2013s less responsive than 2017s? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

370zBRZ · 07-25-2018, 01:33 PM

My buddy test drove my '13 BRZ and said his new '17 86 was more responsive in every way.

Is this normal or is it an issue that early year models have? I just got the used BRZ and I've never driven the newer ones.

xenarc · 07-25-2018, 01:39 PM

The new ones have 5 more horsepower and come with a Gallo 24 instead of the older models that have the Gallo 12.

SuperTom · 07-25-2018, 01:46 PM

you can get the 5hp back but the gearing is main difference in response

wolffbite · 07-25-2018, 01:47 PM

2017 MTs got a revised final drive ratio so all the gears are/feel shorter. Combined with the 5HP/TQ bump and some revised suspension bits here and there it probably does make the car feel "more responsive" or at least different to drive.

Leonardo · 07-25-2018, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370zBRZ

My buddy test drove my '13 BRZ and said his new '17 86 was more responsive in every way.

Is this normal or is it an issue that early year models have? I just got the used BRZ and I've never driven the newer ones.

People generally are trying to convince themselves as much as they are everyone else that their setup, car, or whatever is the ONE. Yes this is normal.

A newer one will likely have a few upgrades. Which are nice. But, worth worrying about. IMO, NO. If they were, you would have purchased a new car.

My suggestion is to: perform regular maintenance, add the mods you want, have fun driving, and not worry about how your "buddy's" car may have slight improvements from the factory.

Trust86 · 07-25-2018, 01:53 PM

Your buddy is justifying his purchase, making him feel 1000% better.
With the money you saved buying used vs a 2017, slap some decent coil overs on your car, decent tires with a good alignment, header and a tune and then tell him your car is more responsive in every way.

rvoll · 07-25-2018, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370zBRZ

My buddy test drove my '13 BRZ and said his new '17 86 was more responsive in every way.

Is this normal or is it an issue that early year models have? I just got the used BRZ and I've never driven the newer ones.

There were a bunch of small changes made to the car in 2017 that does make the newer ones more responsive. In fact, my 2018 has more quiet and ride comfort as well. I've driven the 2018 and a 2016, and these changes are real. However, they are not huge. From my perspective, if you want a more comfortable and quiet car, then it is worth going for a 2017+. The 2018 adds Android Auto/CarPlay as well. However, if you are going to mod it anyway, there's not enough of an increase to justify the extra money spent for the new model. I'm not going to mod mine (except for tires), so for me, it was worth it. And I don't want the extra noise of headers and exhaust upgrades -- which is the cost of extra hp. But it seems that most of you want that extra noise and "firmer" ride, and if that's what you want, then you get very little benefit from a new model.

dhuang · 07-25-2018, 03:17 PM

I feel my '17 BRZ is faster than my '13 OFT Stage 2 FR-S.

But it could all be in my head... then again, my FR-S put down 175WHP on the dyno...

I believe stock '13-16 is closer to 160WHP. Stock '17+ gets about 180WHP, and don't forget the more aggressive gearing -- I noticed that the most when I switched.

norcalpb · 07-25-2018, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhuang

I feel my '17 BRZ is faster than my '13 OFT Stage 2 FR-S.

But it could all be in my head... then again, my FR-S put down 175WHP on the dyno...

I believe stock '13-16 is closer to 160WHP. Stock '17+ gets about 180WHP, and don't forget the more aggressive gearing -- I noticed that the most when I switched.

So you’ve had the 4.1 and the 4.3, but if you could switch to a 4.56 would you? Or would that make the gearing too short for DD?

rcm47 · 07-25-2018, 03:40 PM

The difference between my 2018 and 2013 is night and day but it’s a tS vs an early FRS

krayzie · 07-25-2018, 03:48 PM

I'm not surprised if the facelift model is a little better in responsiveness as they have stiffened up the rear subframe, a little smaller diameter steering wheel, and chassis strengthening at various places. Also the new suspension has a different tune.

dhuang · 07-25-2018, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by norcalpb

So you’ve had the 4.1 and the 4.3, but if you could switch to a 4.56 would you? Or would that make the gearing too short for DD?

I'm happy with the 4.3, mainly because it's a fairly conservative gain in mechanical torque, and I don't have to throw more monies at the car.

