Venting about the stick

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

Just another idea, but how about a small pick up truck? You can get the Tacoma in a 6MT in several trim models (none of the middle trim levels).

I've actually considered this for myself, when the BRZ becomes just a garage queen, track warrior or weekend toy someday, but a truck would not suite the Mrs. It is a good option though. Probably one of the few vehicles that has seats for four+ and 4wd/awd and that can be spec'd to the highest trim with a manual.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I've actually considered this for myself, when the BRZ becomes just a garage queen, track warrior or weekend toy someday, but a truck would not suite the Mrs. It is a good option though. Probably one of the few vehicles that has seats for four+ and 4wd/awd and that can be spec'd to the highest trim with a manual.

Have her test drive one. Trust me, back when I used to sell them, I'd always get that reason as to why they couldn't buy one (not sure why they would have me test drive them in one knowing that from the get-go, but that's besides the point). I'd either have them call over the Mrs. and have her test drive it near the dealership, or have them drive the truck home/work (with me in it) and test drive it there. Most of the Mrs. changed their mind about driving a truck, especially if it's a higher model (BSM, nav, dual climate, heated seats [that was always the deal maker for a Mrs.], etc). A few times I had a Mrs. change her mind about them getting a Highlander for a Tacoma

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I fixed it. Apparently no one. Apparently if a person wants the look and style from a luxury manufacturer, or the amenities such as power, leather seats or premium sound and infotainment, or a powerful engine then this also means they are not interested in moving their arms.....

Well, the problem really is 99% of the purchasers of those cars want and expect AT so from a supply/demand prospective it doesn't make any sense to offer the MT. If you sell it, you have to stock parts for it, stock spares, train people to support it, etc., etc. Easier and cheaper to lose the 1% of buyers.

Also, I suspect that a large % of the 1% that would buy a MT would not pay a premium for it as a line item since they expect the AT to be the premium item. That is why when you do see a MT show up in a high end car it shows up in a model like the ATS-V that already has a premium price built in.

Mind you, this is all just theory on my part, I don't have any inside knowledge.

[Darth Khan]

Originally Posted by Cole

Who the fuck wants to buy a luxury SUV with a manual transmission?

I tend to agree with this although the expletive is overkill.

There is no logical reason to own a modern manual luxury SUV. (Or any modern non sports car). Modern SUV's with all the additional safety features etc make it pointless, that's why you can no logger buy them. Even if you were going to drive off road (Which is unlikely) the tech in the car will do a better job than you ever could.

I know I'm going to get stick (pun intended) for suggesting that modern manual SUV's are pointless. The truth is the world of auto tech is moving on, no matter how hard you fight it, new manual cars will eventually be demoted to small limited edition sports cars. (Even those will disappear)

I have driven manual cars my whole life. Does not mean I can stick my head in the sand and ignore the rest of the world's adoption of automatic transmissions and ultimately self driving cars.

So if you must have a stick, keep the twin for fun and use the SUV as your DD. At least then during your daily commute you can chill can give your left foot a break (pun intended)

[ermax]

Originally Posted by Cole

Who the fuck wants to buy a luxury SUV with a manual transmission?

Some people really like manuals. I considered an FJ simply because it had a 6MT before going with a Sequoia. All of my cars have been MT other than trucks where I had no choice. The only AT in my driveway right now is a Suburban.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by ermax

Some people really like manuals. I considered an FJ simply because it had a 6MT before going with a Sequoia. All of my cars have been MT other than trucks where I had no choice. The only AT in my driveway right now is a Suburban.

That's a pretty neat story when you compared an FJ to a luxury SUV. @Dadhawk really hit the nail on the head. Why would manufacturers try to please the 1% when 99% of the market doesn't want it in the least?

[ermax]

Originally Posted by Cole

That's a pretty neat story when you compared an FJ to a luxury SUV. @Dadhawk really hit the nail on the head. Why would manufacturers try to please the 1% when 99% of the market doesn't want it in the least?

I wasn't comparing. In my case I was willing to sacrifice the luxury part to keep the manual. I wasn't arguing why you can't get a MT in a luxury SUV. I was responding to the "WTF would you want a MT" part. My story was simply pointing out how far some people will go to get a MT. And for the record. If you could get a luxury SUV with a manual, I would go that route. But as you said, I am in the %1 and I know it is just a wet dream that will never happen. No need for you to get all hostile though.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Cole

That's a pretty neat story when you compared an FJ to a luxury SUV. @Dadhawk really hit the nail on the head. Why would manufacturers try to please the 1% when 99% of the market doesn't want it in the least?

