Best place to buy/sell race build FRS/BRZ?

[sstfnv]

Originally Posted by philooo

The big problem really is that there is no SPEC86 class to race in. I think if this was a miata the market would be better.. I think
------

I hope someone at NASA and SCCA will work on some SPEC86, where modification are similar to the spec miata.

There are Spec86 cars in NASA Great Lakes and Northeast regions. It is still unofficial class and we run in PTD for the moment.

Originally Posted by philooo

In that aspect I may actually revert to stock brake and cheaper suspension to stay within the spirit of the spec86.

Your brakes and suspension don't prevent you from racing in Spec86. What you need to be legal for spec86 is an ecutek license and flash the spec tune.

IMHO your car is not selling because your asking price is on the high end. You did a great job building it but a race car is usually not a profitable investment.

FWIW, I saw your ads before I started building my Spec86 BRZ but figured that I can build one myself and will be exactly how I like it and will be a bit cheaper. Up to this point my build cost is just under $20k including the car and its registered with a rebuilt title. I personally enjoy the process of building the car and I figured that if I build one instead of buying a prepped car there will be one more BRZ/FRS to race with eventually

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by sstfnv

I can build one myself and will be exactly how I like it and will be a bit cheaper.

OP - This is your main obstacle: The majority of future racers prefer to build their own cars.

Despite the watchword being "It's cheaper to buy than to build.", most new racers choose to build, and most (all?) find out that it does cost more, but that doesn't change what the new racers that come after them choose to do.

[mrk1]

I like the car and price is a fair starting point, its not an easy sell as the car isn't wildly known about like a Miata or Boxster. I'd say 90% of cars I see exchange hands are to other local racers so running it with a big honking FOR SALE sign is my suggestion.

I building cages all day long and there are certainly guys out there that see value in an already caged car, as long as it meets there regs. Often new private guys are a little surprised at the scoop of caging a car, not only the cost but the time and process.

The what else I could build for the price argument is kinda silly, everyone has there own dream build. OP you mention is car is your low cost maybe "expendable" track car and I think thats exactly how you pitch it. BMW and Porsches are fun to track sure but the consumables cost really adds up.

[philooo]

@sstfnv
I'd be curious to see your build sheet

[sstfnv]

Originally Posted by philooo

@sstfnv
I'd be curious to see your build sheet

its actually posted on the spec86 site http://spec86.com/wp/build-64-1/

The car in action:

[philooo]

@sstfnv very cool to see the build sheet.

But I see that you 'repurposed' a couple of parts and missing a couple like wheels. I think a realistic build is $15k in parts, then add the car and labor for what it's worth.

Question: you did not upgrade radiator or oil cooling ?

[sstfnv]

Originally Posted by philooo

Question: you did not upgrade radiator or oil cooling ?

We used a WRX/Forester oil cooler and is actually included in the Misc OEM parts in the build sheet. For this power level it is OK and also didn't want to run an external oil cooler in w2w racing as it might get damaged if there is body contact. Last year I ran in TTD with my other car with a forester oil cooler, the oil temp never went above 254F which is pretty safe with good oil.

[TrqlessWonder]

Originally Posted by philooo

@sstfnv very cool to see the build sheet.

But I see that you 'repurposed' a couple of parts and missing a couple like wheels. I think a realistic build is $15k in parts, then add the car and labor for what it's worth.

Question: you did not upgrade radiator or oil cooling ?

Do yourself a favor, and toss this argument out the window. It's not a valid argument. What your car cost you to build has no real bearing on what it's worth to a buyer. Your car is worth what someone will pay for it. Not a penny more.

If someone makes me ramen noodles, using orphan baby seal tears for water, made in a gold pot, heated by the bare bosoms of virgins, and serves it to me in crystal, it's still a $0.14 meal.

Sstfnv has what he wants, for less than what it would cost for him to buy what you built, that maybe isn't completely what he wants. This is the value proposition you are up against. A turnkey-sized-cost salvage car that needs modification$ to do any organized, sanctioned w2w racing, so it's not even actually turn-key. That's what you have. It's nice and shiny, but it's still not a full build for anything other than track days, which buyers see as thousands more that you're costing them.

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by TrqlessWonder

If someone makes me ramen noodles, using orphan baby seal tears for water, made in a gold pot, heated by the bare bosoms of virgins, and serves it to me in crystal, it's still a $0.14 meal.

