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Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum The place to start for the Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 | GT86


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Old 03-14-2020, 01:37 AM   #1
EvolutionRevolution
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Will I feel it? (headers)

I know this is sort of wishy-washy subjective BS territory but if anyone might like to play along...

Thoughts on the following:

Assume the average spirited driver who doesn't plan to track their 86.

Money aside, is there realistically a noticeable enough increase in power to feel in everyday, spirited driving from a top end header vs a mid range header.. Will it be noticeably more fun to drive?

Say the ACE A350 vs Tomei EL...

I'm thinking probably not (just a hunch , i have zero experience to back this up...)

I'm also thinking if E85 were applied on top of said header setups the returns (in joy) are probably diminishing yet between the two.

What say you?
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Old 03-14-2020, 01:43 AM   #2
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There are people that swear they can feel the very little HP a header alone get's you. Mostly placebo or confirmation bias I would say.
With a header, tune and E85 yes you will get a large enough increase to feel.
Whether that makes the car "more fun" is subjective and up to you.
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Old 03-14-2020, 01:44 AM   #3
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No clue on headers, but you'll feel the annoyance of stopping for fuel more often and with fewer stopping options if you go E85.
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Old 03-14-2020, 01:58 AM   #4
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E85 will give you the most "butt dyno" feel

the headers will only smooth out that power band and some even said my car "feels" slower cause it doesnt have that change in acceleration ( aka linear torque curve)

its like driving a rx8, damn thing is so smooth you never really get pushed back in your seat but the speed is there.

if you wanna get the most "oompha" for your money just get the oft E85 tune and relish in the power on your otherwise stock car.


for me? the most fun to drive is my 17 PP car modified in accordance with C Street SCCA rules and on 225 tires
spirited, whippy and dead nuts simple and cheap to play with. you learn that power is fleeting and once you get some youll want more.
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Old 03-14-2020, 05:13 AM   #5
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This is just me but....
Headers just sound nice maybe a gain or to.

What I have always done is this: suspension upgrades, light weight wheels, sticky tires.
Why have a fast car when you can be a faster driver?

But it's your wallet at the end.
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Old 03-14-2020, 06:41 AM   #6
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Noticeable difference after installing catless UEL header and OFT. The car is stronger through the midrange and the power/tq delivery feels more linear. Would definitely recommend even if you’re not tracking because honestly the torque dip and power delivery feel more lacking on the street when you’re sitting in that mid range the most. On track the revs are usually above it so it’s a non issue
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Old 03-14-2020, 07:23 AM   #7
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I noted a difference after I got it tuned, the car was easier to rev, it felt unconstrained, smoother and sounded better.
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Old 03-14-2020, 07:57 AM   #8
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This is an engine that needs to rev up to give power. At low rpm, even a Rotrex supercharger is hard to notice. It requires a bit learning to drive at high power rpm range when needed. I would recommend investing time on getting used to extracting the power of this engine before spending money on power upgrades.
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Old 03-14-2020, 03:27 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by troyguitar View Post
No clue on headers, but you'll feel the annoyance of stopping for fuel more often and with fewer stopping options if you go E85.
That's for sure. OFT tablet stays in the car for just this reason.
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Old 03-14-2020, 05:35 PM   #10
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i get mods because i like researching them, learning about the options, the excitement of placing an order. I love climbing under the car and installing them when they finally come, and i like driving the car after theyre on. you will not feel it in the seat of your pants if you put on a header and dynotune it. but dont let that stop you from doing it.
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Old 03-14-2020, 05:42 PM   #11
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If you get a header you need a tune.
However you can get a tune without a header and feel something good. Also an OFT is easy to sell if you want more or go back to stock.


I had Gruppe-S and OFT and its great bang for buck.
Then I went to ACE with ECUtek, its another step up.
Would have been an awesome to jump straight from stock to ACE.
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Old 03-14-2020, 06:02 PM   #12
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I had Gruppe-S and OFT and its great bang for buck. Then I went to ACE with ECUtek, its another step up.
Would have been an awesome to jump straight from stock to ACE.
Would you do the Ace ECutek setup all over again? I'm considering the JDL EL ECutek route from my current OFT HKS setup. Wish we had a bit more data on the JDL but of well.
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Old 03-14-2020, 06:29 PM   #13
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Different header configurations I've had since stock, in order:

- Stock + 93 oct
- JDL UEL catless header + 93 oct
- FT86SF catted header + 93 oct
- Stock + 91 oct
- Stock + E85

As with most things in life, it's all relative. You'll notice a difference with each change, but will get used to it. Then you won't notice it again until you go back to stock. For example, I'm running E85 now and have gotten used to it so it just feels normal and I don't notice it. But when I change back to 91, I can immediately tell the difference.

The only configuration where I constantly noticed the difference was the one that eliminated the torque dip, i.e., FT86SF catted header. The elimination of the dip is something you feel everytime you pass through it.
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Old 03-14-2020, 09:32 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by DarkSunrise View Post
Different header configurations I've had since stock, in order:

- Stock + 93 oct
- JDL UEL catless header + 93 oct
- FT86SF catted header + 93 oct
- Stock + 91 oct
- Stock + E85


The only configuration where I constantly noticed the difference was the one that eliminated the torque dip, i.e., FT86SF catted header. The elimination of the dip is something you feel everytime you pass through it.
Just out of interest if the FT86SF catted headers seemed the best/most noticeable. Why did you go back to stock with an E85 tune?

I’ve been tempted to get the FT86SF catted headers, but I’ve been worried about being non-compliant with the road authorities.
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