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Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum The place to start for the Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 | GT86


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Old 04-06-2016, 07:17 AM   #141
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Much as I respect you Tcoat, you're well wide of the mark here - pistonheads is far from a clickbait blog. It's a pretty serious and well known site that employs proper motoring journalists (Chris Harris is a former PH writer/reviewer) and doesn't indulge in random speculation or stories from unidentified inside sources. They've previously run a GT86 as a long-term test car and also had access to the "Heritage" 86s that Toyota built with classic liveries. They will have official contacts at Toyota GB, so "We've just had confirmation from Toyota GB" means it's the current official Toyota line.
ETA: Not sure what you're expecting from Toyota - they're not likely to advertise that UK cars won't get the increased power/torque that US cars will be getting. All that Toyota GB will do is not make reference to engine changes, like their official news story here. The US Toyota website here does hint at the power increase.

Bear in mind that Toyota already tweaked the car last year to meet the current Euro 6 emission requirements, which suggests the 86 is probably near the limits without making further changes. For PM and CO, the limits seem to be lower for Euro 6 than LEV III; although that doesn't take into account differences in the test cycle between Europe and Cali - which could also be a factor in whether or not certain changes comply with the limits.

LOL Oh I have been wrong before! Unfortunately all car blogs have become "clickbait" in my eyes. Some are just more reliable than others but the bad ones have destroyed my trust in even the good ones. I will remain skeptical on any statements until I see the same thing documented by Toyota themselves. I was not throwing any of my options out there as fact since I don't know what they are doing. I was just speculating. Like many guys here my writing style may make me come across as I think I know when in fact I think no such thing.
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Old 04-06-2016, 08:12 AM   #142
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LOL Oh I have been wrong before! Unfortunately all car blogs have become "clickbait" in my eyes. Some are just more reliable than others but the bad ones have destroyed my trust in even the good ones. I will remain skeptical on any statements until I see the same thing documented by Toyota themselves. I was not throwing any of my options out there as fact since I don't know what they are doing. I was just speculating. Like many guys here my writing style may make me come across as I think I know when in fact I think no such thing.

There are plenty of bad ones out there, and it probably doesn't help that the PH site is rather aesthetically-challenged. It's part of the Haymarket group (a well known UK publishing/media company) and you won't see any "stories" sourced from motoring.com.au. I'd generally stay clear of their forums though...

Like I say, I can't see Toyota coming out and officially saying "you guys aren't getting a power increase"; most potential buyers in the UK won't know about the changes happening the other side of the Atlantic and too many people think the 86 is underpowered as it is (I am not one of them). If there is to be a power increase here in the UK, it's conspicuously absent from the initial story Toyota ran on their blog.
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Old 04-06-2016, 10:14 AM   #143
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There are plenty of bad ones out there, and it probably doesn't help that the PH site is rather aesthetically-challenged. It's part of the Haymarket group (a well known UK publishing/media company) and you won't see any "stories" sourced from motoring.com.au. I'd generally stay clear of their forums though...

Like I say, I can't see Toyota coming out and officially saying "you guys aren't getting a power increase"; most potential buyers in the UK won't know about the changes happening the other side of the Atlantic and too many people think the 86 is underpowered as it is (I am not one of them). If there is to be a power increase here in the UK, it's conspicuously absent from the initial story Toyota ran on their blog.
You last points are exactly why I have my doubts about the validity of the claimed Toyota confermation. They are not likely to keep it low key but then respond with a confirmation to a web site journalist. I guess my real argument is not so much about the nature of the claim but it's source.
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Old 04-06-2016, 10:51 AM   #144
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I was on a 125 CBR before the R6 for about 20 days, decided I needed (felt like/wanted/young age hubris/whatever you want to call it) more power. Got the R6, took it up to 220kmh on back roads daily, and was hooked.

Looking back, it was a blessing in disguise that the engine threw a rod, and I was too broke at the time to fix it. I was that perfect combo of young, stupid and inexperienced to become a candidate for organ donation. A few months after that, dad got drunk, and kind of broke down when he told me about the time he almost died as a 14 year old (riding illegally, without a license on some back roads near the homestead) after he crashed his Yamaha 350 in '75. I got lucky as hell that I didn't get into a speed wobble, as I had no idea how to recover from it at the time. Now when I look back, I kick myself for getting rid of the 125 CBR, that would be an awesome around town run about if I still had it.
You guys discussing about bikes has got me thinking about the Yamaha RD350S, RX100s and RX135s that I grew up with. The sheer sound of the 2 stroke coupled with smell of unburnt gas... Wow!

