|
Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain. |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
05-17-2013, 10:30 PM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Drives: FR-s
Location: PA
Posts: 188
Thanks: 20
Thanked 79 Times in 34 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
?equal length or unequal length headers?
SO as the header reads equal length headers or unequal length headers.
what are the benefits between the two. I know putting them on will gain some power but does one type add more trq than the other? |
05-17-2013, 10:36 PM | #2 |
Boosted
Join Date: Feb 2013
Drives: Not a supra....yet
Location: Riverside,CA/ Abu Dhabi,UAE
Posts: 2,925
Thanks: 487
Thanked 1,203 Times in 812 Posts
Mentioned: 90 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
|
__________________
|
The Following User Says Thank You to SmsAlSuwaidi For This Useful Post: | ramiram1984 (05-17-2013) |
05-18-2013, 09:33 AM | #3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: 2013 Asphalt FR-S Manual
Location: Whitby, ON, Canada
Posts: 6,716
Thanks: 7,875
Thanked 3,351 Times in 2,134 Posts
Mentioned: 99 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
Equal length is more efficient, the only reason anyone is making UEL ones is because most Subarus come that way stock and people like the burble the exhaust makes.
You can still get an increase in power from a good UEL header, but it won't be as good as a good EL header.
__________________
Light travels faster than sound, so people may appear to be bright until you hear them speak... flickr |
The Following User Says Thank You to wparsons For This Useful Post: | Pete (05-18-2013) |
05-18-2013, 09:56 AM | #4 |
I Love custom Turbo kits
Join Date: Mar 2012
Drives: Limited BRZ
Location: Miami
Posts: 10,770
Thanks: 20,004
Thanked 8,343 Times in 4,361 Posts
Mentioned: 441 Post(s)
Tagged: 12 Thread(s)
|
The difference in 400+ WHP cars is between 10-20 WHP, (This means that for lower HP cars, the difference will be less) EL making more power than the UEL. It depends on your likes and goals. I went UEL because I loved the sound, and was willing to compromise the around 10 WHP.
__________________
|
05-18-2013, 02:57 PM | #5 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Drives: 07 scion tc 06 Evo 9 mr 10 4runner
Location: Inland empire, california
Posts: 171
Thanks: 120
Thanked 13 Times in 13 Posts
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Borla dyno'd UEL vs EL..
UEL produced more Power. Not much more.....but more nonetheless |
The Following User Says Thank You to TheSlickOne17 For This Useful Post: | Spartan65 (05-20-2013) |
05-18-2013, 10:24 PM | #6 |
Señor Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Drives: 86 GT/'74 TA22 Celica/Kangaroo
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 1,706
Thanks: 1,104
Thanked 764 Times in 478 Posts
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Biggest difference is the sound. EL is more like a race car UEL is like the traditional Subaru sound. The changes to power and torque vary. UEL can flow better than stock. EL can flow better and be tuned length. The tuning determines where the torque occurs in the rev range. The P&L and the FA20Club are tuned to improve the torque dip. Ones like the JDL and Super Sprint are more top end tuned. But this is a general overview. Do some googling and you'll see there is a ton of things that go into header design.
__________________
1974 TA22 Celica
2013 86 GT |
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Turdinator For This Useful Post: | Cross (09-15-2015), Sportsguy83 (05-20-2013) |
05-19-2013, 08:31 PM | #7 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Drives: 2022 BRZ
Location: PA
Posts: 957
Thanks: 299
Thanked 570 Times in 266 Posts
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
Any proof of this? Simmons
__________________
2022 BRZ 71 STR
Sponsors Xero-Limit//Karcepts |
|
05-19-2013, 09:43 PM | #8 |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: 2013 Ultramarine FR-S MT
Location: Round Rock, TX
Posts: 3,941
Thanks: 679
Thanked 1,771 Times in 1,111 Posts
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
I think you will see proof in higher HP FI builds with equal length over unequal. I doubt you'll be able to tell with the ~350 hp and under builds. No one really has tested it either for full proof.
