follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Speed By Design
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting

Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting What these cars were built for!


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-17-2021, 12:30 PM   #1
doug1234
Member
 
doug1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ w/pp
Location: US
Posts: 12
Thanks: 4
Thanked 9 Times in 6 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Need advise on tire wear.

I normally was running the tires at a hot temp of 33 degrees; but when on the Shenandoah Circuit at Summit Point WV I notice that I was getting a lot of rollover on the front tires. I talked to an instructor and he advised me to increase the temp to 36-38 Hot. So I did and ran a couple laps and the rolling problem seemed to be gone. I used a friends pyrometer and measured the temps after the next session and the temps where within a couple of degrees inner being hotter and outer being the coolest.

A couple weeks later I drove 8 25 minutes sessions on the Summit Point Main Circuit and noticed that the outer edge was being worn at a lot high rate than the inner. Especially the front drivers. Any advice on the correct setup?

2017 BRZ w/PP
Suspension: CSG Tein Flex A coilovers and SPL Rear Lower Control Arm
Wheels: Apex arc 8 17x9 et42
Tires: 245/40R17 Maxxis VR1 S2
Pads: CSG C1 front and Project Mu Club Racer Rear

-- Alignment:
Corner Balanced
Camber: -2.5 Front; -2.0 Rear
Toe: -0.02 Front; 0.12 Rear
Caster: 5.8 Front
Steer Ahead: 0.0
Thrust Angle: -0.01



--Tire Pressure and Pyrometer readings
Longacre 52-50635 AccuTech Economy Pyrometer

All readings taken after a cool down lap and the long drive to the paddock.

Reading directions: FD->FP->RP->RD
Hot PSI; Outer/Middle/Inner Temps

Session 1:
FD: 39; 113/119/125 FP: 38; 109/119/124
RD: 38; 100/108/109 RP: 37; 90/100/111

Session 2:
FD: 38; 128/129/133 FP: 37; 99/111/108
RD: 37; 96/106/106 RP: 37; 82/92/93

lower FP PSI by 1 deg

Session 3:
FD: 40; 130/140/132 FP: 37; 100/112/117
RD: 38; 101/110/111 RP: 37; 93/103/109

lowered FD PSI by 2 degrees
Attached Images
   

Last edited by doug1234; 04-17-2021 at 01:21 PM.
doug1234 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to doug1234 For This Useful Post:
SCFD (04-18-2021)
Old 04-17-2021, 02:30 PM   #2
ROADRACER
Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: unlimited cheap build N/A track car
Location: TN
Posts: 77
Thanks: 10
Thanked 35 Times in 24 Posts
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
I would add another degree of negative camber. That will probably do it. You will also get some added grip.
ROADRACER is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to ROADRACER For This Useful Post:
doug1234 (04-17-2021), ZDan (04-18-2021)
Old 04-17-2021, 02:37 PM   #3
strat61caster
-
 
strat61caster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: '13 FRS
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 9,718
Thanks: 13,031
Thanked 8,859 Times in 4,650 Posts
Mentioned: 87 Post(s)
Tagged: 3 Thread(s)
More front camber, -3.5 to -4.5 likely much happier, rear could probably go up a touch as well, -2.5 to -3.0

This is where pyro can be very misleading, heat by the time you get back to the pits doesn't reflect where you're using the most tire which is clearly the outside edge. Adjusting for wear pattern should supersede the pyro readings unless you're getting realtime data.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guff View Post
ineedyourdiddly
strat61caster is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to strat61caster For This Useful Post:
doug1234 (04-17-2021), ZDan (04-18-2021)
Old 04-17-2021, 05:23 PM   #4
gatorac
Chin Track Event Manager
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Drives: 15 Series Blue
Location: Bradenton FL
Posts: 80
Thanks: 16
Thanked 58 Times in 30 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
More front camber will help. I used to do 2 events (4 days) and have the tire rotated on the wheel. Then I could run another 4 days. That was with NT01's. Even at 3.5* they would still need to be rotated. 3.5* would also eat up the inside shoulder of my street tires. It's one of the compromises of this strut suspension. No camber gain in a corner like an unequal A arm set up.
__________________
Jim Pomroy Chin Track Days Event Manager.
15 Series Blue in white
18 Golf R
09 Comp Yellow NC
20 Gladiator tow vehicle.
gatorac is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to gatorac For This Useful Post:
doug1234 (04-17-2021), ZDan (04-18-2021)
Old 04-17-2021, 05:42 PM   #5
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '17 BRZ PP
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 3,344
Thanks: 699
Thanked 2,446 Times in 1,361 Posts
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Ditto ^^^
Moar front camber. Like -3 minimum, preferably -3.5 to -4
ZDan is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to ZDan For This Useful Post:
doug1234 (04-17-2021)
Old 04-18-2021, 01:54 AM   #6
jflogerzi
Senior Member
 
jflogerzi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Drives: 2013 Series 10 6MT FR-S
Location: Moreno Valley, CA
Posts: 4,443
Thanks: 1,570
Thanked 1,489 Times in 1,093 Posts
Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Question for those with more than -3 up front? You using camber plates + crash bolts?

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
__________________
2013 Series 10 FRS #553
JDL 4-2-1 EL, MXP-SP, Tuned by Zach@CSG
RR Wilwood Front/Rear Sport BBK, Motul 600 Fluid
Koing Hypergram 17x8 ET40 SX2 GTs 245/40/17
jflogerzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2021, 03:15 AM   #7
strat61caster
-
 
strat61caster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: '13 FRS
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 9,718
Thanks: 13,031
Thanked 8,859 Times in 4,650 Posts
Mentioned: 87 Post(s)
Tagged: 3 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflogerzi View Post
Question for those with more than -3 up front? You using camber plates + crash bolts?