More recently I was impressed with the Yamaha R-15. Redlines at 10,500 and pretty ordinary at lower rpms. Quite obvioulsy people complained about lack of torque for daily driving and the lack of a bigger engine. But what many of them didn't realize was that once you crossed 5000 rpm, all hell broke loose and the bike transformed into something else. All you would want is to do whatever you can to keep the revs high and keep the corners coming! Like Ultramaroon said - *goosebumps*

In more ways than one, it kind of draws parallels with what people are complaining about on the twins!
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Old 04-06-2016, 12:44 PM   #145
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Old 04-07-2016, 04:10 AM   #146
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You last points are exactly why I have my doubts about the validity of the claimed Toyota confermation. They are not likely to keep it low key but then respond with a confirmation to a web site journalist. I guess my real argument is not so much about the nature of the claim but it's source.
Maybe I wasn't clear, I think you've misinterpreted me! I should have said "If there's no increase in the UK, I can't see Toyota coming out and officially saying "you guys aren't getting a power increase"...(etc)" - because that's likely to provoke the "it's underpowered" brigade still further, and because hardly anyone in the UK will know that there's a power increase in the US. So, why would they mention it at all? "You know the thing people hate? We haven't changed it!"

The only reason I can think of that Toyota would talk about the power being unchanged is if they were asked by a journalist, in which case they would respond by saying "there's no power increase", and perhaps explain why. Which appears to be what they've done. They also replied to a moderator from the UK GT86 forum, saying:
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We only have information that was supplied to us by Toyota Motor Europe, which states the engine is unaltered. Unfortunately we can't comment on vehicles or press information in a different market. Sorry!
All the evidence, to me, says that there is no power increase in the EU.

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Dammit! We should've put this to the custard test!
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Old 04-09-2016, 11:18 AM   #147
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lurker

straight 6 is nice but v8/v10? *goosebumps*
How 'bout my buddie's straight 6?
[ame="http://youtu.be/Vk-AJEkkR9I"]http://youtu.be/Vk-AJEkkR9I[/ame]
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Old 04-09-2016, 01:22 PM   #148
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How 'bout my buddie's straight 6?
It sounds great! Those cams, pure sex when it gets on the pipe.

Ever get to drive it?
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Old 04-09-2016, 03:01 PM   #149
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It sounds great! Those cams, pure sex when it gets on the pipe.

Ever get to drive it?
Hah! That's his baby. He got it from his dad who started hot rodding it back in the '60's. So it's been in the family a few years....
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Old 04-09-2016, 03:12 PM   #150
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Hah! That's his baby. He got it from his dad who started hot rodding it back in the '60's. So it's been in the family a few years....
Wow, an heirloom.
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Old 04-10-2016, 03:14 AM   #151
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Bear in mind that Toyota already tweaked the car last year to meet the current Euro 6 emission requirements, which suggests the 86 is probably near the limits without making further changes. For PM and CO, the limits seem to be lower for Euro 6 than LEV III; although that doesn't take into account differences in the test cycle between Europe and Cali - which could also be a factor in whether or not certain changes comply with the limits.
Exactly. Small changes were happening constantly and one of them happened last year for the Euro 6 emission standards. It is not that the engine remained unaltered and that the engineering team was designing the last 4 years secretly an engine revision.

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All the evidence, to me, says that there is no power increase in the EU.
Fact is that there were lately a few small changes in the rest of the Subaru engine line. We haven't seen them yet in the FA20 engines. Changes were in some internals that provided less friction. However, think about it as a minimal improvement. For example, in the Subaru Forester and XV lines they could just contribute in a bit better fuel consumption. So, it is very possible to say that there are no power increases in the EU region and focus a bit more in the emission or consumption requirements. I believe this is the reason they will differentiate the power increase in the manual and auto version in the U.S.


Overall, it is funny to read over here about serious changes in engine, suspension, chassis or other areas. Technology cannot advance so much in a 3-4 years period. Especially when we talk about cars which have an evolution cycle of more than a century. Not if you keep the specs the same! If they wanted to tell us that the new car is something much better, then the first thing I would expect to see would be better and wider tires. We haven't seen that, even though they changed the rims. So, all the other things are pretty much nonsense.
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Old 04-10-2016, 03:20 AM   #152
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hate the fact that they put controls on the steering wheels. makes it look like a camry.
Pretty sure they even said they left the wheel without controls on purpose to make a clean and uncluttered wheel.

http://www3.toyota.com.au/86/features/interior/wheel
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