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BRZ Second-Gen (2022+) -- General Topics General topics for the second-gen BRZ


View Poll Results: How would you rate the design of the 2nd gen? 1 lowest & 5 highest
1 19 7.20%
2 25 9.47%
3 62 23.48%
4 104 39.39%
5 54 20.45%
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Old 11-24-2020, 09:54 AM   #813
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But nobody believes that! There are at least 10 people that have said it is impossible and a misprint.
Someone needs to fix that cuz theres something wrong about it.

-In-car tach shows redline occurs at 7500rpm
-Peak HP is 228 @ 7000rpm
-PR says redline is at 7000rpm

One of these is wrong.
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Old 11-24-2020, 10:06 AM   #814
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Yeah I am not overly concerned with temps, just pressure. A lot of the high end synthetics don't break down till well above those temps and people seem to get really concerned when they see high temps but don't know their pressures.
Yeah, even 300F generally regarded OK for good synth.
I don't know my oil pressure :O But judging from data from others, should be sufficient with 30-weight full-synth at 275F...

Quote:
To answer your other post, I peak out at around mid 270's during a long session during the summer. I have read through both those threads on temps/pressure. Though like I said I haven't ruled out my sending unit or position of the unit being the issue. It is just something I have observed on my own car and went back to 0-20 because of it.
I always hit just over 270F indicated on the factory gauge, and it always stays fixed there, pretty much regardless of ambient temp. Which makes me think that either there's some kind of thermostat, or above some fixed temperature the gauge overreports temperature at 272 and holds there until it gets hotter (I've never seen my temp move above 272F). Manufacturers have done this before...

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I am personally not happy with Killer B. After getting one of their pickup tubes and it was built wrong. I sent it back after talking with them about it, I offered to modify it but they insisted they replace it. After 3 months of waiting I told them forget about it because they already had a couple times.
Yeah, I hear you. Even the best aftermarket equipment isn't going to have NEARLY the kind of testing behind it vs. OEM. Especially OEM plus 1 year of beta-testing by customers

Which is why I haven't bothered with the aftermarket oil tube. We have reports of "race" builds not having problems with high-rpm cavitation up to 7600rpm, so for me the risk of aftermarket manufacturer defects plus possible installation errors outweighs the risk of running the stock pickup tube...
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Old 11-24-2020, 10:07 AM   #815
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Also...for @Tcoat: "Using design elements from the Subaru Global Platform, the chassis has gained rigidity through a reinforced chassis mounting system, sub-frame architecture and other connection points. Front lateral bending rigidity has been increased by 60-percent for the 2022 model to improve turn-in and response."
Yep. We both only get 1/2 a point since it just used elements on the bespoke chassis.
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Old 11-24-2020, 10:27 AM   #816
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The wonders of gear multiplication. 4.44 final drive and 3.63 1st gear is 16x. I’m assuming the gear ratios carry over to the new gen.

EVs usually have reduction gears, too. A model S has 9.73:1.


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I know how gears work but still fail to see how you are getting 2,000 to 2,800 foot pounds at the wheels.
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Old 11-24-2020, 10:34 AM   #817
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All-New 2022 Subaru BRZ Makes Global Debut

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I know how gears work but still fail to see how you are getting 2,000 to 2,800 foot pounds at the wheels.

At 3700RPM, the engine is making 184lb-ft of torque. 184lb-ft through first gear is bumped to 668lb-ft through the 3.63 first gear. Through the 4.44 final drive, that gets bumped to 2,965lb-ft.

The Hummer EV claims 11,500lb-ft at the wheels. A 3500HD makes 14,129lb-ft at the wheels.

The graph I made is a good way to normalize gear ratios and torque curves for different vehicles.

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Old 11-24-2020, 10:54 AM   #818
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To clarify, I came up with this by making a table that shows torque versus RPM using 500RPM increments and estimating the torque based on what we know from the specs and the cluster displays. Then I made another table with speed from 10-140mph and calculated the engine speed in the ideal gear at all those speeds. Then I looked to my engine speed torque table to see what the torque was at that given engine speed. Knowing the engine torque, gear ratio, and vehicle speed, I now calculated the wheel torque. Do this for all the speeds and the chart I posted falls out. It isn’t perfect but it gives a pretty good idea of the twist you can expect to feel at a given speed so long as you are in the ideal gear.


