follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Speed By Design
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum - FT86CLUB > Off-Topic Discussions > Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions

Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions Discuss all other cars and automotive news here.


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-06-2021, 09:28 AM   #393
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 15,843
Thanks: 30,075
Thanked 18,029 Times in 8,500 Posts
Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehorsw View Post
Guys, banning ICE vehicles does not mean going to BEV. Hybrids are not considered ICE.
They are also not considered zero emissions. The ban isn't on ICE, it's for sale of any non-zero emissions car.
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
Irace86.2.0 (01-06-2021)
Old 01-06-2021, 02:18 PM   #394
Stonehorsw
Member
 
Stonehorsw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Drives: 18 BRZ
Location: Michigan
Posts: 94
Thanks: 177
Thanked 54 Times in 40 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadhawk View Post
They are also not considered zero emissions. The ban isn't on ICE, it's for sale of any non-zero emissions car.
For California? Or the others?
Stonehorsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2021, 02:35 PM   #395
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 15,843
Thanks: 30,075
Thanked 18,029 Times in 8,500 Posts
Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehorsw View Post
For California? Or the others?
The ban in the original post was a reference to California. No other state, to my knowledge, has that executive order in place by 2035. Several have an order in place to reach that by 2050.

Technically speaking, a hydrogen powered fuel cell car is not zero emissions, it emits water. I don't think that's a real concern though.

__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
Irace86.2.0 (01-06-2021), Stonehorsw (01-06-2021)
Old 01-06-2021, 02:38 PM   #396
AnalogMan
Senior Member
 
AnalogMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Drives: 2019 BRZ Limited 6 speed Red
Location: New England
Posts: 375
Thanks: 565
Thanked 749 Times in 256 Posts
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadhawk View Post
No other state, to my knowledge, has that executive order in place by 2035. Several have an order in place to reach that by 2050.
@Rampage posted last week that Massachusetts also will be banning the sale of gasoline powered cars by 2035, mirroring California's mandate -

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/m...-powered-cars/
AnalogMan is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to AnalogMan For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (01-06-2021), Irace86.2.0 (01-06-2021), soundman98 (01-06-2021)
Old 01-07-2021, 04:09 AM   #397
Tomm
Identifying as a Member
 
Tomm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Drives: 2013 FRS
Location: HF, WV
Posts: 208
Thanks: 105
Thanked 154 Times in 93 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
I foresee some constitutional challenges with these regulations but time will tell.
__________________
APEXi - ARP - Buddy Club - Carbing - Cusco - DBA - Diode Dynamics - Exedy - GReddy - HKS - IRP - Mishimoto - Motiv - Nameless - Nitto - Open Flash - Project Kics - SEIBON - South Bend Clutch - SPC - SuperTek - Tanabe - TK Style - VERUS - VOLK - Whiteline
Tomm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2021, 07:11 AM   #398
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 15,843
Thanks: 30,075
Thanked 18,029 Times in 8,500 Posts
Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomm View Post
I foresee some constitutional challenges with these regulations but time will tell.
Not sure I follow, the automobile industry is heavily regulated, this really isn't any different.
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
Irace86.2.0 (01-07-2021)
Old 01-07-2021, 08:00 AM   #399
Tomm
Identifying as a Member
 
Tomm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Drives: 2013 FRS
Location: HF, WV
Posts: 208
Thanks: 105
Thanked 154 Times in 93 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadhawk View Post
Not sure I follow, the automobile industry is heavily regulated, this really isn't any different.
I'm speaking on the power of government, specifically the federal side. Is it actually within the power of the federal (not state) government to regulate commerce to this extent? Its a mostly subjective question which is why I say, time will tell but I believe the issues would arise with the commerce clause and police powers if it were to be rolled out on the federal level.
__________________
APEXi - ARP - Buddy Club - Carbing - Cusco - DBA - Diode Dynamics - Exedy - GReddy - HKS - IRP - Mishimoto - Motiv - Nameless - Nitto - Open Flash - Project Kics - SEIBON - South Bend Clutch - SPC - SuperTek - Tanabe - TK Style - VERUS - VOLK - Whiteline
Tomm is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tomm For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (01-07-2021), Wally86 (01-07-2021)
Old 01-07-2021, 09:00 AM   #400
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 15,843
Thanks: 30,075
Thanked 18,029 Times in 8,500 Posts
Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomm View Post
I'm speaking on the power of government, specifically the federal side. Is it actually within the power of the federal (not state) government to regulate commerce to this extent?
I think it will boil down to whether or not the manufacturers want to fight it. They are pretty much throwing in the towel already because of what they'll need to do to meet global mandates.

