Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[Target70]

Originally Posted by Namuna

Ok, so after reading Boofneenee's comment about the boost being binary (it's either all the way on, or all the way off, no steps between), and it's been in the back of my mind...But I'm wondering --and forgive me if it's been discussed and dismissed ---, but couldn't there be some kind of potentiometer (or whatever appropriate equivalent) used so it's a gradual ramp up to full boost?

I'm in the same camp about not really stomping the gas pedal to the floor except on that rare occasion...So the notion of having to get used to doing that with this ESC seems a bit unnerving.

Here's a crazy DIY idea for a different place to put the boost-on switch... Instead of under the gas pedal, bust open the RPM gauge and attach one lead to the needle tip and the other lead as a strip that starts from say 3,500rpm and all the way up. Then under acceleration, once the rpm needle hits 3,500rpm and up, the circuit is closed and boost is on!

I am pretty sure Rob could adjust the ramp up, maybe make it a little smoother, I have also been noticing the "impact" of engaging the ESC, and also disengaging it. I haven't tried the OFT FF shifting yet, but I think I might have to set it up, because it is a very jarring ride when running it through the gears. Going WOT, (delay), (thump engagement.. redline already?), lift off throttle, (silence), shift, WOT, (delay), (thump again)...etc.

You have to remember that the way most of us are running it is on the OFT, which is tuned for WOT engagement, so even if you could rig up a different switch I don't think it would run right without a new tune.

While I can agree with a lot of boofneenee said, I have not noticed a change in throttle response, but then again I am on E85. I have my switch set at about 65% but will be raising it up closer to 80 or 90. I feel like it has plenty of power with my setup while off boost. I agree that I will not be using the system much, but when I what that power, it will be there. I think that with a softer engagement, and some type of bypass pipe/valve, you would solve most of boof's complaints.

I am itching to hook up my second dump pack and log for any boost increases, but still want to take things slow.

[l0aded]

I'm so jealous of you guys with your ESC's. Hopefully soon.

[shif7i7down]

Since everyone is giving a review I'll give mines
I've had the esc for roughly 6months now, pre 4.67FD install the esc was a godsend when compared to a stock 86. Power when i need it. I usually don't go wot in traffic but when i do i drink dos equis! :P
Anywho, i kinda like the go hard or go home feature of the esc; wot or nothing at all.
And for anyone that wants to go with a FD swap be prepared to lose .5psi , it seems that with a higher ratio the load isn't the same as stock so you"ll lose some psi but the car feel awesome up to 105mph, after that it just kinda feels like stock btw i don't recommend engaging the esc with an FD swap in the rain no matter how wide your tires are, mines are 235 and i still fish tail in 4th gear going wot in the rain or wet pavement.
Sorry for not being active on the forum lately, I've been to busy enjoying the esc

[WNDSRFR]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/autos...rbo/ar-BB8Ac4l


The concept seems to be spreading.

[Gary in NJ]

Originally Posted by Namuna

Ok, so after reading Boofneenee's comment about the boost being binary (it's either all the way on, or all the way off, no steps between)

The power delivery is NOT binary. There is a wide range of throttle position (and thus, power delivery) between idle and engagement of the ESC. When you want full power - you WANT full power. In this instance engagement of the ESC is not binary, but rather welcomed by its instantaneous engagement and delivery.

[Boofneenee]

Originally Posted by Gary in NJ

The power delivery is NOT binary. There is a wide range of throttle position (and thus, power delivery) between idle and engagement of the ESC. When you want full power - you WANT full power. In this instance engagement of the ESC is not binary, but rather welcomed by its instantaneous engagement and delivery.

I'm not sure how the word binary can be used here but it is either on or off. Their is no wide range power delivery here. On or off. You can engage it anywhere between 70% to 100% throttle. When engaged it doesn't come half way on or 3/4 power delivery. Its either on at 100% capacity or nothing at all. Their is no partial boost. Maybe others have found clever ways to play with your foot while driving to give the sensation their is partial boost.. I don't know.

My favorite part of the ESC was not necessarily at low rpms where the max tq was but higher up. Yea you narrow the boost to about 2psi at 7k but the power is noticeable and most importantly, I did not seem to get that jerking sensation as much when compared to boosting low rpm.

