving into things…

As for Ham & Max they had already touched wheel in the straight, and seemed inevitable there would be a moment. The gloves were already off.

Perez & Kimi almost had same incident but Kimi lost out on that touch.



And Vettel figured out his destiny is in picking up the Garbage the fans left!
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Old 07-19-2021, 05:15 PM   #2663
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And you all know that would have been true! Because, sir LH 44 is the G.O.A.T. (god of all things)
Pretty much any pro sports association I can think of has a similar media created superstar cast as virtuos savior of the world. Whether it's the NBA, MLB, NFL, MLB, NHL, PGA, MLS, they all tend to stray from their primary role of entertainment into hectoring us into compliance with their woke agendas. And they wonder why their ratings have cratered.

I fully respect anyone's involvement in whatever legal activity they choose but in the case of multimillionaire pro athletes often living lifestyles contrary to their claimed beliefs, please leave us alone to enjoy watching your superhuman skills on display.

Oh, IMO Ham was in the wrong and his comment about being alongside Max wasn't just unsporting, but provably false given the video evidence. Max is a lucky boy to have walked away from it.
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Old 07-19-2021, 05:23 PM   #2664
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I like these racing stories,



And Vettel figured out his destiny is in picking up the Garbage the fans left!
As time goes by I become more and more convinced Seb is the real deal. A genuinely good guy. I am officially a fan boi.
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Old 07-19-2021, 06:42 PM   #2665
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I'd like to see an overlay image of Lewis's line every lap through that turn. Then see how much the lap in question differs from the others. Or even just an average of all laps other than the lap in question compared with that lap.

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Old 07-19-2021, 07:31 PM   #2666
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I'd like to see an overlay image of Lewis's line every lap through that turn. Then see how much the lap in question differs from the others. Or even just an average of all laps other than the lap in question compared with that lap.

Some of us may want an overlay of Max ONLY perfect line as well or at least from the sprint.

Well just to compare…

I suspect the data may have been lost when they packed the stuff away…
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Old 07-19-2021, 07:57 PM   #2667
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I'd like to see an overlay image of Lewis's line every lap through that turn. Then see how much the lap in question differs from the others. Or even just an average of all laps other than the lap in question compared with that lap.

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Saw an interesting vid (can't recall where) making the point that the "proper" racing line is often not the "winning" racing line. In my experience (long long ago and far far away) this is true. If everyone is on the perfect geometric racing line, you have a parade of cars (or bikes). Passing happens when one or both drivers deviate from the proper line either accidentally or intentionally. For example, an inside to outside and back switch is nowhere near proper, but done right can be very effective.

Yesterday, I'm convinced Lewis fucked up. It was an accident but he fucked up and let his front wing endplate sideswipe Max's rear tire. Lewis was nowhere near being able to complete a pass, wound up in "no man's land" and Max got punted. Lewis was close to a meter from the inside kerb. I'm really hoping he had so much push going on he couldn't get down there. I can't tell from the video I've seen if he did or not.
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Old 07-19-2021, 08:27 PM   #2668
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Saw an interesting vid (can't recall where) making the point that the "proper" racing line is often not the "winning" racing line.
Correct. The qualifying line is fastest and racing like will depend on traffic. The average driver may have 2 or 3 lines per corner and an F1 driver has several
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Old 07-20-2021, 03:07 PM   #2669
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Yesterday, I'm convinced Lewis fucked up. It was an accident but he fucked up and let his front wing endplate sideswipe Max's rear tire. Lewis was nowhere near being able to complete a pass, wound up in "no man's land" and Max got punted. Lewis was close to a meter from the inside kerb. I'm really hoping he had so much push going on he couldn't get down there. I can't tell from the video I've seen if he did or not.
I think it is less about could Lewis get closer to apex and more would his trajectory have left enough room outside for Max. There is nothing that says if the pass isn't on that you can't position your car to compromise your opponent.
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Old 07-20-2021, 03:10 PM   #2670
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I think it is less about could Lewis get closer to apex and more would his trajectory have left enough room outside for Max. There is nothing that says if the pass isn't on that you can't position your car to compromise your opponent.
He came in too hot and got understeer. Look at his trajectory after the incident. He was wayy off....
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Old 07-20-2021, 03:12 PM   #2671
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He came in too hot and got understeer. Look at his trajectory after the incident. He was wayy off....
Yes, I know. Some of that you can attribute to the contact but it doesn't look likely he would have had a full car width to the outside. It is about the same amount of space Max left him at Barcelona. Everyone keeps talking about the space he had at apex. That is why I am bringing it up.
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Old 07-20-2021, 05:07 PM   #2672
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Yes, I know. Some of that you can attribute to the contact but it doesn't look likely he would have had a full car width to the outside. It is about the same amount of space Max left him at Barcelona. Everyone keeps talking about the space he had at apex. That is why I am bringing it up.
I'll just leave this here.
I HATE F1's YT BTW.

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Old 07-22-2021, 05:32 AM   #2673
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I think it is less about could Lewis get closer to apex and more would his trajectory have left enough room outside for Max. There is nothing that says if the pass isn't on that you can't position your car to compromise your opponent.
Max would have been completely ahead at the exit though. Ham was on a tighter line, so his exit speed would have been much lower.
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Old 07-22-2021, 11:05 AM   #2674
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It would be interesting to look at the lap to lap overlays from Hamilton and Verstappen (and other drivers as well). I watched Jolyon Palmer's analysis and, while I find his analyses generally really informative, in this case I'm not completely convinced. And that's where the overlays would be useful. I have the impression that Copse is taken flatout. My traditional brain tells me that a traditional widest arc line should be close to the fastest way through it. Palmer is suggesting that Lewis was habitually apexing the corner very, very early. That's going to put him way wide on the exit. I'm curious. I see that Silverstone is a track with multiple lines through many of the corners. It would be interesting to see which drivers would choose to take which lines.
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