What is luxury about a luxury SUV that can’t be had on a non-luxury SUV? Because those same luxury brands sell manual SUVs in Europe, just not in the states. Like I said, total sales of manuals in the states is 3%. It makes no sense to offer a manual. I get that. I’m just ranting and venting.

You seem to act like anyone interested in a manual outside of a sports car is ludicrous. Well even in sports cars the manual is going away in the states. Porsche had to bring the manual back to the GT3 because purists were losing their minds, but even they sell fewer manuals in the States and haven’t offered them on many models.

[Dadhawk]

While we are trying to save MT can we also put in a bid for saving MW (manual windows) which are even rarer? Currently, at least according to this article, there are only 12 models that you can get with MW.

•Chevrolet Aveo
•Chevrolet Cobalt
•Ford Fiesta
•Ford Focus
•Hyundai Accent
•Kia Rio
•Kia Forte
•Nissan Versa
•Smart Fortwo
•Toyota Corolla and Matrix
•Toyota Yaris

I mean if you are going to want to roll your own, you might as well be a purist about it.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Well, the problem really is 99% of the purchasers of those cars want and expect AT so from a supply/demand prospective it doesn't make any sense to offer the MT. If you sell it, you have to stock parts for it, stock spares, train people to support it, etc., etc. Easier and cheaper to lose the 1% of buyers.

Also, I suspect that a large % of the 1% that would buy a MT would not pay a premium for it as a line item since they expect the AT to be the premium item. That is why when you do see a MT show up in a high end car it shows up in a model like the ATS-V that already has a premium price built in.

Mind you, this is all just theory on my part, I don't have any inside knowledge.

If the general sales of all cars is at 3% then I suspect that in the luxury SUV category the demand for an MT would be well under 1%. Probably more like .001% (with most of those guys on forums such as this).
What really floors me is the almost total disappearance of MT in pick up trucks. There was a day not that long ago when getting an AT pickup was hard to do but now there are almost none with MT even as an option. A buddy went looking for a half ton truck with a MT last year and they simply are no longer available in any make. There is only one heavy duty and the rest are all midsize. Even then they are very few.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

While we are trying to save MT can we also put in a bid for saving MW (manual windows) which are even rarer? Currently, at least according to this article, there are only 12 models that you can get with MW.

•Chevrolet Aveo
•Chevrolet Cobalt
•Ford Fiesta
•Ford Focus
•Hyundai Accent
•Kia Rio
•Kia Forte
•Nissan Versa
•Smart Fortwo
•Toyota Corolla and Matrix
•Toyota Yaris

I mean if you are going to want to roll your own, you might as well be a purist about it.

Kind of apples and oranges. It's funny how all the AT guys come out to attack anyone who shows concern that the MT is dying.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by ermax

Kind of apples and oranges. It's funny how all the AT guys come out to attack anyone who shows concern that the MT is dying.

Not about denying the manual is dying. You don't need to be a genius to see that. The fact of the matter is that North America doesn't care about manuals and car companies know that. The supply meets the demand.

As for what you get from a luxury brand going to a non luxury brand, it's pretty obvious. The badge.

@Tcoat I think with at least Chevy (last I checked, anyways) you can pay a pretty penny for a MT for your half ton truck.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Cole

Not about denying the manual is dying. You don't need to be a genius to see that. The fact of the matter is that North America doesn't care about manuals and car companies know that. The supply meets the demand.

As for what you get from a luxury brand going to a non luxury brand, it's pretty obvious. The badge.

@Tcoat I think with at least Chevy (last I checked, anyways) you can pay a pretty penny for a MT for your half ton truck.

Nope even that is gone. At least as a factory option. There could be places that offer custom work at a pretty high price.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by ermax

Kind of apples and oranges. It's funny how all the AT guys come out to attack anyone who shows concern that the MT is dying.

Pretty funny how some people are so fascinated with MT that they presume anybody that says anything about good AT drives one. Nobody was attacking anything just pointing out the reality of the world.