2022 Twin to STR

[steverife]

Sooooo.....

Packwood.

[DocWalt]

Considering the courses looked like ass, not sure I'd take much stock in it... but John has been mega fast and Annie's car is well set up. Matt isn't exactly slow either, so... idk.

[steverife]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

Considering the courses looked like ass, not sure I'd take much stock in it... but John has been mega fast and Annie's car is well set up. Matt isn't exactly slow either, so... idk.

Yeah, those maps were ridiculous.

Mostly just pointing this out for my STX livelihood, but 2nd in PAX at a tour (even on shitty courses) is still impressive.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by steverife

Yeah, those maps were ridiculous.

Mostly just pointing this out for my STX livelihood, but 2nd in PAX at a tour (even on shitty courses) is still impressive.

With STX being the 2nd highest subscribed classes at Nats so far, I don't think anyone is rushing to put the new twins in.

At least I certainly hope not lol, that would be way worse then the ND2/STR hit.

DS-56
STX-43
ES-40

[steverife]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

With STX being the 2nd highest subscribed classes at Nats so far, I don't think anyone is rushing to put the new twins in.

At least I certainly hope not lol, that would be way worse then the ND2/STR hit.

DS-56
STX-43
ES-40

I'm not particularly worried because STX numbers are nice, but last couple of national events that I've attended, I've heard a LOT of comments on STR twin versus STX twin times.

[foshjowler]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

With STX being the 2nd highest subscribed classes at Nats so far, I don't think anyone is rushing to put the new twins in.

At least I certainly hope not lol, that would be way worse then the ND2/STR hit.

DS-56
STX-43
ES-40

I wonder how many of those DS cars are the twins waiting for a competitive STWhatever classing?

[DocWalt]

I have drafted up a very rough letter to ask for an ST re-org...


-SST goes away (or stays? idk, don't care)
-STU gets a lot of the SST cars
-STR gets Fiata & boost rules
-STX gets new twin, NC, NB, S2k, E36M, etc. from STR
-STH does... whatever the heck STH does
-STS gets old twins, RX-8, etc. but also gets 9" wide wheels and LSDs so the NAs & CRXs can keep up.

[otter]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

I have drafted up a very rough letter to ask for an ST re-org...


-SST goes away (or stays? idk, don't care)
-STU gets a lot of the SST cars
-STR gets Fiata & boost rules
-STX gets new twin, NC, NB, S2k, E36M, etc. from STR
-STH does... whatever the heck STH does
-STS gets old twins, RX-8, etc. but also gets 9" wide wheels and LSDs so the NAs & CRXs can keep up.

If STS got LSDs I might reconsider selling my NA. That car being classed in STR just because it has the factory torsen makes no sense.

[DocWalt]

Originally Posted by otter

If STS got LSDs I might reconsider selling my NA. That car being classed in STR just because it has the factory torsen makes no sense.

I think it probably should have been dumped in STX years ago, but "omg it's a roadster"

[MacSpeed]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

I have drafted up a very rough letter to ask for an ST re-org...


-SST goes away (or stays? idk, don't care)
-STU gets a lot of the SST cars
-STR gets Fiata & boost rules
-STX gets new twin, NC, NB, S2k, E36M, etc. from STR
-STH does... whatever the heck STH does
-STS gets old twins, RX-8, etc. but also gets 9" wide wheels and LSDs so the NAs & CRXs can keep up.

I'm 100% in support of this. But I'm sure the STS crowed will be pissed. SST could just be dissolved into U really and maybe a few other of the slower U cars (Z cars?) could move down to R as well and maybe add wheel width to R. Might be too much complexity but allow wheel width based on race weight? Like over 3K Lbs you can run a 10' wheel with 275, under is 9 with a 255.

[foshjowler]

Originally Posted by DocWalt

I have drafted up a very rough letter to ask for an ST re-org...


-SST goes away (or stays? idk, don't care)
-STU gets a lot of the SST cars
-STR gets Fiata & boost rules
-STX gets new twin, NC, NB, S2k, E36M, etc. from STR
-STH does... whatever the heck STH does
-STS gets old twins, RX-8, etc. but also gets 9" wide wheels and LSDs so the NAs & CRXs can keep up.

"Thank you for your input"

Why the S2K got bumped to SST, I do not understand, but having it compete with the new twin would be good to see. If we're reorganizing the ST classes, then whatever the latest Miata is should have its own spec class, STMiata. It will likely always be chosen as the dominant car for a class anyway, as it should, so why not just give it its own class? It would free up STR to keep the new twin, NC, and bring the S2K back. STX could keep the old twin and RX8, and maybe pick up the NA/NB with a torsen (not sure how those compete though).

I'd be surprised if they do a total reorg of the ST classes though.

[DocWalt]

Originally Posted by MacSpeed

I'm 100% in support of this. But I'm sure the STS crowed will be pissed. SST could just be dissolved into U really and maybe a few other of the slower U cars (Z cars?) could move down to R as well and maybe add wheel width to R. Might be too much complexity but allow wheel width based on race weight? Like over 3K Lbs you can run a 10' wheel with 275, under is 9 with a 255.

Would be funny for the Zs to go back to STR, haha. Considering the SCCA scales are always such broken garbage, not sure I'd want to use a weight split for wheel size, but it would be really interesting.





Oddly, the STS folks I've talked to seem to be like "well, meh, ok." I suspect the Hondas would still be quite competitive with a diff, NA Miatas maybe less so because the VLSD does sorta work?



I think the NB would be a blast in STX, the ECU issues with that limit it a lot which is both nice and annoying.

[DocWalt]

Originally Posted by foshjowler

"Thank you for your input"

Why the S2K got bumped to SST, I do not understand, but having it compete with the new twin would be good to see. If we're reorganizing the ST classes, then whatever the latest Miata is should have its own spec class, STMiata. It will likely always be chosen as the dominant car for a class anyway, as it should, so why not just give it its own class? It would free up STR to keep the new twin, NC, and bring the S2K back. STX could keep the old twin and RX8, and maybe pick up the NA/NB with a torsen (not sure how those compete though).

I'd be surprised if they do a total reorg of the ST classes though.

I had proposed the separate class for the ND & Fiat but STAC wasn't interested

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by foshjowler

I wonder how many of those DS cars are the twins waiting for a competitive STWhatever classing?

In my experience either they’re already in STR with the parts from their old STX cars or they’re going to ride out DS until they’re not competitive anymore. Locally I think there’s 5x new cars, three in DS and two in STR, both STR builds are using their mk1 parts for the most part.

There’s less then 10k mk2s on the road at this point vs 100k mk1 cars, seems like a dumb argument to outclass the old cars based on the handful of autoxers who jumped on the new hotness. That’s what nerfed STR participation but what do I know.