Engine internals for 500-600 HP turbo

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

I wouldn't say I made a negative comment. I just disagree with what others are saying based off R&D and doing it. I started a post that ended up being over 20 pages and then it died and came back to life a year later and was finally deleted not by me but by the mods or so I'm told. I don't pay for sponsorship here as I am a privateer and am not trying to sell anything. So with that being said, IMO since I'm not paying I'm not going to win a argument no matter how much I'm right. As everyone can see by my post deletion, which is a shame because their was a ton of good knowledge in their that is now gone, such as the rods really are the weak factor.


As far as constructive is concerned IMO its not constructive mislead people by assumed knowledge. The poor soul who buys into your self proclaimed expertise is the real victim but that's just my opinion. Who am I anyway, Just a guy who has done it and continues to do it.

I want to read your comments. Can you please post and ignore the negative comments?

[gtengr]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

I just disagree with what others are saying based off R&D and doing it.

What do you disagree with specifically?

[Hags86]

I spoke to FRS Justin and it turns out my build has more similarities than differences to his. Pistons, rods, closed deck, 1/2" ARP studs, JE MLS head gasket are all the same. I'm using lighter springs but then I'm not running the same boost.

Most of his concern was based on thinking I was after 500-600 rwhp but that number is an engine HP number. Shooting for approx 450 rwhp.

Differences stem from the fact that he drag races his with a huge turbo and has a sleeved block. I'm circuit racing mine with a smaller turbo. I'm much more concerned about oil pressures at high temps for extended periods than a drag racer needs to be. This is the area where I'm going into an expensive build with my fingers crossed - still not confident this problem will be solved.

[Hags86]

Here is a bit of data. Stock engine, small turbo, 0w-40 engine oil with an external cooler (since relocated for better airflow). 240rwkW on e85.

There is maybe 5 laps of data with only 2 hot laps.

As the temp increases the oil pressure decreases. at say 7000rpm I'm seeing 55psi at 115C. Maybe someone can tell me otherwise, but I don't think that is enough when a larger turbo with more heat and more power is injected into the equation.

[Hags86]

Same data but with different scales to make it easier to read.

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by Hags86

I spoke to FRS Justin and it turns out my build has more similarities than differences to his. Pistons, rods, closed deck, 1/2" ARP studs, JE MLS head gasket are all the same. I'm using lighter springs but then I'm not running the same boost.

Most of his concern was based on thinking I was after 500-600 rwhp but that number is an engine HP number. Shooting for approx 450 rwhp.

Differences stem from the fact that he drag races his with a huge turbo and has a sleeved block. I'm circuit racing mine with a smaller turbo. I'm much more concerned about oil pressures at high temps for extended periods than a drag racer needs to be. This is the area where I'm going into an expensive build with my fingers crossed - still not confident this problem will be solved.

Actually I'm running a closed deck brother. I would suggest running a thicker oil 10w40 would be my starting point. The amount of hp you gain from thin oil is not worth the gamble of a rod bearing. Just my 2 cents

[Hags86]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

Actually I'm running a closed deck brother. I would suggest running a thicker oil 10w40 would be my starting point. The amount of hp you gain from thin oil is not worth the gamble of a rod bearing. Just my 2 cents

Got it - closed deck. Thought you had the closed deck and sleeves.

My understanding is a 0w-40 or a 10w-40 is the same at operating temps no?

Spoke to my engine builder again this morning. He's confident shiming the oil pressure relief valve will give approx 15psi more pressure so I'm proceeding. We'll see what it does in a few weeks when I have it back together and can arrange a track day to put it through it's paces.

[Surok]

i am running 10w40 but i am not sure on oil temp for that. when i get my car back will take some videos for you of my oil temp/ pressure meters so you can compare notes.

i will bring the car for a roadtrip to melbourne and we can compare directly if you want. is there E85 in melbourne?

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by Hags86

Got it - closed deck. Thought you had the closed deck and sleeves.

My understanding is a 0w-40 or a 10w-40 is the same at operating temps no?

Spoke to my engine builder again this morning. He's confident shiming the oil pressure relief valve will give approx 15psi more pressure so I'm proceeding. We'll see what it does in a few weeks when I have it back together and can arrange a track day to put it through it's paces.

That is going to be a double edged sword as in
1 yes you have more pressure but your also creating more load on the pump gears. (minimum concern) but worth factoring
2 yes more pressure and with pressure will increase flow and with flow increased its less time to cool the oil. I believe that is going to start oil temps to rise and not level out.


Also consider thermal protection on block, that helps quite a bit.


You can always build a custom oil cooler but that will add weight...

[Hags86]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

Also consider thermal protection on block, that helps quite a bit.

.

What is this?

[stevo_12v]

Originally Posted by whataboutbob

Might also want to consider WPC treatment on friction surfaces. +1 for the Reimax oil pump gear. I chose to use one for my build.

I had this done when I had my build. Both of them are in CA, they are only 35mins drive away too. Best bet(if you are overseas like me) is to have whatever engine parts for your build, to get WPC treated(eg crank). It would be cheaper than to buy the parts here, ship to US(CA) to get WPC treated, then shipped back to Aust. Just get the new parts for your engine build, get whatever's needed to be WPC treated.





Oh, and ditch ID1050's, you'll max them out. Go 1700's or 1300's at least.