Another sign the world is coming to an end...

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by AnalogMan

Of course. That’s how it should be. Those who work harder, are more innovative, who provide useful things that others don’t, should get and have more than others. Otherwise, there’s no incentive to trying harder. Altruism isn’t enough motivation for most people.

But to me there’s a point of unjustifiable obscenity. Maybe it’s because I’ve had to deal with venture capitalists, hedge fund managers, and investment bankers for most of my career. IMHO, the rewards they reap are not commensurate with their contributions or efforts. A thief may get away with stealing millions (or billions), but did they really earn it?

You’re also absolutely right that corrective mechanisms are generally slow in coming. I don’t expect any in this country anytime soon. Americans as a people are too complacent, short-sighted, and unmotivated. We can’t even get our act together to have a reasoned response to the pandemic.

I would bet this car was more likely bought by a financial speculator than a true enthusiast who intended to drive it. Speculators sometimes get their own comeuppances when the bubbles they’ve created burst out from under them.

Most collector cars are not bought to be driven.
You run into the paradox that a low mileage collector car ceases to be a low mileage collector car as son as you start driving them.
I am a strong believer that there is indeed a place in this world for museum quality collector cars that will never see a road again.
Yes, it may seem sad on the surface but at least they will still be around many years from now.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

The irony of that is you could all of a sudden make them valueless!

A great example of this was in the model kit collecting world. There was one old Aurora kit that was selling for around $1500 on a regular basis (That would make the car about $12 million in comparison to original price). Then somebody found cases of them in a warehouse someplace. Now they go for about $400.

The reason that these cars go for so much is that they are rare and unique in some way or another. You have to many and you take that value away.

Oh and remember when you talk about how the rich and powerful were overthrown that they had been in place for a thousand years before that but the systems that replaced them usually crumbled within a few decades (the Russian nobility is a great example of that). It looks great that they were overthrown until you place the whole thing in context.
There have always been people with more than others and there always will be.

Rare and old doesn't equal value. I learned that from watching Pawn Stars. It has to be desirable too. For some reason, these cars are desirable. I don't know why. Maybe people believe they will be investments because analog cars are going away and ICEs will be replaced by EVs. Maybe people just have a lot of money to spend on poster cars. If people wanted to actually drive these cars then I would understand, but I have a strong feeling that this is just going into someone's museum. And you are right, its value is only as much as anyone is willing to pay for it, but so is anything. I doubt the supply of these will change, so unless the demand dramatically shifts because of a recession or depression, this thing will hold its value; even then, the rich don't get poor during a recession or depression.

Income inequality is a problem, but wealth inequality is scarier. Obviously income inequality leads to more wealth inequality, but the accumulation of wealth is problematic. For instance, Jeff Bezos is worth say $150 billion if he cashed out his Amazon shares and retired. Say he reinvested and diversified his money conservatively and made only 5% interest on his investments. Say we never have inflation for simplicity for the example, and he leaves his wealth to his family intact. In 100 years, the value of his investments would reach $19.7 trillion. Say those investments had a good year, and he made 6% instead of 5%, and the family decided to cash out 1% of the shares. That is $197 billion dollars. In a future without inflation, where $197 billion is worth the same as it is now, that is potentially a lot of influence on politics or on the market, and we see the effects of that with families like the Koch brothers.

Some people feel intrinsically uneasy about taxing wealth like an inheritance tax, even for the rich, but it is probably best for the health of the society. This level of wealth inequality has a runaway effect. A new Bezos or Musk could attempt to generate new wealth in a new industry, but old money can continue to grow faster than someone could try to build new wealth, and what is more, someone could have the power to stifle competition, so it doesn't happen. We have seen that. It is bad for the economy and society. I think taxes, business regulations, anti-trust laws, laws against campaign contributions (money in politics), etc can allow societies to have wealth inequality and still be healthy like the video below mentions, but we don't have these protections right now.

[DarkPira7e]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

I have always wanted a 2.5RS. Sadly the prices they go for are pretty high. A clean one is well over 10K around here. I can get an R32 GT-S for that.

It sucks to know that there used to be countless numbers of these cars near me that were already completely riced and rusted. If I had been less enamored with my E36 at the time, I could've saved one from hell.

Can't even find an Impreza from any model year previous to 2008 around here any more, they're all in the junkyard

[mazeroni]

End stage capitalism?

The girl behind "Overly Attached Girlfriend Meme" sold the meme for $411,000 in NFT.

https://cryptocake1.com/the-overly-a...411000-as-nft/

Beeplecrap sold his NFT of 5,000 image collection for $69 Million.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/26/digital-artist-beeple-common-misunderstanding-about-nfts.html#:~:text=Digital%20artist%20Mike%20Winkel mann%2C%20known,million%20at%20auction%20at%20Chri stie's.

Now, spending $70M+ for a Ferrari 250 GTO makes sense.

All of the above people will sell again in a year looking for at least an 8% return. If that happens, then it was a good investment.

https://www.autoweek.com/news/future...r-world-again/

I would hope the guy who bought the Subaru drives it around. Maybe he will go to a cars and coffee, but I don't see him dailying it. Or it could be he intends on flipping it in 2~3 years for $600K or more.

[HKz]

if I had all the money in the world, I would gladly pay that much for a 22b...really no surprise here.. great looks, manual, turbo & awd at the weight of the twins....what all the cry babies basically want out of the twins...what other cars are comparable?

