SCCA Solo C Street Discussion

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

Why would you asume that?

because a flat move of the FRS to BS under the assumption that every FRS owner will go out of their way to purchase a TRD Spring and Swaybar kit is just wrong.


This not only punishes those that decide to do this by throwing them in a class they have no business in, but also those that didn't do this by throwing them along with them.


:/


bulletin prohibiting this weaseling is much more sensible.

[tahdizzle]

Originally Posted by renfield90

This. The problem is we have a rule saying "you can use any standard part" and a somewhat liberal definition for what a standard part is, but we don't have a rule saying explicitly "you can't change springs." If we were required to run the springs the car physically came with, this goes away.

The adage is "if it doesn't say you can, then you can't" but the definition of standard part lets you do a lot. There's good reasons for it being so open, but it might be worthwhile to explicitly pare this back.

Rules are not in question.

Classing is. You're essentially making a FR-S a release series minus the aero by changing the suspension components to that of a Release Series (which is a b street car).

B Street has the same rules as C Street, just different cars in that classification. So the question is in classing and not in ruling.

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by renfield90

Didn't realize it's rear sway bar only. No matter, should pair very nicely with my Hotchkis front bar.

What makes you think it's the RSB only? Here's the description from the letter @simpleisbest posted.

"•Kit includes:
◦20.6mm 4130 solid front sway bar
◦15.8mm 4130 solid rear sway bar
◦Polyurethane bushings, front and rear, that fit the OEM brackets**
◦Rear sub‐frame reinforcement brackets"

I've seen other descriptions and pictures that state/show that it's both bars as well. If it was just the picture in the letter that made you think that, I imagine it was simply a marketing thing to show the installed bar (easier to show a good shot of one installed than an underbody shot that shows both.

[tahdizzle]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

because a flat move of the FRS to BS under the assumption that every FRS owner will go out of their way to purchase a TRD Spring and Swaybar kit is just wrong.
I don't disagree; I like @coneracer30's idea.


This not only punishes those that decide to do this by throwing them in a class they have no business in, but also those that didn't do this by throwing them along with them.

The RS is in B Street. For better or for worse. People who decide to essentially make their car a Release Series FR-S are shooting themselves in the foot.


:/


bulletin prohibiting this weaseling is much more sensible.
Also a very good option.

[renfield90]

Originally Posted by Shark_Bait88

What makes you think it's the RSB only? Here's the description from the letter @simpleisbest posted.

"•Kit includes:
◦20.6mm 4130 solid front sway bar
◦15.8mm 4130 solid rear sway bar
◦Polyurethane bushings, front and rear, that fit the OEM brackets**
◦Rear sub‐frame reinforcement brackets"

I've seen other descriptions and pictures that state/show that it's both bars as well. If it was just the picture in the letter that made you think that, I imagine it was simply a marketing thing to show the installed bar (easier to show a good shot of one installed than an underbody shot that shows both.

The letter had a typo initially.

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by renfield90

The letter had a typo initially.

Ah ok.

I'm really curious to see how this plays out. If it looks like we can run these parts for at least a year and they seem to improve the performance, I'll likely do it. Would make the blog series I'm going to write about my season even more interesting.

Really, doing this sort of loophole modding within class is completely in the spirit of motorsports. Formula 1 is legendary for sneaky mods, engineering, and technology that very keenly exploited loopholes and vague language within the rules. Exploit it while you've got the chance, because they will find a way to calm the water. It really sucks for everyone else, but you can't really be mad at the FR-S owners who choose to install the TRD parts.

[jdrxb9]

Originally Posted by Cueman

For sale: TRD Front Sway bar. Beautifully power coated red. Brand new never installed. Great for CStreet BRZ - $150.

For sale: Custom-valved Koni SA front struts and rear shocks. Fronts brand new and never installed, rears freshly serviced/painted and with less than one week street use. Should work great with TRD SPRING PKG, P/N: PTR07-18130 for CStreet FR-S! $offers!

( not really a joke )

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by Arigh

Stock class includes contingencies for modification, and the classes are balanced on cars that are fully prepped. Without those modifications, you will not be as competitive at a national event.

This is the same idea.

except that the contingencies are for modifications done above stock trim, not modifications required to be performed just to get to stock trim.

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by Arigh

The 370Z is in BS, it includes both the base model, and the go fast model with a LSD and a power bump. You need the higher model to be competitive.

That's horrible,. I did not know this, I suppose the base 370z should have stayed in CS.

[renfield90]

Originally Posted by jdrxb9

For sale: Custom-valved Koni SA front struts and rear shocks. Fronts brand new and never installed, rears freshly serviced/painted and with less than one week street use. Should work great with TRD SPRING PKG, P/N: PTR07-18130 for CStreet FR-S! $offers!

( not really a joke )

Seriously? Let's talk.

[renfield90]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

Rules are not in question.

Classing is. You're essentially making a FR-S a release series minus the aero by changing the suspension components to that of a Release Series (which is a b street car).

B Street has the same rules as C Street, just different cars in that classification. So the question is in classing and not in ruling.

I think we're talking past each other.

Here's the thing: you can move the base model FRS up to BS but that only fixes the base model FRS. What if Mazda pulls this trick next year with the MX-5? And yes, Mazda would do this on purpose, they've done it before in the past. Toyota has accidentally done this.

If you change the rules you can prevent this from happening again. I'm thinking really big picture here: how do you prevent revelations about port-installed options from blowing up your existing classing? You do that with rules.

The RS 1.0 was classed (buried) in BS due to limited numbers, the assumption being that the base model had no legal access to the juicy suspension bits. That assumption is blown wide open now, so classing is now strictly a question of performance potential. If the performance differential to the rest of CS is there, we're off to BS next year. That doesn't fix your root cause though, which is a liberal standard parts rule. See what I'm driving at?

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by renfield90

See what I'm driving at.

... a Ford Focus RS for 2016?

[G_Ride]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

... a Ford Focus RS for 2016?

That's what I've been thinking about for a little while now

[SeanRTR]

double post