I'm beating this dead horse here because people need to understand that their is no partial boost. We can't pretend otherwise. On or off.

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by Boofneenee

I'm not sure how the word binary can be used here but it is either on or off.

LOL

[Gary in NJ]

Originally Posted by Boofneenee

I'm not sure how the word binary can be used here but it is either on or off.

Wrong. So wrong. Yes, the switch is on/off, but POWER DELIVERY is not binary.

There is linear power delivery on the way to WOT. It's not like you are pressing on the throttle for 75% travel and nothing happens. The engine is progressively putting out more power. When you reach the throttle switch power delivery is enhanced, but it not like you are in the Delorean Time Machinne and suddenly hit 88 mph.

When the ESC engages, it is felt - but it's not a friggin cat-shot off an aircraft carrier. It's a linear progression of power - power that wouldn't otherwise be available.

Don't oversell the power delivery, it's noticeable but not unexpectedly so. It's a nice linear power surge.

[Winjr]

Originally Posted by DAEMANO

With Phantom ESC + Catless header + e85. WOT = Same as above AND at less than WOT there is good power & torque so the transition from ESC OFF to ON feels more natural. The car still maintains it's excellent balance and chassis, but due to the header & e85 I have more power through a corner (at 20%-70% throttle) but not so much to unbalance the car. Then when I straighten out, I time my WOT so that I have the full effects of the ESC at corner exit. It was all a matter of learning to drive the car with its' new Phantom hardware. This feels brilliant as the car rockets away from a perfectly executed turn. Partial boost isn't really necessary because the car has plenty of power mid-corner if I enter and turn-in correctly. I love it.

Not using e85, but my experience is similar insofar as my driving style includes WOT (on ramp, lane changing city traffic requires a fair amount of this), and the transition to ESC "on" sometimes isn't even noticed by me. Few days ago, needed to scoot out of a lane, did, and it wasn't until a few seconds later, when I looked down at the voltmeter and saw it below 28 that I realized "huh, guess I engaged the ESC". All I knew was that I got out of that lane quick.

[Boofneenee]

Originally Posted by Gary in NJ

Wrong. So wrong. Yes, the switch is on/off, but POWER DELIVERY is not binary.

There is linear power delivery on the way to WOT. It's not like you are pressing on the throttle for 75% travel and nothing happens. The engine is progressively putting out more power. When you reach the throttle switch power delivery is enhanced, but it not like you are in the Delorean Time Machinne and suddenly hit 88 mph.

When the ESC engages, it is felt - but it's not a friggin cat-shot off an aircraft carrier. It's a linear progression of power - power that wouldn't otherwise be available.

Don't oversell the power delivery, it's noticeable but not unexpectedly so. It's a nice linear power surge.

My point had to do with the delivery of boost. It is not gradual. It takes a fraction if a second to spool up but when its on its 100%. Of course the engine continues to operate as normal and drives close to stock when not engaged but with respect to boost it is either on at %100 or off. No partial boost is created. If only we could get partial boost like a traditional FI product the ESC would have been more useful to me. Boost delivered at partial, and responsible throttle rather than throttle mashing.
I could boost while driving to and from work without the "holy hell" clear the road and get ready to put the pedal to the metal.

I guess not having partial or constant boost is a weakness and a strength of the ESC. With boost so infrequently you don't have to worry about supporting mods like oil cooling like you would with tradional boost.

I am trying not to trash tbis product because its really quite amazing. I just wanted to emphasize my point of the on/ off, no partial boost aspect. It had a greater impact on my likeability than I anticipated.

[Gary in NJ]

Originally Posted by Boofneenee

My point had to do with the delivery of boost and its delivery. The boost delivery is not gradual. It takes a fractjon if a second to spool up but when its on its 100%. Of course the engine continues to operate as normal and drives close to stock whrn not engaged but with respect to boost it is either on at %100 or off. No partial boost is created. If only we could get partial boost like a tradional FI product the ESC would have been more useful to me. Boost delivered at partial, and responsible throttle rather than throttle mashing.
I could boost while driving to and from work without the "holy hell" clear the road and get ready to put the pedal to the metal.

I guess not having partial or constant boost is a weakness and a strength of the ESC. With boost so infrequently you don't have to worry about supporting mods like oil cooling like you would with tradional boost.

