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Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum The place to start for the Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 | GT86


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Old 11-25-2020, 06:23 PM   #29
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Clearly, Cayman was the benchmark during GT-86 design and they are in the same segment. At least, Tetsuya Tada thinks so.
Yes, Cayman was a benchmark. But it's not in the same segment...

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And, Cayman is the better car. You guys keep discussing your thing. Don't let me bother you.
I've owned a Cayman, I've driven several Caymans at the track. The 987 and 981 Caymans I've driven, are not by my estimation "better" cars. Faster? Yes. Better F/R weight distribution? Yes. Better overall? No.
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Old 11-25-2020, 06:36 PM   #30
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Yes, Cayman was a benchmark. But it's not in the same segment...

I've owned a Cayman, I've driven several Caymans at the track. The 987 and 981 Caymans I've driven, are not by my estimation "better" cars. Faster? Yes. Better F/R weight distribution? Yes. Better overall? No.
Segment is "sports cars". And Cayman is not an SUV, right? Or you think a twin is not a sports car?

Whatever guys ... enjoy your cars. I enjoy mine as well - with a realistic perspective.
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Old 11-25-2020, 06:49 PM   #31
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Segment is "sports cars". And Cayman is not an SUV, right? Or you think a twin is not a sports car?

Whatever guys ... enjoy your cars. I enjoy mine as well - with a realistic perspective.
"Sports car" has a different definition for every enthusiast. So whatever there. "Segment" would seem to imply similar $$$. But whatever there too.

The truth is, plenty of us have tried both and do NOT think the Cayman is a "better" car for us, REGARDLESS of class or segment. For ME, my BRZ is a better car than a Cayman. That's it. If I thought otherwise I'd still have a Cayman.
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Old 11-25-2020, 06:55 PM   #32
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And, Cayman is the better car. You guys keep discussing your thing. Don't let me bother you.
I knew about the quote, and I never said the 86 was a better car, my original point was that for twice the price, it better well be the better car.
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Old 11-25-2020, 09:28 PM   #33
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18 months ago I made the switch to a 2014 Porsche Cayman S from my Edelbrock supercharged BRZ. The change in quality was clear, but I wanted to come back and mention some things. The grass isn't always greener on the other side.

I feel like I am piloting the Porsche, but driving the BRZ. The Porsche is so capable that it seems like overkill at times. The gearing is stupidly long. I know I complained about having to shift into third in the BRZ to get to 60mph, which affects the 0-60 time...never will again.

The PDK of the Porsche is NOT like a manual, so I am now moving to a manual GTS.

Essentially, the 86 is a wonderful, everyday, fun car that I miss. Maybe one day I will pick one up again.

This is a love letter to the 86 and all it is. Love what you have guys!

Anyone else make a move to another car and has some regrets?
I just introduced myself in the general discussion, complete with pic of my "new" FRS. I too came from a Porsche Cayman, a 2007 Base. Everything you say holds true for my experience, which I'd summarize by saying: "The Porsche is as overrated as the FRS is underrated." I'd much rather drive an underrated car than an overrated one!
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Old 11-25-2020, 09:41 PM   #34
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okay, here for you
Quoting Tetsuya Tada
We can testify to how good a job these chaps have done, especially considering the lofty aim they were shooting at. “Dynamically,” says Tada-san, “we were aiming - always - for the Porsche Cayman.”

Clearly, Cayman was the benchmark during GT-86 design and they are in the same segment. At least, Tetsuya Tada thinks so.

And, Cayman is the better car. You guys keep discussing your thing. Don't let me bother you.
Z

I say the FRS/BRZ is the better car. Of course, the phrase "the better car" is rather ambiguous. Let's put it this way: I felt I OUGHT to drive the Porsche. With the FRS, I WANT to drive it.

Too much "drinking the koolaid" when it comes to Porsche. People who know nothing about cars would ooh and ahh when they saw my Cayman. They pay no attention to the FRS. Which simply says that they understand the hype more than the understand the car itself.

