c7 vs. supercharged 86

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by gtpvette

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...29k-miles.html

Beautiful car!

.. and the console shot shows the radio and HVAC controls are interchangeable with my '04 Suburban. Maybe I should buy it to have a matched pair! Maybe I could convince MomHawk it was a parts car...

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by gtpvette

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...29k-miles.html

Love the old C5 Z06's but dang that's a high asking price for that car, even at that mileage & condition.

[GrandSport]

I had a C7 Z51 (and C6 Z51) I tracked, and I currently have a Grand Sport, as the user name implies, that I track. Here are my thoughts:

Originally Posted by Hades

Just wondering what your guys' thoughts are on this. After pricing a supercharged 86 track build, looks like I'll end up paying nearly ~$40k all in. Used C7 z51 are ~$38-40k atm.

Initial thoughts:

1) Weight - C7 is *heavy*. It weighs ~400 pounds more than a c5 z06, which leads to more money spent on consumables & a more insulated driver feel.
2) Luxury/Comfort - of course, C7 is the winner here (*especially* if you find one with MRC)
3) Parts cost - C7 likely costs more here, an engine is ~$10k I think.
4) Sound - C7 wins here
5) Steering feel - 86 would likely win here, but I haven't test drove a C7 yet
6) Reliability - could either be a wash or C7 would win if the supercharger ends up breaking things (likely)

What say you?

C7 is heavy but carries its weight well. The Z51 definitely needs more tire in my opinion. GS and Z06 carry it will with the extra rubber. The chassis is spectacular. I damn near lifted my inside tires stock.

C7 is a fantastic daily driver if you don't have to deal with weather and don't mind higher operational cost. I could drive in it forever. The FRS is a miserable daily driver by comparison. High revs, louder, no touch screen/car play/etc, less comfortable, no mag ride to go plush to teeth-rattling, etc. The only downside is the C7 is lower (and you can lower another inch or so with preload bolts) and with the splitter combined with its overhang, it doesn't have much approach angle. Other upside of C7 is targa top. I love the roof off.

I wouldn't worry so much about parts like engines- they're pretty stout. With rev match, your clutch should last a while (don't get an auto, they have problems and overheat and etc). Tires will cost you though.
Sound: Z51 will have NPP so it will be quiet when you want it and get loud as you lay into it.
I've only driven an FRS with a very twitchy alignment (setup for autox, drove on road course), with swaybars and swings. With that said, the C7 feels great, but it's not an FRS.
Reliability: Lol z51 way over aftermarket supercharged anything.

Originally Posted by Hades

I'm planning to track a lot. To keep this OT let's stick to comparison to a C7 (z51). I love lotuses but they aren't really DD-able.

Yes, the corvette will be faster (although, it might go either way if you go high e85). That's a good point I forgot to mention.

I'm enjoying my FRS, but making it fast is definitely expensive unless you take a risk with used parts or an incomplete build.

If you're going to track it, get an grand sport. Trust me. You'll need the extra cooling and love the extra brake and tire. Plus, they all come with MagRide. If you get one with mag ride, get DSC controller. I think they've sorted out their issues now- they were a mess, but it lets you tune your dampers. So you can basically say how soft or stiff you want it, when you want it. IE: Race Mode 2: When going left at 0.8 or more G's, I want ______. Their factory tune is pretty good, I just stiffen or soften the whole thing depending on the track I'm at.

Just keep in mind, operating costs are very high. Running 18's (so way cheaper tires), no including engine, trans, clutch, diff etc- just tires and fluids, I'm at about $450/hr on track. It will probably be around $350-$400 for a Z51.

The GS is awesome, but it's a handful for sure. Way faster, way more grip, way more aero, way meaner. On the upside, you can basically get in a stock one, swap in SRF and swap brake pads (which takes about 45min because the pads come out of the top) and be good to go on the track. Cooling and all that are just fine stock. Z51 has substantially less cooling.

Any other questions, lmk.

[Khánh]

Originally Posted by gtpvette

Well,,, I've put 56K miles on my stock 86,, and 32K miles on my C7. Funny about the two,, for as much alike as they are also way different.


The 86 is more old school sports car,, it's about half the price of a C7 and has fewer bells and whistles. I love the way it drives but it has no real power. I bought it as a commuter car but really fell in love with it. Frankly if you wanted an 86 DD/track car,, buy a clean used one with some mods (coils, wider rims) then swap in a motor (my choice a 325HP V6). For less than $30K you'd be set to go and have $10K+ left over for consumables. As a sidebar, once my swap is done it goes back to being my DD and in 3 years becomes my track rat.


As for the C7,, it's without a doubt the best car I've ever owned and this is my 6th Corvette. Amazing power, great driver, 7 speed manual, rev matching on down shifts, dry sump I could go on and on. Right out of the box it's a DD/track car. Pricy though,, I paid $49K which was 20% off MSRP so I got a deal. This car costs twice what an 86 would.