I am trying not to trash tbis product because its really quite amazing. I just wanted to emphasize my point of the on/ off, no partial boost aspect. It had a greater impact on my likeability than I anticipated.

You didn't spend enough time with the product. You can get about 50% boost on your way to full boost via drag reduction. If you mash the throttle at low rpm, the ESC will pulse at 50%. By the time you get to WOT the turbine is still spinning as you engage 100% boost. Once again, we're only talking about 4-5 psi - it's not a clear the road, here I come experience.

[gtfapollo]

I don't know why people are having such an 'issue' with @Boofneenee 's preference as to how he wishes his car to perform. As stated multiple times this form of FI is amazing, but it doesn't suit everybody's driving style or what they wish for of their vehicle. Boof installed it, ran with it for a while but it does not suit his driving preferences. I don't understand why that is creating such an 'issue' with so many people. Many others now 'feel' that they have to justify the product. No you don't. All you have to do is let this person make their own decision. So what if he doesn't want it anymore. I mean really, so what? He may even choose some form of full time FI. Who cares?

Get it?

No need to try and continue to sell it to him. Bottom line: it doesn't suit everyone. We know that it isn't Fast And The Furious style 'instaboost' NOS with a microswitch, but the fact is he doesn't like the nature of it's power delivery regardless. So what?

Each to their own.

[Target70]

Originally Posted by gtfapollo

I don't know why people are having such an 'issue' with @Boofneenee 's preference as to how he wishes his car to perform. As stated multiple times this form of FI is amazing, but it doesn't suit everybody's driving style or what they wish for of their vehicle. Boof installed it, ran with it for a while but it does not suit his driving preferences. I don't understand why that is creating such an 'issue' with so many people. Many others now 'feel' that they have to justify the product. No you don't. All you have to do is let this person make their own decision. So what if he doesn't want it anymore. I mean really, so what? He may even choose some form of full time FI. Who cares?

Get it?

No need to try and continue to sell it to him. Bottom line: it doesn't suit everyone. We know that it isn't Fast And The Furious style 'instaboost' NOS with a microswitch, but the fact is he doesn't like the nature of it's power delivery regardless. So what?

Each to their own.

I don't think people are trying to re-sell him on it, I think everyone is just pointing out their take on the system, likes and dislikes, not to convince each other, but to inform those who are interested in trying the ESC. And besides the argument on semantics, I agree with points made by both sides.


If what Winjr, and Gary are saying is true, then the rough engagement I am having might be due to my relatively low throttle engagement. I just need to adjust the switch, and test it out, maybe try rolling into the throttle instead of getting about half then punching it. kind of like "squeeze the trigger Harley, don't yank on it". I did get to try out a 3rd gear 90 degree corner at about 30mph. It is good not to need to downshift, and the engagement isn't as severe in the higher gears, but I haven't gotten used to hitting the gas before I need the power in order to have a smooth exit. Instead of a weak exit followed by a launch down the strait.

[Sojhinn]

Originally Posted by Target70

I don't think people are trying to re-sell him on it, I think everyone is just pointing out their take on the system, likes and dislikes, not to convince each other, but to inform those who are interested in trying the ESC. And besides the argument on semantics, I agree with points made by both sides.


If what Winjr, and Gary are saying is true, then the rough engagement I am having might be due to my relatively low throttle engagement. I just need to adjust the switch, and test it out, maybe try rolling into the throttle instead of getting about half then punching it. kind of like "squeeze the trigger Harley, don't yank on it". I did get to try out a 3rd gear 90 degree corner at about 30mph. It is good not to need to downshift, and the engagement isn't as severe in the higher gears, but I haven't gotten used to hitting the gas before I need the power in order to have a smooth exit. Instead of a weak exit followed by a launch down the strait.

I actually like a lower engagement. I like to be able to go to full throttle without engaging the system. This allows me drive the car in its "pure form" while at the same time giving me the ability to kick ass when needed.

Also with the drag reduction system you can kind of do a partial engagement of the system. But that's a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

I am glad bofnee decided to post what he said. It keeps this thread true to real life. Like others have said this system is not for everyone.

In my opinion for what this system does at its price nothing comes close. Hell ask how much the traditional forced injection folks have spent and it may be closer to three times what we have paid or more.