Whole reason I like the Nameless/FA20 club designs is they are convertible from NA to FI. |
05-19-2013, 11:41 PM | #9 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2013
Drives: 1990 BNR32 GTR
Location: Junction City, Oregon
Posts: 369
Thanks: 104
Thanked 57 Times in 48 Posts
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
But only if you are aiming for a Turbo. I guess you benefit from still being able to do both, huh?
__________________
|
05-20-2013, 07:02 AM | #10 |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: 2013 Ultramarine FR-S MT
Location: Round Rock, TX
Posts: 3,941
Thanks: 679
Thanked 1,771 Times in 1,111 Posts
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Basically. I've yet to see anyone attempt a longtube UEL but with the design of the longer runners on one side, I don't think it can be done. You'd have to cut the longer side short to wrap it up front which makes it an equal length again.
I would go UEL unless you have a planned FI build down the road. Even then, AVO turbo kits use a UEL and push a really good amount of horsepower so don't let anyone tell you that UEL is bad for turbo. It really depends on what your goals are. |
05-20-2013, 08:51 AM | #11 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: 2013 Asphalt FR-S Manual
Location: Whitby, ON, Canada
Posts: 6,716
Thanks: 7,875
Thanked 3,351 Times in 2,134 Posts
Mentioned: 99 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
I don't know the science well enough to try to explain it with numbers and proof, but the runner length (and length between steps if it's stepped) is very important for flow, scavenging and eventually power output. Look at how long the runners are on the longtube EL designs and how they perform.
Every platform in the world makes more power on long tube headers over short tube headers, and it's all down to the long tubes being the proper length for the flow characteristics of the engine. IMO, running UEL header is like running a V8 with a long tube on one bank and short tube on the other. Sure it'll make power over stock, but it could make more.
__________________
Light travels faster than sound, so people may appear to be bright until you hear them speak... flickr |
05-20-2013, 09:16 AM | #12 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Drives: 2022 BRZ
Location: PA
Posts: 957
Thanks: 299
Thanked 570 Times in 266 Posts
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
I am not saying that it is not possible, just wanted some dyno results to prove it. Simmons
__________________
2022 BRZ 71 STR
Sponsors Xero-Limit//Karcepts |
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Simmons For This Useful Post: | ATL BRZ (05-20-2013) |
05-20-2013, 09:46 AM | #13 |
Add lightness!
Join Date: Apr 2012
Drives: 17' WRX
Location: Boston
Posts: 1,253
Thanks: 380
Thanked 888 Times in 411 Posts
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
I don't think you're going to find any until people run wide open exhausts. Long tube equal length headers will make more power on any engine with open exhausts. Add in mufflers, cats and bends to accommodate things and most of the advantage goes away. It's an old debate before subarus it was equal length vs. shorty headers. It would be really interesting to see a direct comparison between the JDL UEL and the P&L EL header on the same car.
|
05-20-2013, 09:52 AM | #14 |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: 2013 Ultramarine FR-S MT
Location: Round Rock, TX
Posts: 3,941
Thanks: 679
Thanked 1,771 Times in 1,111 Posts
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
The only one I have seen is the Nameless header, but it was on pump gas. Was your dyno on e85?
|
|
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Borla Unequal Length Header Review and DIY | F1point4 | DIY (Do-It-Yourself) Guides | 92 | 05-10-2021 04:06 PM |
>>>>Rev Works UEL (Unequal Length) Header - Specs, information, & Customer Review<<<< | Rev Works | Engine, Exhaust, Bolt-Ons | 917 | 08-04-2014 11:52 PM |
BRZ/FR-S/GT86 – 4-1 Equal Length Header Group Buy | P&L Motorsports | Groupbuys | 634 | 12-03-2013 05:36 PM |
PPE Equal Length Headers with Free OverPipe!!! | Titanmotorsports | Engine, Exhaust, Bolt-Ons | 48 | 05-07-2013 10:55 AM |
unequal length headers | 001BRZ | Engine, Exhaust, Transmission | 10 | 07-21-2012 01:20 AM |