COVID Developments and News

[wbradley]

Thanks to the high vaccination rates (82.3% double vaxxed and increasing in Toronto) they will slowly begin to lift more restrictions in Ontario. Restaurants, recreational facilities, personal services are all at partial capacity while they already opened sports venues full capacity. So, the push is to allow business the ability to sustain on an equal level asap.
I downloaded my vaccination passport QR code today and (fingers crossed) it looks like things are OK here so far despite the fall and schools opening.
Without vaccination mandates, EVERYONE would be restricted. Thankfully we have a choice not to be.

[p1l0t]

I've never had a job ask me if I have had the polio vaccine before...

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[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by 86TOYO2k17

because what cant be sped up is time itself. you can solve the equation faster, but testing still takes time

It depends on what you are testing for.

Yes, you are correct, you can't determine long term effects until the long term has passed, just as 9 women can't have a baby in one month.

However, if your goal is to do broad testing for reactions and short term effects, plus efficacy, you can speed that up by volume of testing, which we are well past at this point with the COVID vaccines.

So then it sounds like we are down to when is long term testing enough? One year, two years, twenty years? Every vaccine ever created could now have long term effects we are not aware of, if that amount of time hasn't passed.

The first COVID-19 trials started in March, 2020 so we are past the one year point.

[p1l0t]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

I've never had a job ask me if I have had the polio vaccine before...

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Nor a restaurant or movie theatre...

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[MyHybridBurnsGasAndTires]

yeah that's a great example of why vaccines mandates are great and have effectively stopped polio across almost the entire planet

you might have a point if there wasnt an ongoing pandemic

[Spuds]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

Nor a restaurant or movie theatre...

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Did you go to school at some point?

[MyHybridBurnsGasAndTires]

Originally Posted by Spuds

Reading between the lines of your argument (or at least attempting to), it sounds to me like you are suggesting we should wait two more years because we made that same mistake before. If that is not the case, why is this important to you?

his current debate tactic is concern trolling using argument from ignorance fallacy over and over in an effort to once again muddy the waters. there's nothing more to it.

[p1l0t]

Still is that the new way forward? To have our medical records ready for any ol stranger to review before entry?

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[86TOYO2k17]

Originally Posted by Spuds

I don't believe any COVID-19 mandates took effect before the first FDA approval.

Frankly, I don't care how long after approval a vaccine was mandated which is why I haven't bothered to look it up beyond pointing out that they were historically mandated well before there was anyone competent enough to approve it. You seem to be taking the concept of precedence a bit too literally here.

I believe the precedence argument is intended as a historical lesson. There was a terrible disease causing significant problems, an inoculation method was discovered to prevent/slow/reduce risk of the disease, and the leadership mandated that a group of people must be inoculated. It is told as a success story because the mandate worked, and we can see the data showing that.

Your argument is confusing success of the method with some arbitrary temporal information. Let's use your example, Polio. The vaccine was made, tested, and approved. How many more children died in the next two years because people did not voluntarily get them vaccinated? The vaccine didn't change in those two years, or even between trials and approval. It was just as safe and effective the day the final round of trials started as when it was mandated years later. The trials of that vaccine, not the years following, proved that the vaccine was safe and effective, and the approval verified that the appropriate trials were performed.

Reading between the lines of your argument (or at least attempting to), it sounds to me like you are suggesting we should wait two more years because we made that same mistake before. If that is not the case, why is this important to you?

my suggestion is that if you are going to argue for mandates by drawing a comparisons to other mandates in the past the comparison should be and equivalency.

I even stated previously my argument in this specific discussion/counter argument to his post/point wasn't an argument for or against mandates, it was about what would be or wouldn't be a valid comparable or equivalent comparisons for justification.

More specifically the hypocrisy of his final statement, where he was essentially doing the very same thing he was shaming others for doing.


Its like saying the government has declared marshal law before so it justifies using marshal law now for XYZ when XYZ is completely different scenario then the previous instances of it being declared in response to ABC.

Does it mean it shouldn't be declared for XYZ? No it very well could be warranted but it is NOT warranted solely based on it being used for ABC in the past.

[86TOYO2k17]

Originally Posted by MyHybridBurnsGasAndTires

his current debate tactic is concern trolling using argument from ignorance fallacy over and over in an effort to once again muddy the waters. there's nothing more to it.

you clearly cant follow along with the conversation. you still think it is an anti mandate or anti vax argument. when it is clearly not... if you where able to read and comprehend what was said and stated this would be clear.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

I've never had a job ask me if I have had the polio vaccine before...

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Because you aren't old enough most likely, since it's almost not existent at this point.

I have had jobs ask about other vaccines, and asked for vaccine records.

[wbradley]

Vaccine passports, we have been assured, provide zero information other than your identification for verification and your vaccine status (which vaccines, when administered).
Apparently Pilot would object to registering children for day school. Pre pandemic, at least as far back as 19 or 20 years ago it was required for my first child, as well as for my second. Their vaccination cards were provided from the pediatrician.
That's how we manage to eradicate infectious diseases.

It seems to me most all libertariams and anti-vaxxers like to replace the word "eradicate" with "tolerate", which I find unacceptable in this context.

[Hoahao]

8 prominent doctors & scientists engage in a remarkable exchange

[MyHybridBurnsGasAndTires]

Originally Posted by p1l0t

Still is that the new way forward? To have our medical records ready for any ol stranger to review before entry?

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yes, your entire medical history will need to be shown. everything. you will even have to show your tiny little balls to the ticket taker at the movie theater to get in.