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
Yes, but some (most? Idk) camber plates can hit low -3.x alone, every setup is a little different.
Many aftermarket struts are slotted for more adjustability.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guff View Post
ineedyourdiddly

Last edited by strat61caster; 04-18-2021 at 03:27 AM.
strat61caster is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to strat61caster For This Useful Post:
jflogerzi (04-18-2021)
Old 04-18-2021, 07:49 AM   #8
doug1234
Member
 
doug1234's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ w/pp
Location: US
Posts: 12
Thanks: 4
Thanked 9 Times in 6 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Thanks for advice. I'm going to flip the tires and ask the shop to put as much negative camber up to -3.5 front and -3 rear. I'm not sure if my camber plates can get to -3.5 maybe I can get -3.


Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
doug1234 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to doug1234 For This Useful Post:
SCFD (04-18-2021)
Old 04-18-2021, 10:09 AM   #9
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '17 BRZ PP
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 3,344
Thanks: 699
Thanked 2,446 Times in 1,361 Posts
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflogerzi View Post
Question for those with more than -3 up front? You using camber plates + crash bolts?

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
Just Raceseng camber plates. Car is lowered 1.25" on Swift SpecR springs, with Bilstein B8 struts/shocks.
ZDan is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to ZDan For This Useful Post:
jflogerzi (04-18-2021)
Old 04-18-2021, 10:20 AM   #10
jflogerzi
Senior Member
 
jflogerzi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Drives: 2013 Series 10 6MT FR-S
Location: Moreno Valley, CA
Posts: 4,443
Thanks: 1,570
Thanked 1,489 Times in 1,093 Posts
Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZDan View Post
Just Raceseng camber plates. Car is lowered 1.25" on Swift SpecR springs, with Bilstein B8 struts/shocks.
I am new to coils and camber plates. Just got my new RCE SS-1 put onto the car. Still dialing in ride height. They mentioned -3.5 is possible on a 30mm drop but they recommend -3 and a 25mm drop. Is there any advantage to or a big difference between -3 and -3.5? My car is also still my daily on sx2 rubber

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
__________________
2013 Series 10 FRS #553
JDL 4-2-1 EL, MXP-SP, Tuned by Zach@CSG
RR Wilwood Front/Rear Sport BBK, Motul 600 Fluid
Koing Hypergram 17x8 ET40 SX2 GTs 245/40/17
jflogerzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2021, 10:26 AM   #11
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '17 BRZ PP
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 3,344
Thanks: 699
Thanked 2,446 Times in 1,361 Posts
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflogerzi View Post
I am new to coils and camber plates. Just got my new RCE SS-1 put onto the car. Still dialing in ride height. They mentioned -3.5 is possible on a 30mm drop but they recommend -3 and a 25mm drop. Is there any advantage to or a big difference between -3 and -3.5? My car is also still my daily on sx2 rubber
Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
-3 should be OK. For me, -3.5 is the sweet spot for track/street, others say -4 or even more is better for the track. -3 is a decent improvement over -2.5 for sure, but I say if you can get -3.5 go for it.
ZDan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2021, 10:58 AM   #12
jflogerzi
Senior Member
 
jflogerzi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Drives: 2013 Series 10 6MT FR-S
Location: Moreno Valley, CA
Posts: 4,443
Thanks: 1,570
Thanked 1,489 Times in 1,093 Posts
Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZDan View Post
-3 should be OK. For me, -3.5 is the sweet spot for track/street, others say -4 or even more is better for the track. -3 is a decent improvement over -2.5 for sure, but I say if you can get -3.5 go for it.
Maybe I will try for 3.2 up front. What are you running in the rear?

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
__________________
2013 Series 10 FRS #553
JDL 4-2-1 EL, MXP-SP, Tuned by Zach@CSG
RR Wilwood Front/Rear Sport BBK, Motul 600 Fluid
Koing Hypergram 17x8 ET40 SX2 GTs 245/40/17
jflogerzi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2021, 11:15 AM   #13
ZDan
Senior Member
 
ZDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Drives: '17 BRZ PP
Location: Providence, RI
Posts: 3,344
Thanks: 699
Thanked 2,446 Times in 1,361 Posts
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jflogerzi View Post
Maybe I will try for 3.2 up front. What are you running in the rear?

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk
-2.8, just from lowering 1.25" (stock/factory LCAs). Rear camber isn't as important anyway, anything from -2 to -3 I wouldn't worry about it if you don't have adjustability.
ZDan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2021, 11:35 AM   #14
Petah78
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Drives: 2017 BRZ sport-tech
Location: Canada
Posts: 106
Thanks: 51
Thanked 31 Times in 22 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
With front camber @ 3.5, what is tire wear like for a mostly street driven car with 2 to 3 days of track a year?
__________________
Daijiro Katoh - Champion Forever!
Past: 92 EG w/JDM B18C, 00 EK w/JDM B18C, 04 600RR, 97 ITR #421, 10 Acura CSX-S
Current: 17 BRZ, 00 S2K - #0220
Petah78 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How does my tire wear look? R_E_L Wheels | Tires | Spacers | Hub -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack 14 09-08-2018 07:34 AM
tire wear oppiee Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting 9 08-29-2017 12:55 PM
Tire Wear? Flo Wheels | Tires | Spacers | Hub -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack 12 01-10-2017 03:19 PM
Tire Wear Help babykwiss Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting 10 07-14-2014 11:31 AM
Let's Discuss Tire Wear SkitterSkotter Wheels | Tires | Spacers | Hub -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack 12 01-14-2014 11:35 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.