370zBRZ · 07-25-2018, 03:57 PM

I got a great deal on Tomei EL headers.

Would slapping those on make a difference and make it closer in terms of responsiveness? Is a tune necessary with EL headers?

Leonardo · 07-25-2018, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370zBRZ

I got a great deal on Tomei EL headers.

Would slapping those on make a difference and make it closer in terms of responsiveness? Is a tune necessary with EL headers?

A tune is always necessary to gain HP form adding parts.

07-25-2018, 01:33 PM	#1
370zBRZ Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Drives: 370z Location: Toronto Posts: 17 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	2013s less responsive than 2017s? My buddy test drove my '13 BRZ and said his new '17 86 was more responsive in every way. Is this normal or is it an issue that early year models have? I just got the used BRZ and I've never driven the newer ones.

07-25-2018, 01:46 PM	#3
SuperTom Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Drives: C5 Corvette, '17 Toyota 86, Jeep XJ Location: New Castle DE Posts: 1,500 Thanks: 1,435 Thanked 914 Times in 528 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	you can get the 5hp back but the gearing is main difference in response __________________

07-25-2018, 03:17 PM	#8
dhuang Cannonball Record Guy Join Date: Jul 2012 Drives: Series.Yellow, 4C, Fit Location: Houston / Atlanta Posts: 493 Thanks: 480 Thanked 429 Times in 223 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 2 Thread(s)	I feel my '17 BRZ is faster than my '13 OFT Stage 2 FR-S. But it could all be in my head... then again, my FR-S put down 175WHP on the dyno... I believe stock '13-16 is closer to 160WHP. Stock '17+ gets about 180WHP, and don't forget the more aggressive gearing -- I noticed that the most when I switched. __________________ 2017 Series.Yellow 2013 Whiteout VINwiki - Changing Automotive History

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Existing kits and how they fit on the 2017s	Xork	Forced Induction	0	05-15-2017 12:34 AM
Which entry level turbo kit is the most responsive?	Keenercarguy	Forced Induction	54	04-18-2017 03:40 AM
Real world gas mileage on the 2017s	brillo	Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum	44	01-09-2017 02:38 AM

07-25-2018, 01:39 PM	#2
xenarc Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Drives: 2017 SUBARU BRZ Location: MIAMI Posts: 198 Thanks: 3 Thanked 70 Times in 49 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	The new ones have 5 more horsepower and come with a Gallo 24 instead of the older models that have the Gallo 12.

07-25-2018, 01:47 PM	#4
wolffbite Just the tip Join Date: Mar 2017 Drives: 2017 DGM BRZ Location: BC, CANADA Posts: 630 Thanks: 912 Thanked 875 Times in 376 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	2017 MTs got a revised final drive ratio so all the gears are/feel shorter. Combined with the 5HP/TQ bump and some revised suspension bits here and there it probably does make the car feel "more responsive" or at least different to drive.

07-25-2018, 01:53 PM	#6
Trust86 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Drives: 2016 Halo FRS Location: US Posts: 414 Thanks: 290 Thanked 161 Times in 106 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Your buddy is justifying his purchase, making him feel 1000% better. With the money you saved buying used vs a 2017, slap some decent coil overs on your car, decent tires with a good alignment, header and a tune and then tell him your car is more responsive in every way.

07-25-2018, 03:40 PM	#10
rcm47 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Drives: 13’ FRS (traded), 18’ CWP BRZ tS Location: California Posts: 605 Thanks: 589 Thanked 300 Times in 147 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	The difference between my 2018 and 2013 is night and day but it’s a tS vs an early FRS

07-25-2018, 03:48 PM	#11
krayzie Drive From Home Join Date: Dec 2013 Drives: BRZ STI Performance Location: Filth City Posts: 4,914 Thanks: 2,368 Thanked 3,111 Times in 2,007 Posts Mentioned: 30 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	I'm not surprised if the facelift model is a little better in responsiveness as they have stiffened up the rear subframe, a little smaller diameter steering wheel, and chassis strengthening at various places. Also the new suspension has a different tune.

07-25-2018, 03:57 PM	#13
370zBRZ Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Drives: 370z Location: Toronto Posts: 17 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I got a great deal on Tomei EL headers. Would slapping those on make a difference and make it closer in terms of responsiveness? Is a tune necessary with EL headers?

User Name		Remember Me?
Password