I'd pay extra for all of that, but I want to be there for the entire process. From baby seal tear harvesting to bosom selection auditions.

[philooo]

Originally Posted by TrqlessWonder

Sstfnv has what he wants, for less than what it would cost for him to buy what you built

I just wanted to highlight that @sstfnv actually spend the same money as what I am selling my car for ($20k + repurposed suspension parts).

His build sheet match closely what I did on my car: +- $15k on parts, then $8-10k on car + labor.

So overall a spec 86 should put someone in the $25k to build.

I think his build sheet is very interesting for potential Spec86 drivers.

FYI here is my build sheet (2 seats, 2 set of rims):

cost Description
7000 2013 Scion FRS 13k miles - rebuild title crashed
2130 invoice1-repair
1630 invoice2-repair
400 Rims 7x9 rims xxr527
1100 Tires BFG R1 245-40x17
405 Carbotech XP12 brake pads front / rear
100 motul brake race fluid
500 mishimoto oil cooler
350 mishimoto radiator
600 APR brake ducts with carbon fiber bump inserts.
3000 full cage with daytona bars.
1500 interior repainted same as outside color.
600 one momo daytona seat with side mount and fixed mounting plate
500 6 point harness Enduro Scrotch
600 one momo daytona seat with side mount and fixed mounting plate
500 6 point harness Enduro Scrotch
1200 Rims Enkei RPF1 17x8 +45
700 Tires adv08r - rain
500 hub adpator + quick release steering + momo rev 07
23315 Total for a runnning car


2459 RCE Tarmac2
2099 AP Racing Endurance from essex
800 Ground control camber plates with truss
300 raceseng rear cambe plate
495 open flash tablet
200 Carbotech XP12 front pads
200 subaru nuts and bolts + under carriage aero
155 oil pressure and temp gauge - innovate mtx dual gauge
155 0W20 oil
120 perrin inlet hose
100 braided brake line kit frotn and back with essex kit
100 motul 300 transmission
100 cage foam pads
100 spot trace gps
100 tow hook front and back
95 perrin brake master cylinder brace
60 gauge pod
55 whiteline differntial mount bushing insert KDT925
50 motul 300ls differential
50 horn upgrade
50 alcon caliper temperature sticker
40 perrin rear shifter bushin
40 whiteline crossmember bushing insert KDT922
30 Mtec clutch line
30 whiteline gearbox bushing KDT926
25 CL 6E pads (discoutned while buying bbk)
20 HKS oil filter
20 toyota obd2 cable
8048 Total improvements


31363 Total car as it sits

[GSpeed]

I don't see a mention of a logbook in this thread anywhere. If you're going to sell it as a racecar, a logbook will be worth it's weight in gold. Take it to a NASA weekend and get a logbook issued as a PT car. You don't even have to run anything, but that answers a LOT of questions for buyers about whether it's race-able.

Jake

[dradernh]

FWIW, if I wanted to build a solid track-day car, or a racing twin, and I chose your car to start the process, the absolute most I would offer would be $15K. That assumes that a careful inspection by a race shop has determined the condition of all the significant parts, and that they've been found to be in new & unused condition. My experience is that after the inspection the offer would be in the range of $12-13.5K, and the offer would depend totally upon what the inspection revealed.

Note that since it would be my car, a number of parts would come off to be sold for 40-60% or less than what you paid for them. See here:

[philooo]

I have the SCCA logbook, I assume i should go get the NASA book as well, I think I am missing the ignition cutoff switch, that may be worth installing...but I was waiting for @GSpeed to start selling theirs

[TrqlessWonder]

Originally Posted by philooo

I just wanted to highlight that @sstfnv actually spend the same money as what I am selling my car for ($20k + repurposed suspension parts).

His build sheet match closely what I did on my car: +- $15k on parts, then $8-10k on car + labor.

So overall a spec 86 should put someone in the $25k to build.

I think his build sheet is very interesting for potential Spec86 drivers.

FYI here is my build sheet (2 seats, 2 set of rims):



31363 Total car as it sits

It's still the same invalid argument. The car commands a certain price, and there isn't a ton of demand at your price point. Value of the car is not necessarily related to what it cost to make.

See also: Veyron, LF-A. Awesome cars that sell for well below their cost of manufacture.