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Old 11-25-2020, 09:50 PM   #35
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My stepson summed it up nicely. We were in tha garage and looking at my track,focused, winged 86 and I told him I was thinking about a Cayman. He said “Dude! This things a racecar and a Cayman will be just another Porsche.”
That was it for me. Never pursued the cayman again. He was right.
He’s 24 and drives an M3
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Old 11-25-2020, 09:58 PM   #36
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Thanks for all your input...it's an interesting subject for me and shows that things are not just black and white.
When you mash them all together they make brown
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Old 11-25-2020, 10:48 PM   #37
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I spun a bearing on my FRS and while trying to make a decision on what route to take and then going forward with a rebuild, I drove my dadís manual Boxster. I drove it to and from work (21 miles each way) for 2 months. I had enough seat time to feel confident throwing it around with PSM disabled. It had a somewhat raw feel (only with PSM disabled) similar to my FRS. The steering communicated well like my FRS. DBW was crazy laggy which bugged the shit out of me. What I loved most about the Porsche was what I hate most about my FRS, the engine sound. What I hated most about the Porsche is what I love most about my FRS, the transmission. I enjoyed my time in the car but really missed my car and when I got it back on the road it confirmed without a doubt that my FRS is WAY more fun to drive. My dadís Boxster was a 2.6 986 5MT and Iím sure a newer Cayman would be way better (especially the DBW) but Iím never surprised when I see another thread pop up on this forum where people say theyíve owned both and prefer their Twin. Iím seriously considering a Cayman in my future and a few of my AutoX friends are also. I suspect I will have opportunities to autox one before pulling the trigger on one for myself. Who knows, a real test drive may change my mind.

In a perfect world my FRS would make 250hp NA, rev to 8k and sound like a Porsche. If that criteria could be met then a Cayman wouldnít even be a consideration for me. I suspect 250hp on the FA24 wouldnít be that hard to accomplish but it will still sound like garbage.
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Old 11-26-2020, 10:52 AM   #38
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When you mash them all together they make brown
But it's really *great* shit Mrs. Preski!
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Old 11-26-2020, 12:13 PM   #39
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I spun a bearing on my FRS and while trying to make a decision on what route to take and then going forward with a rebuild, I drove my dad’s manual Boxster. I drove it to and from work (21 miles each way) for 2 months. I had enough seat time to feel confident throwing it around with PSM disabled. It had a somewhat raw feel (only with PSM disabled) similar to my FRS. The steering communicated well like my FRS. DBW was crazy laggy which bugged the shit out of me. What I loved most about the Porsche was what I hate most about my FRS, the engine sound. What I hated most about the Porsche is what I love most about my FRS, the transmission. I enjoyed my time in the car but really missed my car and when I got it back on the road it confirmed without a doubt that my FRS is WAY more fun to drive. My dad’s Boxster was a 2.6 986 5MT and I’m sure a newer Cayman would be way better (especially the DBW) but I’m never surprised when I see another thread pop up on this forum where people say they’ve owned both and prefer their Twin. I’m seriously considering a Cayman in my future and a few of my AutoX friends are also. I suspect I will have opportunities to autox one before pulling the trigger on one for myself. Who knows, a real test drive may change my mind.

In a perfect world my FRS would make 250hp NA, rev to 8k and sound like a Porsche. If that criteria could be met then a Cayman wouldn’t even be a consideration for me. I suspect 250hp on the FA24 wouldn’t be that hard to accomplish but it will still sound like garbage.
Get a Porsche 718 and you'll have a 4banger boxer and they'll sound similar to the twins to a certain extent

I noticed on the 2022 BRZ first ride videos the FA24 (lets just call it that since its not confirmed nor denied what its engine code is) actually sounds a bit better than the FA20 when its being wrung out. It sounds smoother and has a nicer pitch to it. At idle and startup it does sound the same as the FA20.
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Old 11-26-2020, 12:23 PM   #40
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Get a Porsche 718 and you'll have a 4banger boxer and they'll sound similar to the twins to a certain extent

I noticed on the 2022 BRZ first ride videos the FA24 (lets just call it that since its not confirmed nor denied what its engine code is) actually sounds a bit better than the FA20 when its being wrung out. It sounds smoother and has a nicer pitch to it. At idle and startup it does sound the same as the FA20.
The larger displacement will make it deeper and smoother sounding. Will of course just sound like a deeper and smoother boxer though. There is no getting away from the boxer sound no matter what the size or make. Personally I will always prefer that boxer rumble no matter what tone it has over any straight 4 tin can whine.


It is the same reason you can tell what engine a Mustang has in it just from hearing it accelerate.
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Old 11-26-2020, 01:38 PM   #41
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After reading all this about all i can really add is YES

I have both a Boxster S and the BRZ.
Both are great drives.
Love them both.
If i had to make a choice it would be the BRZ.
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Old 11-26-2020, 08:26 PM   #42
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Get a Porsche 718 and you'll have a 4banger boxer and they'll sound similar to the twins to a certain extent

I noticed on the 2022 BRZ first ride videos the FA24 (lets just call it that since its not confirmed nor denied what its engine code is) actually sounds a bit better than the FA20 when its being wrung out. It sounds smoother and has a nicer pitch to it. At idle and startup it does sound the same as the FA20.

Yeah the 718 4 banger sounds just as garbage as the FA20.
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