If I were you??? Buy the lowest mileage C5 or C6 (newer is better) you can find for $25K. They are around,,, look for one some middle age guy has and polishes it every week. You get the price point of an 86 with the benefits of a Corvette. Truly the best of both worlds.

dang how can I get one for $49k? is that after tax and fees? do you think the z51 is a rough ride for dd? i was thinking of getting jst a base stingray cuz my budget is 50

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Khánh

dang how can I get one for $49k? is that after tax and fees? do you think the z51 is a rough ride for dd? i was thinking of getting jst a base stingray cuz my budget is 50

Shop outside of SoCal, but looks like you won't be under $50k after registering it.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=223379456


https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=217943421

There's a couple Z51's well under $50k near you though, several base models in your price range, if you're not going to track it why not? Even if it's a casual track day thing it should hold up if you don't try to be a hero.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

….There's a couple Z51's well under $50k near you though, several base models in your price range, if you're not going to track it why not? Even if it's a casual track day thing it should hold up if you don't try to be a hero.

Geez, I wish you hadn't said that. I see C7 Z51s in my area as low as $38K on CarGuru (unfortunately that one is white, AT, and has a HUGE ASS wing on it). Even so, I didn't need to know they were getting to that price range!

[gtpvette]

Originally Posted by Khánh

dang how can I get one for $49k? is that after tax and fees? do you think the z51 is a rough ride for dd? i was thinking of getting jst a base stingray cuz my budget is 50

It was a left over so to speak. I bought it in late Sept,, guess they wanted to make room for 2017's. No $49 was the price +tax and fees. MSRP was $61 and change,, still have the sticker.

The vette rides better than the FRS,, no problem as a DD,, I do 100+ miles a day to and from work.

As far as what to buy,,, market if different now than when I bought. Lots of nice used cars at decent prices. When I bought I couldn't find a used Z51 for $49. If I were you,, look for a clean used Grand Sport. You can get them for $50 and long term it'll hold it's value the best.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...800-miles.html

[GrandSport]

Corvette happy place to buy is around 3-4 years old with low mileage (15-20). It will probably be in the mid to high 30s and you can sell it with 80k miles for mid to high 20s. Maybe even 30.
I had my C6Z51 from 2012 through 2016. I bought it with 14k miles for $34k - and it had every single option except navigation. 4LT and all. $6x,xxx sticker. I sold it with 75k for $24k very easily. 4 years and 61k miles for $10k. Sign me up.

Grand Sport and Z06s tend to hold value better imo.

I bought my Grand Sport new because, well, I wanted it! I lost more in the first day of ownership on my C7 than 60k miles of the C6.

[Khánh]

thanks for the replies and tips... i haven't thought about buying it used but you made sense about losing value just by driving off the lot ... i've read with z51, it's recommended to get mag ride suspension or else it could be rough.. the z06 is way too fast for me.... the GS does look quite appealing with just the right power for me.. i have a fear of buying an expensive car used... i'm afraid i might overlook something while checking out the car and back of my mind thinking of why someone would sell the car so quickly after buying it haha

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by Khánh

thanks for the replies and tips... i haven't thought about buying it used but you made sense about losing value just by driving off the lot ... i've read with z51, it's recommended to get mag ride suspension or else it could be rough.. the z06 is way too fast for me.... the GS does look quite appealing with just the right power for me.. i have a fear of buying an expensive car used... i'm afraid i might overlook something while checking out the car and back of my mind thinking of why someone would sell the car so quickly after buying it haha

Typically it's because they over extended and really couldn't afford it in the first place, The second most common reason is because they buy and sell cars quickly to have a newer model.

I know BMW owners who will trade in their car every year because they don't want a one year old model.

Jaden

[Hades]

Wow, can't believe this thread is still going!


@GrandSport thanks for the insight. I definitely like the GS, but prices are pretty far out of my budget. Also, I'm not really thrilled about the higher operating costs.


I'm currently leaning on just saving up the dough for a better DD/weekend car, and keeping the FRS pretty much track-only. That being said, supercharger is pretty much out atm since it costs quite a bit of money to do it properly - at least $10-15k for a decent track setup, not to mention the extra consumable costs of extra engines/trannys. A shame, but I am loving the car's handling and it saves money keeping it stock at least.


I'm sure I'll own a C7 some day. I'm also thinking prices will drop once the C8 comes out.

[Hades]

@GrandSport since you mentioned the C6 and C7, can you comment on steering feel between the C6, C7, and 86? I'm always curious about that, since I absolutely love that 7 litre in the C6 z06 . But now I'm just dreaming


Those of you with the 86 + C7 combo, I'm assuming the pair works well together? I sometimes wonder if I'd just get bored with the 86 if I owned something like the C7, but I'm guessing the 86 is mostly just a (cheap) canyon/track car at that point.

[gtpvette]

Originally Posted by Hades

@[U]Those of you with the 86 + C7 combo, I'm assuming the pair works well together? I sometimes wonder if I'd just get bored with the 86 if I owned something like the C7, but I'm guessing the 86 is mostly just a (cheap) canyon/track car at that point.

For me the 86 was bought as a sporty commuter car as I do 100+ miles a day to and from work. Had the 86 for almost 2 years when I bought the vette. It was meant to be a retirement car,, that is paid for and with low miles when I retired in a few years and it'd be my driver.


Then I decided to do a swap in the 86 and have been DD the vette since,, its got almost 40K on it now. When the swap is done, the 86 will be my DD again,, just with more power. When I retire,, it'll become a track rat. Well at least that's the plan

[Dave-ROR]

I'd go Camaro SS 1LE over any LT1 powered C7. The GrandSport is great but I still wouldn't get it over the Camaro. I looked at the C7's repeatedly but couldn't make myself want one enough.

And I'd get the Camaro ZL1 1LE over any LT4 powered vette. :shrug: