FT86 as a 2-seat sports car

[ZDan]

I've always thought the FT86 should have been a dedicated cab-rearward 2-seat sports car, or should at least have a 2-seat variant. Benefits of a 2-seater with the rear wheels closer to the driver: shorter wheelbase, lighter weight, better weight distribution (close to 50/50 vs existing car at 55/45), and lower cost. Loss of the rear seats and some space for me would be worth it.

With the new '22 I did some cut/pasting to see what it would look like. Loved it! Then I tried some of the 1st gens with good results, until I did a Lava FR-S, and that one kinda broke my heart a bit. Makes the actually-gorgeous 2+2 look like a 00s Monte Carlo! Damn... Ah, what could have been! A real modern 240Z which as far as I'm concerned nobody's come close to replicating in 50(!!!) years. Subaru and Toyota could still do this IMO. Somebody should!

[WolfpackS2k]

I'm sure it has something to do with the nature of photoshop, but the 2nd gen proportions look horrible with it shortened. Looks like a Pontiac Solstice from the side.

1st gen looks great!

Either way YES, I would want this. So bad.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

I'm sure it has something to do with the nature of photoshop,

My photo editing/manipulating skills are lacking, I was surprised at how well these came out but they're far from perfect!

but the 2nd gen proportions look horrible with it shortened. Looks like a Pontiac Solstice from the side.

I think it looks pretty good. It might be more down to how different pics (wide-angle vs. narrow, perspective, etc.) affect how easy it is for me to get reasonable-looking results. 2nd-gen proportions are the same as the 1st, it's really pretty much the same platform, so in reality the comparisons between swb 2-seater vs. 2+2 should be similar, 1st-gen vs. 2nd-gen.

1st gen looks great!

Either way YES, I would want this. So bad.

Yeah! Like I said the Lava FR-S 2-seater kills me
Pretty much would be my ideal car. Oh wellz....

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Loss of the rear seats and some space for me would be worth it.

A lot of others wouldn't have bought it if it were not a 2+2 so its always a trade-off. If I liked the Supra (which I don't) I still wouldn't buy one because it's a 2 seater.

One of the design goals of the car was to be able to carry a set of track tires and a tool box in the car. The back seats allow the space for it to meet that goal.

No chance, by the way, they were going to build a 2+2 and a 2 seater, the production size was too limited.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

A lot of others wouldn't have bought it if it were not a 2+2 so its always a trade-off. If I liked the Supra (which I don't) I still wouldn't buy one because it's a 2 seater.

Indeed, it is always a tradeoff. Not trying to argue they would have sold more cars or anything, just that it would have been my very strong preference to have a fixed-roof dedicated 2-seat sports car, and I would have bought one in 2013 rather than waiting until my S2000 was at 240k miles and needing some attention in 2017.

Speaking of the Supra... IMO they would have had a WAY cooler (to me anyway) Supra by making it the 2-seat FT86 variant, with a ~325-350ish hp N.A. Lexus V6. Oh wellz!

One of the design goals of the car was to be able to carry a set of track tires and a tool box in the car. The back seats allow the space for it to meet that goal.

As one who tracks often, that's not a requirement for me. More of a "desirement" but I'd rather have a smaller lighter-weight car with better F/R weight distribution than insist on that. But still, those goals can be met with a cab-rearward 2-seater. In fact if you eliminate the rear seats you could have that space specifically designed to fit wheels/tires while still shoving the rear wheels forward. FWIW I could carry 4 wheels/tires, toolbox, helmet, weekend bag in my 240Z with driver and passenger.

No chance, by the way, they were going to build a 2+2 and a 2 seater, the production size was too limited.

It's too bad... Still annoying that they went the BMW route for the Supra, IMO they would have saved time and money doing what I described, cab-rearward 2-seater based on FT86 with Lexus V6. Woulda been about perfect!

[beltax90]

hmmm visually i like the body the way it is.
this reminds me of that one vw which also looks weirdly proportioned and stubby to me...and i cant remember what it is.

ah, the corrado.

[The Red One]

Originally Posted by ZDan

My photo editing/manipulating skills are lacking, I was surprised at how well these came out but they're far from perfect!


Yeah! Like I said the Lava FR-S 2-seater kills me
Pretty much would be my ideal car. Oh wellz....

Pshop skills are always a can-do better proposition but The car you were trying to recreate already exists!

If you look closely at this one I think it was pretending to be a Subaru...

[Irace86.2.0]

@ZDan

You did a decent job with moving the rear forward, but you needed to treat the front too. The front fender and hood needs a little more length. The front looks stubby.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by The Red One

Pshop skills are always a can-do better proposition but The car you were trying to recreate already exists!

If you look closely at this one I think it was pretending to be a Subaru...

WTF, is that miata on stilts?! I love the Miata, but the retractable-roof RF has a few major strikes against it: 1)retractable roof adds significant weight, up high, 2)usable storage space not good relative to fixed-roof hatch, 3)+$5-6k over BRZ Limited
Also, the shape of the car looks great from some angles, but positively awkward from others. For me the FT86 is the better overall compromise.

[Dadhawk]

I thought this was the two seater model of the 86

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by ZDan

WTF, is that miata on stilts?! I love the Miata, but the retractable-roof RF has a few major strikes against it: 1)retractable roof adds significant weight, up high, 2)usable storage space not good relative to fixed-roof hatch, 3)+$5-6k over BRZ Limited
Also, the shape of the car looks great from some angles, but positively awkward from others. For me the FT86 is the better overall compromise.

I’ve thought about doing a K24 swapped Miata RF where I removed the hardtop actuators and welded up the roof. Maybe someday. I sat in the soft-top years ago and thought it was small, but more and more I feel like the 86 is too big. As small as it is, the 86 could drop some size. I need a Lotus Exige Cup 430 in my life, but I do love a front-mid rwd two door coupe, so I’m totally on board with your sentiment. The Z4 E89 was too heavy and needs a dedicated hardtop; the Miata RF needs a dedicated hardtop version. The Z proto is a little too cabin forward because of its chassis global architecture. What else is there?

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

@ZDan

You did a decent job with moving the rear forward, but you needed to treat the front too. The front fender and hood needs a little more length. The front looks stubby.

Agreed but beyond the scope of this study Also, if I'm Toyobaru and wanted to do a 2-seat version, I'd limit changes to aft end of the car. But yes, the idealized version would move the rears forward a LOT, and fronts forward a bit for further improvement in weight distribution while keeping wheelbase ~92" - 95".

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by beltax90

hmmm visually i like the body the way it is.
this reminds me of that one vw which also looks weirdly proportioned and stubby to me...and i cant remember what it is.

ah, the corrado.

Nah, more SP2

Corrado is cab-forward FF architecture, with 2+2 hatch bent roofline

[HKz]

isn't 50/50 a bit overrated? I never quite understood this as I would imagine a moving car would have more weight pushed towards the rear, yes?


2000GT still the best looking 2 seater, everything else to me looks stubby. In general, I prefer the longer 2+2 GT style.