GT86 Collectors Car?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Caspeed

In my case I only need 1499 to be totaled. Judging by some of the posts I've seen it's more like 1450 by now.

Speaking of which, last week I saw an Alfa 4C that was crunched. Alot of carbon fiber all over the place.

Saw a late 90s 'Vette lightly clip a curb in sub zero temperatures one time. Fiberglass everywhere!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by bodayguy

The difference is the Twins were pretty much made to be modded.
In the 90s, Integra, 300ZX, etc. etc. cars were not put into a marketplace where the manufacturer knew it would be modded so much, that just happened, and without the huge aftermarket we see today.
A properly and tastefully modded Twin will be more valuable than a stock one, in my view. The stock car has too many weaknesses to need its "purity" intact, whereas an S2000 for example can often be ruined.

Define "tastefully modded". Tastes run a long and sometimes horrendous gamut. The "weaknesses" are also simply a matter of taste so that is not a true statement to apply to all.

[FRSupra]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Although I understand at an intellectual level that cars from the 90s could be collectable I totally miss the boat on and emotional level. To me they are all just "new" cars and no matter how great they may be I can not connect with a single one of them at a level where I would want to own it just to look at.

I think I understand what you mean by this. This is sort of how I feel about cars now. Although none of us have experienced a new NSX, I'm fairly confident I could never feel the same way about that car. Which brings me to your next point:

Originally Posted by Tcoat

The people that will want one of these in 30 years are the guys that had to give it up due to growing families or such other influences or the guys that wanted one now and just could not do it.

This is such perfect timing for you to mention this, as it helps me explain a little, the cars of the 90's which I grew up loving (i'm 26) and dreamed about were simply unattainable back then being so young. And coming of age where I am actually able to get one not just financially but also responsibly, it becomes harder to do so. There are plenty of cars I would chose over the FR-S (NSX, Supra, RX-7, MR2, etc) but the fact that we were all gifted with this car at this exact point in time sort of worked it's way into my life, and I'm sure there are others this is relevant to. Let me perfectly clear though, it was the fact that this car was so close in design and spirit to the 90's era cars that attracted me to this car to begin with. Yet after all this the most interesting part is how this car still manages to sort of stand alone on it's own sort of podium.

I may regret these words, but in a way this car gives you the cake and allows you to eat it to, if you understand what I mean.

Originally Posted by rice_classic

A mint Integra Type R just sold recently on Ebay for $43k... totally stock. However, the ITR most likely will be "collector" status before too long but most of them were ruined from theft, not just modding.

What was the whole ITR theft ordeal, I never really understood this.

[bodayguy]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Define "tastefully modded". Tastes run a long and sometimes horrendous gamut. The "weaknesses" are also simply a matter of taste so that is not a true statement to apply to all.

The torque tip at 3500 rpm is a weakness, and that's not a matter of taste.
The car benefits from more rubber on the road, that's not a matter of taste.
The exhaust looks wimpy in the rear fascia, because they knew a ton of buyers would replace it anyhow. Maybe a matter of taste, if you care.
There's no center arm rest, the plastic knee pads on the 2013's left drivers with bruises, the cheap plastic HVAC controls look like something from 1992, etc etc.

You can call it a perfect little angel if you wish, but it's just a car to me, and I'm not squeamish about addressing the faults.

[humdizzle]

Originally Posted by FRSupra

What was the whole ITR theft ordeal, I never really understood this.

1. they are easy to steal
2. that motor can be swapped into nearly any honda
3. honda owners have no problem buying shady parts

but back on topic. no i dont think the 86 will be a collector car. there are far too many of them.

a few modern collector cars on the market:
- bmw 1m
- 2001 bmw m coupe (s54 motor)
- 997 gt3, rs, rs 4.0
- 993 turbo
- any ferrari challenge, scuderia, speciale
- e30 m3
- challenger hellcat (last i saw they are still going for way more than msrp)
- ford gt

you could pick up any one of those cars, drive the crap out of it, and probably sell it for the same money if not more.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by bodayguy

The torque tip at 3500 rpm is a weakness, and that's not a matter of taste.
The car benefits from more rubber on the road, that's not a matter of taste.
The exhaust looks wimpy in the rear fascia, because they knew a ton of buyers would replace it anyhow. Maybe a matter of taste, if you care.
There's no center arm rest, the plastic knee pads on the 2013's left drivers with bruises, the cheap plastic HVAC controls look like something from 1992, etc etc.

You can call it a perfect little angel if you wish, but it's just a car to me, and I'm not squeamish about addressing the faults.

Ahhhh another "my opinion and preferences are fact" guy I see. Every single thing that you listed as "faults" don't bother 10s of thousands of other owners. That is the very definition of personal taste and just because you do not like them does not give you the privilege of speaking for everybody. You consider them problems that is great but don't tell me what I like and dislike.
I have zero issues with the dip and for the 1/2 a second it appears I can barely even notice it. There is a thread of 100+ pages here of people that love the stock tires. I for one couldn't care less about them one way or the other but they get the job done. I could give a flying fuck about armrests, knee pads or what the knobs are made of, etc.
I did think the car sits too high stock, the exhaust is way too quiet and that bloody sound tube makes it sound like a toy so I changed those things. There is no such thing as the perfect car for everybody but I am not nearly egotistical enough to think that my personal opinions make things faults that everybody hates.

[HUNTERANGEL121]

What are you people doing to get bruises?

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by FRSupra

What was the whole ITR theft ordeal, I never really understood this.

In one word (or one engine code): "B18C5". Like any other B-motor, that was easily swappable into about any other Honda/Acura of that era, the C5 was a highly desirable engine for a variety of reasons. The demand was so insanely high for C5 engines and transmissions that selling stolen parts (or parts from stolen cars) was easy and lucrative. I met several guys with C5 engines in their cars and I would say, "You know that's engine's most likely from a stolen car right?" Usually they would say something like, "yeah probably but it's mine now."

My father owned a black ITR and even though it lived in a garage he was constantly paranoid it would get stolen while he as work/dinner/movie etc. So he sold it and got an NSX so he doesn't have to worry about his fun car getting stolen.

The same phenomenon happened with S2000 seats, where once Civic ricers realized that the S2000 seats easily bolt in pretty soon everyone who owned a S2000 was getting their tops cut and seats stolen. On the S2kI.com forums they have groups of folks who monitor craigslist and flag every ad for S2k seats because if S2000 seats are for sale on CL, then it's a 99.99% chance they were stolen at some point. A little joke among S2000 owners I knew was the greeting: "Hey, nice S2000, so how long did you have it before your seats were stolen?" 3 personal friends had their seats stolen. I was lucky to not experience it while I owned my AP1.

[Fishbed77]

And coming of age where I am actually able to get one not just financially but also responsibly, it becomes harder to do so. There are plenty of cars I would chose over the FR-S (NSX, Supra, RX-7, MR2, etc) but the fact that we were all gifted with this car at this exact point in time sort of worked it's way into my life, and I'm sure there are others this is relevant to.

This is a fantastic point, and I am in the same boat as well.

Don't get me wrong - I love my recently-purchased 2013 FR-S in Whiteout, but there are far fewer choices today if you want a newish sports car (that can also be a daily driver) with low mileage, maybe a warranty, and a reasonable cost of ownership. Even more recent cars like the S2000 have already slipped out of this threshold. 350Zs are still out there, but un-abused low mileage cars are slipping away, 370s are still expensive and full of compromises, and V8 Mustangs and Camaros are overpriced for what they are.

[Scott@HKSUSA]

The FR-S will be collectible as long as there are people that want one but can't have one now. Over the next 10-15 years, mass interest in the car will wane, values will drop, and many will be taken off the road. After 10-15 years, all the people that wanted one but couldn't have one when they were new (either for practicality or financial reasons) will start seeking out nice examples to re-live their youth and values will start coming back up.

[fang_gt86]

Can't say for certain since the twin are just too common. But then the amount of people fawking up their car is just as common.

[MJones_RB]

I've watched enough car auctions on TV to realize that a car's value is determined by mileage and condition. You want a GT86 worth something in 20 years? Buy a Series 10 or Series 1.0, park it in your garage and never drive it. In 20 years put it up for sale and then you'll have something. I've seen 60's era Mustangs in great shape go for peanuts because of either too many miles, non-original paint or non-factory add-ons. Very strange standard, this collector car world.

[Mr.Impreza]

Who cares about the car becoming a collectors, enjoy it, but also take care of it, so in 20 years you will still have it and be able to enjoy it!

[FRSupra]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

In one word (or one engine code): "B18C5". Like any other B-motor, that was easily swappable into about any other Honda/Acura of that era, the C5 was a highly desirable engine for a variety of reasons. The demand was so insanely high for C5 engines and transmissions that selling stolen parts (or parts from stolen cars) was easy and lucrative. I met several guys with C5 engines in their cars and I would say, "You know that's engine's most likely from a stolen car right?" Usually they would say something like, "yeah probably but it's mine now."

My father owned a black ITR and even though it lived in a garage he was constantly paranoid it would get stolen while he as work/dinner/movie etc. So he sold it and got an NSX so he doesn't have to worry about his fun car getting stolen.

The same phenomenon happened with S2000 seats, where once Civic ricers realized that the S2000 seats easily bolt in pretty soon everyone who owned a S2000 was getting their tops cut and seats stolen. On the S2kI.com forums they have groups of folks who monitor craigslist and flag every ad for S2k seats because if S2000 seats are for sale on CL, then it's a 99.99% chance they were stolen at some point. A little joke among S2000 owners I knew was the greeting: "Hey, nice S2000, so how long did you have it before your seats were stolen?" 3 personal friends had their seats stolen. I was lucky to not experience it while I owned my AP1.

This is just crazy to me. The NSX to me is phenomenal, second to none. It's sort of humorous to hear you say that in your fathers case.

The civic scene is also something I will never understand.