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Old 11-24-2020, 10:54 AM   #819
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At 3700RPM, the engine is making 184lb-ft of torque. 184lb-ft through first gear is bumped to 668lb-ft through the 3.63 first gear. Through the 4.44 final drive, that gets bumped to 2,965lb-ft.

The Hummer EV claims 11,500lb-ft at the wheels. A 3500HD makes 14,129lb-ft at the wheels.

The graph I made is a good way to normalize gear ratios and torque curves for different vehicles.

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Of course! Sorry. I had my head up my ass for a minute there. Was stuck in engine dyno torque mode.
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Old 11-24-2020, 11:24 AM   #820
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Through the 4.44 final drive, that gets bumped to 2,965lb-ft.
Do we have confirmation of transmission and diff gear ratios?

With ~20% more torque in most of the rev range, I would have assumed overall gearing at least 5% taller vs. current-gen, not 3% shorter!

With same transmission ratios, I would have expected 4.1 or 3.9 diff gearing for 2nd-gen...
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Old 11-24-2020, 11:40 AM   #821
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All-New 2022 Subaru BRZ Makes Global Debut

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Originally Posted by ZDan View Post
Do we have confirmation of transmission and diff gear ratios?

With ~20% more torque in most of the rev range, I would have assumed overall gearing at least 5% taller vs. current-gen, not 3% shorter!

With same transmission ratios, I would have expected 4.1 or 3.9 diff gearing for 2nd-gen...

I assumed carryover of the 2020 ratios. Gear ratios haven’t been confirmed. I hope they don’t make the gearing taller. These are sports cars, dammit!


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Old 11-24-2020, 11:41 AM   #822
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Originally Posted by ZDan View Post
Do we have confirmation of transmission and diff gear ratios?

With ~20% more torque in most of the rev range, I would have assumed overall gearing at least 5% taller vs. current-gen, not 3% shorter!

With same transmission ratios, I would have expected 4.1 or 3.9 diff gearing for 2nd-gen...
I think with the modest power bump, a 4.1-4.3 would serve the new gen perfectly (coming from a 4.3 on the 2018). Hopefully with some slight modifications to specific gear ratios. We'll see!
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Old 11-24-2020, 11:45 AM   #823
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I’m guessing gearing will be optimized for 0-60 for marketing then modified on the refresh for whatever enthusiasts commonly do with aftermarket parts, which most likely is more aggressive gearing.
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Old 11-24-2020, 11:52 AM   #824
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No clue why I was thinking 4.4 final drive instead of 4.3. I’ll correct the spreadsheet.


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Old 11-24-2020, 12:12 PM   #825
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From my understanding, the Forester type oil/water heat exchanger functions more to warm the oil quicker, than as an actual oil cooler. Perhaps in extreme temperatures it also helps keep oil temp from overrun.
It does both. I have it on my car. It is definitely more of a cooler than an oil warmer, but that part is also nice.

I’m sure you would find that a turbo acts as an oil warmer much better than the oil regulator does on the FA20/24F, especially when compared to the oil warming times on NA or supercharged cars, so it is much more of a cooler. The addition of the oil regulator to the FA24D is probably because compression is higher, which can significantly raise temperatures, and because external oil coolers were such a popular mode on this platform for track use.
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Old 11-24-2020, 12:19 PM   #826
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I think with the modest power bump, a 4.1-4.3 would serve the new gen perfectly (coming from a 4.3 on the 2018). Hopefully with some slight modifications to specific gear ratios. We'll see!
Not sure why the 4.1 is being knocked around since it was already bumped up to a 4.3 for 3 years now. I think that the difference it made between my 2014 and my 2020 is one of my favourite things. It is truly noticeable for the better.

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I’m guessing gearing will be optimized for 0-60 for marketing then modified on the refresh for whatever enthusiasts commonly do with aftermarket parts, which most likely is more aggressive gearing.

A lot of what they will do with it will be dictated by emissions and mileage. I know people like to pretend that is meaningless but it is their constraint and they have to compromise.


As I said above I completely love the change from the 4.1 to 4.3 but it came at a cost. I drive the same route, the same way every day. My drive is 95% 70mph with cruise on 80% of that time so there is very little fluctuation in mileage.
With the FRS my average mileage was an unwavering 32MPG. With the 86 it is now an unwavering 30MPG. I don't care but even though it is only 2MPG you can bet that Subaru/Toyota will! As the requirements get tighter and tighter they will need to scavenge every single MPG they can get and that will be counter to what most "enthusiasts" want from the car.
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