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by HKz

if I had all the money in the world, I would gladly pay that much for a 22b...really no surprise here.. great looks, manual, turbo & awd at the weight of the twins....what all the cry babies basically want out of the twins...what other cars are comparable?

GR Yaris but new.

If I had all the money in the world then I would buy it to drive it, but that is not what is going to happen most likely. I get @Tcoat’s point, but it is still hard for me to fully accept. I love when people use their rare cars like this video of a Singer owner driving his car down a gravel road or the red TwinsTurbos Supra guy driving his car, and I loathe the reciprocal, investors using vehicles as investments and manipulating the price of the market like what happened to the 911R, or when these guys store and show, as if going “look what I have” and not really being much of a car enthusiast/ driver.

AWD is good for off road, and it is good for traction limited vehicles when they have ridiculous horsepower, but AWD adds weight, and it leads to less engine horsepower making it to the ground, so it is ehhh, not my cup of tea. I’d rather have RWD.

[HKz]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

GR Yaris but new.

If I had all the money in the world then I would buy it to drive it, but that is not what is going to happen most likely. I get @Tcoat’s point, but it is still hard for me to fully accept. I love when people use their rare cars like this video of a Singer owner driving his car down a gravel road or the red TwinsTurbos Supra guy driving his car, and I loathe the reciprocal, investors using vehicles as investments and manipulating the price of the market like what happened to the 911R, or when these guys store and show, as if going “look what I have” and not really being much of a car enthusiast/ driver.

AWD is good for off road, and it is good for traction limited vehicles when they have ridiculous horsepower, but AWD adds weight, and it leads to less engine horsepower making it to the ground, so it is ehhh, not my cup of tea. I’d rather have RWD.

GR Yaris is a good one (or even a GT-Four), wish we got it in the states I would be tempted to try to get one instead of a 2nd gen twin but I'm not the biggest fan of the shape of the car. the designers did great with what they had, it looks relatively cool especially with the rear haunches but the 22b and twins look far more attractive to me.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by mazeroni

End stage capitalism?

The girl behind "Overly Attached Girlfriend Meme" sold the meme for $411,000 in NFT.

https://cryptocake1.com/the-overly-a...411000-as-nft/

Beeplecrap sold his NFT of 5,000 image collection for $69 Million.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/26/digital-artist-beeple-common-misunderstanding-about-nfts.html#:~:text=Digital%20artist%20Mike%20Winkel mann%2C%20known,million%20at%20auction%20at%20Chri stie's.

Now, spending $70M+ for a Ferrari 250 GTO makes sense.

All of the above people will sell again in a year looking for at least an 8% return. If that happens, then it was a good investment.

https://www.autoweek.com/news/future...r-world-again/

I would hope the guy who bought the Subaru drives it around. Maybe he will go to a cars and coffee, but I don't see him dailying it. Or it could be he intends on flipping it in 2~3 years for $600K or more.

Tulip Mania.

These NFTs don’t really seem like good investments at all. They seem like a good way to hide money instead of a bank in the Cayman Islands. They seem like poor investments, except for the creators, where the value of the “art” is in the hype—not in the creativity, quality or skillset required to make the piece.

The Ferrari makes more sense (and doesn’t), but the figure is still obscene, and outside of the fact that it surely would get resold for more, making it a good investment, there is no way any old car is worth the yearly incomes of more than a thousand average people in America. It just rubs people the wrong way when people hear these things because they don’t understand the surge in market evaluation for such a thing—how multiple people could be willing to evaluate a car’s value so high, or how it is deemed an investment.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

A new Bezos or Musk could attempt to generate new wealth in a new industry, but old money can continue to grow faster than someone could try to build new wealth, and what is more, someone could have the power to stifle competition, so it doesn't happen. We have seen that.

It will happen if some people want to happen. The current rich (e.g., Bezos, Musk) will depart without saying anything and the new ones will appear out of the blue.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by DarkPira7e

Having ridden in a couple swapped 2.5 RS, the hype is merited. (I'd rather see the money spent on a 22b than some McLaren or something) If I was not into RWD, all my money would be going into building an STI swapped RS. Not to make a million horsepower, but just to experience a really stout 4 door car that is no frills with an intense aftermarket.

Weighs very little, handles well with the right setup... and came with glass headlights in 2000

That's why I want the gr Yaris

[m.box.design]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

It's an amazing car. And rare. And arguably one of the most attractive Subarus made.

Definitely the best looking WRX ever made. And yes, arguably one of the most attractive Subarus, because I can't really say Subaru is known for looks. Don't think any of their cars have had classic sports car shapes. Mayyybe the XT.

[mav1178]

you can call it whatever you want, but the main things driving up the price of the car is that 1) it's a 22B, 2) low mileage, and 3) already imported into the US with Show or Display filing a mere formality.

the fact that you don't have to go through a normal import process to acquire this car is a huge plus, possibly worth $50k+ by itself for someone actually collecting rare cars.

[soundman98]

i don't know what the big deal is. just found this one lying around in an old barn.

[why?]

It's obvious you are not a Subaru person. The 22b was the best of a long line of Subaru special models they created when they were kicking ass in WRC, at the top of their popularity. Millions of people in the USA dreamed of owning one. This car was £50,000 in 1998 when brand new. These vehicles were more popular than Lamborghini's or any other super car there was to their fans.

This is the absolute most desirable car Subaru has ever made. Akin to the Toyota 2000 GT. This car will be a million dollar car at some point, it is that important. This one is a Japanese market car legally imported to the USA. You only need one millionaire computer nerd that was a teenager in 1998 for this to be worth what it was purchased for.