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Mechanical Maintenance (Oil, Fluids, Break-In, Servicing) Everything related to the mechanical maintenance of the FR-S and BRZ


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Old 01-18-2014, 02:49 AM   #1
slizoth
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Replacement Battery

Right now I feel there are two big battery differences on the forums. In order to make an informed decision, I drafted up some stats on the different batteries.

DieHard Platinum Absorbed Glass Mat and Shorai Lithium Iron.

Using these two specific examples, I'd like to discuss some of the differences and I've written a few discussion questions.
  1. How will the weight difference affect my car?
  2. What if I want to install an after market sound system?
  3. What constitutes proper care for either battery?
  4. Which has better Cold Cranking Amps?
  5. Which can last longer without being driven/trickle charged?
  6. How long will these batteries last on the stock sound system with the engine off?
  7. Which has the longer lifespan and why?

Notes
Group 35 battery will physically fit, so long as the negative is on the left and the positive is on the right.
Most battery warranties are pro-rated NOT replacement, it will specifically say replacement warranty if that is an option.

Battery Stats


Battery Types
There are many different forms of battery but there are two basic types of batteries; starting battery (SLI starting lights ignition) & deep cycle battery. A deep cycle battery will deliver less instant energy, but greater long-term energy delivery while an SLI is high instant energy but not designed to be drained completely or provide long term usage (perfect for starting cars).

Lead Acid Pros | Cons
Wet Cell (flooded) - Cheapest, Common (stock), Environmentally detrimental
Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) - Safe, Hold Charge longer, Expensive, specialty charger required
Gel Cell - Resistance to hot temperatures, Safe, Faster charge times, Expensive

Lithium Pros | Cons
Lithium Ion (LCO) - Light weight, full power until fully discharged Very Expensive, Finite # of Cycles (2000-3000), Considered unsafe in Passenger vehicles
Lithium Iron (LFP) - Light weight, Safe, Eco-friendly, full power until fully discharged, longer calendar life, extremely low self discharge rate Very Expensive, Finite # of Cycles (2000-3000)

*Special note* Lithium cobalt oxide (LCO) has material that does not resist overheating well. Once started, Li-ion fires typically generate oxygen and are very difficult to extinguish. By contrast a lithium iron phosphate (LFP), even when overcharged, LFP changes only slightly in structure, preventing oxygen release and resisting thermal runaway.

My Conclusions
I've drawn three possible conclusions from my research and will choose only one.

1) Purchase a very nice battery tender and practice good battery maintenance to get long lasting life out of a Wet Cell Lead Acid battery.
2) Purchase an Odessy Brand AGM which is relatively maintenance free.
3) Purchase the Shorai package from KCMachine for a maintenance free, high end solution.

In terms of "Bang for your Buck" I recommend #1. You will see longer life out of a well maintained battery & a good charger will span multiple batteries, allowing you to get an extended life out of the cheapest and most abundant form of car battery.

Purchasing an AGM Odyssey brand battery would be an excellent middle ground. These batteries require virtually no maintenance, can be mounted in any position, made in the USA, and don't hit the wallet quite as hard.

Finally our third option, this is perfect for those of us whom see the car as a toy and a luxury item rather than a daily driver. One of the main drawbacks of LFP batteries is the limited cycle life, think of a cycle in this context as every time you start your car. If you drive your car only on the weekends, this is a great choice. The battery is light weight, cranks at full charge every time even at low capacity, passive discharge rate is very low, & it's made out of environmentally friendly materials. I would only dissuade you from this choice if you're very money conscious, use your car as a daily driver, and regularly use electronics with the engine off (such as the stereo & lights).

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A532X6JZL20"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A532X6JZL20[/ame]


Reference Material

Learn your Battery Basics (20min read)
Battery Stats Spreadsheet
Odyssey Battery Specs
DieHard FT86er
Shorai FT86er
Stock BRZ Battery Specs
Optima Replacement
Braille Lithium Ion
[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Shorai-LFX36L3-BS12-Extreme-Lithium-Powersports/dp/B005FIUMOG"]Amazon Prime has the Shorai for $270[/ame]
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Last edited by slizoth; 01-19-2014 at 04:33 PM.
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Old 01-18-2014, 03:57 AM   #2
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How will the weight difference affect my car?

Weight reduction helps all aspects of a car's performance, acceleration, braking, handling and even gas mileage are all positively affected by reducing a car's weight. Keep in mind that weight reduction is a sum of the parts, so the more you reduce the weight, the more you can feel it. For cars, lighter is better.

What if I want to install an after market sound system?

A car battery is used mainly to start the car. Once the car has been started, it is the alternator that runs the electrical system, so overall there is no negative effect to installing an aftermarket sound system as long as you are listening to it mainly when the car is running.

What constitutes proper care for either battery?

ANY battery will suffer performance degradation if you over discharge them. Just make sure that they are properly charged.

Which has better Cold Cranking Amps?

The Die Hard would have better CCAs, but keep in mind that the Shorai LFX36 batteries have more CCAs than the FRS/BRZ stock battery.

Which can last longer without being driven/trickle charged?

The Die Hard will last longer without being driven or charged. The Shorai is safe up to 1 week of not being driven. After that, it is recommended to put it on a tender, or to drive the car. I have found the capacity sufficient enough to let my NSX sit for over 10 days, but it also has a very low electrical draw at rest.

How long will these batteries last on the stock sound system with the engine off?

I have no data for this. Keep in mind though that the Shorai LFX36 batteries are not actually 36 amp hours, their capacity is about 15 amp hours which is also equivalent to the popular Odyssey PC680. So it is roughly 1/3 of the actual capacity of the stock battery.

Which has the longer lifespan and why?

Unfortunately the Shorai batteries are new enough that they don't have extreme long term data. I have seen people using them for 3 years with no problems. I have had mine in my car for a year now with no degradation in performance, although that should be expected. Lead acid batteries tend to last about 3-5 years.
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Old 01-18-2014, 01:24 PM   #3
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Thanks for the Reply, it really comes down to paying more money for light weight and arguably more environmentally friendly battery.
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Old 02-09-2014, 02:04 PM   #4
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Hmmmmm.......anybody notice a similarity here?
Odyssey 35-PC1400T-A AGM battery for BRZ/FRS and Sears Diehard Platinum AGM battery, Sears Item# 02851035000 | Model# 51035 ???

maybe the same thing made by Odyssey? specs and case are identical. Diehard is $84.90 cheaper and their warranty may be better since Odyssey warranty says this; (?)
A Battery can deliver only a fixed number of usable amp-hours over its lifetime and is considered to have
reached its normal end of life if the application uses up all of these amp-hours, regardless of the time the
Battery has been in service. Therefore Manufacturer reserves the right to deny a warranty claim if it
determines the Battery to be at its normal end of life, even if the claim is lodged within the applicable
warranty period.

http://www.sears.com/diehard-platinu...KIP_LEVEL#desc



http://shop.odysseybattery.com/p/35-pc1400t-a?pp=12

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