Potential Cause of rumored GR86’s blown engine? Seal packing(RTV) was peeled off

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

I trust Subaru/Toyota designed it properly to not starve and die on track. The first gen was generally "fine" with the usage most second gens have seen. A few people have had them blow up just street driving.

From an engineering point of view, the RTV in the pickup is a *massive* red flag, it wasn't designed to deal with that restriction to flow. There's safety margin built in, especially since the 2nd gen pickup tube is so much better than the first gen's, but it can't handle one side of the box (and 1/4 of each other side) being blocked.

As I said above, they didn't fail on the engineering aspect, they sure did fail on the assembly.

Do I trust Subaru to make it right? Yes. Clearly we can't trust Toyota though...

There were around 50 failures recorded for the 13s. All due to oil starvation with silicone blockage the main culprit. Then there was the whole recall debacle with at least 100 more failures. This isn't a new issue to them. The new pickup is likely a result of those two issues.

The blocked passage is indeed obvious and in your face. That does not automatically make it the whole issue.
We don't know what Subaru is doing about warranty at this point. AGAIN not enough data to say. They may go the same route as Toyota and blame "abuse".

There are really two different subjects here. One is the fact that there is an obvious problem with the oil system of the engine. The other is how they are reacting to that issue for warranty.

[jacobe38]

https://www.motortrend.com/news/toyo...drifting-pics/

First R&T, now Motortrend. I imagine C&D will be next up?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

I did acknowledge that they changed the pickup for the better.

They didn't design it for a full blockage of one side of the pickup. When the RTV piles up it blocks parts of the other sides of the box too. One small chunk of RTV won't matter at least.

Actually the small chunks that you can't even see may be a bigger concern than all that gunk in the pictures. A small piece introduced to the oil passages anywhere after the filter (and yes it can happen as the whole engine is put together with that goop) will do more damage much faster than a partially blocked pickup. The 2013 issue was almost always a blocked oil channel which took out one bearing. The pickups may have had a little in them but they were not the bigger problem.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by jacobe38

https://www.motortrend.com/news/toyo...drifting-pics/

First R&T, now Motortrend. I imagine C&D will be next up?

5

[ABQautoxer]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

Which is exactly why my car will be sold after it's fixed (assuming it doesn't blow up before a recall is issued) because I'm not having that "what if" hanging over my head.


IMO they've pretty well killed the car for me and I'm a HUGE fan of the car. It makes me really sad.

Same

[Opie]

DocWalt & ABQautoxer....have your engines failed? If not, what are you having "fixed" before you sell?

From what I have seen there have been less than 10 reported failures in the US currently between both models....that's a pretty small percentage. (I'll get the true number of Subaru failures later today...still bet it is a small number).

[WolfpackS2k]

I'd caution people to take it easy with the fear mongering. You're being a bit ridiculous (IMO) and the only way you're gonna ease your fear is switching to some cheap ass old car with cheap engines (for when you pop one).

[otter]

GRM taking a more measured approach with some key extra info I hadn't seen yet about the dealership involved - https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ne...ngine-failure/

[Petah78]

Originally Posted by Opie

I'll get the true number of Subaru failures later today...still bet it is a small number.

That would be awesome if you can. I am assuming you have some sort of Suby hook up?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by otter

GRM taking a more measured approach with some key extra info I hadn't seen yet about the dealership involved - https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ne...ngine-failure/

Holy crap a site that I actually agree with! That is a rare beast indeed.

[DocWalt]

Originally Posted by Opie

DocWalt & ABQautoxer....have your engines failed? If not, what are you having "fixed" before you sell?

From what I have seen there have been less than 10 reported failures in the US currently between both models....that's a pretty small percentage. (I'll get the true number of Subaru failures later today...still bet it is a small number).

I posted video way back in the thread of the ridiculous quantities of excess RTV hanging off of my oil pan interface. When that breaks off (and it will) it will clog the pickup. buttttt my comment was specifically about this:

Subaru/Toyota are going to need to issue a recall/TSB to take the oil pan and timing cover off and remove the excess sealant and put it back together with the appropriate quantity. If during that process they find substantial quantities already on the oil pickup, I'd just sell the car. I'm not taking on the risk of having my engine blow up in six months or six years because the bearings maybe sustained damage.




I don't really understand what's so hard to understand about this.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Petah78

That would be awesome if you can. I am assuming you have some sort of Suby hook up?

He does.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by Opie

Did you miss the part about Subaru designing the pick up with a 5 sided screenbox to ensure proper oil flow in case of a partial blockedge. This is a specific difference of the 2.4 series of Subaru engines vs any other Subaru engine that used the old style of pickup shown below.

It wasn't designed as a "need", it was designed as a precaution.

Is it enough though with that amount of sealant? I am sure you have seen it too, but it takes a good amount of running at consistent low pressures to kill one of these things.

[otter]

My $0.02 - it's not a big deal for me personally to remedy the issue myself so I'm really not freaking out about it, but I get why it's a big concern for most. I'll be pulling my pan when I do my next oil change, cleaning things out, and resealing it correctly. Not going to bother with the timing cover because I assume most of the excess sealant will have already shed off. Might pull the pan again sometime next year to double-check for any more scraps. I'd much rather be proactive than wait for something catastrophic go wrong, have to interact with a dealer, and be without the car for an extended period of time.