All the current mandates are at the state level so until the Feds step in, I guess we won't know
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".

Last edited by Dadhawk; 01-07-2021 at 11:33 AM.
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
Irace86.2.0 (01-07-2021), Tomm (01-07-2021), Wally86 (01-07-2021)
Old 01-07-2021, 09:11 AM   #401
Tomm
Identifying as a Member
 
Tomm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Drives: 2013 FRS
Location: HF, WV
Posts: 208
Thanks: 105
Thanked 154 Times in 93 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadhawk View Post
I think it will boil down to whether or not the manufacturers want to fight it. They are already pretty much throwing in the towel already because of what they'll need to do to meet global mandates.

All the current mandates are at the state level so until the Feds step in, I guess we won't know
Agreed.
__________________
APEXi - ARP - Buddy Club - Carbing - Cusco - DBA - Diode Dynamics - Exedy - GReddy - HKS - IRP - Mishimoto - Motiv - Nameless - Nitto - Open Flash - Project Kics - SEIBON - South Bend Clutch - SPC - SuperTek - Tanabe - TK Style - VERUS - VOLK - Whiteline
Tomm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2021, 05:19 PM   #402
Irace86.2.0
Non Sequitur
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 4,765
Thanks: 3,615
Thanked 3,608 Times in 2,055 Posts
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomm View Post
I'm speaking on the power of government, specifically the federal side. Is it actually within the power of the federal (not state) government to regulate commerce to this extent? Its a mostly subjective question which is why I say, time will tell but I believe the issues would arise with the commerce clause and police powers if it were to be rolled out on the federal level.
I'll agree with Dadhawk's statements and add a few things. Tax laws and product regulations are not my forte, but it seems like states have imposed their own taxes and bans of chemicals, products, etc for a long time. Obviously Trump revoked California's waiver to set its own emission standards, and that issue is being challenged in court, but California could probably resort to other methods to get rid of ICEs. One method could be taxing them so high that no one would buy them. That strategy worked with cigarettes (and California isn't even the worse state for tobacco taxes), and it could work with ICEs, as an extension of the Federal Gas-Guzzler tax. Automakers seem to be interested in moving forward.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/17/c...pollution.html

Defying Trump, 5 Automakers Lock In a Deal on Greenhouse Gas Pollution

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/28/us-c...e-causes-.html

California taxes proving hazardous to cigarette sales
__________________
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (01-07-2021)
Old 01-08-2021, 08:37 AM   #403
Stonehorsw
Member
 
Stonehorsw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Drives: 18 BRZ
Location: Michigan
Posts: 94
Thanks: 177
Thanked 54 Times in 40 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadhawk View Post
I think it will boil down to whether or not the manufacturers want to fight it. They are pretty much throwing in the towel already because of what they'll need to do to meet global mandates.

All the current mandates are at the state level so until the Feds step in, I guess we won't know
1. Thanks for bringing the table and correcting my info.
2. Going electric is good for the business. It creates a differentiation when comparing to current vehicles and also brings newcomers from the big cities which were dropping vehicle ownership.
3. If the petrochemical companies are smart, they can relocate their products and still be profitable (if not more profitable). This will be a huge challenge for them.
Stonehorsw is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Stonehorsw For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (01-08-2021), Wally86 (01-08-2021)
Old 01-08-2021, 09:15 AM   #404
WolfpackS2k
Senior Member
 
WolfpackS2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Drives: '06 Cayman S, '17 GTI Sport
Location: NC
Posts: 2,470
Thanks: 2,317
Thanked 1,389 Times in 793 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Some of the regulations brought down in this country by the EPA has been operating outside of the bounds of the constitution for decades. I'm not saying the effects have been for better or worse, I'm just stating the reality. Unelected bureaucrats aren't supposed to be able to wield such power.
__________________
Current: '12 C63 AMG P31 & '17 VW GTI Sport
'06 Porsche Cayman S - sold and missed

'13 SWP BRZ-L - Innovate Supercharged - RIP, claimed by VIR T10

'07 S2000 - DD & track rat - sold
'92 GS-R - 300k club member - sold
WolfpackS2k is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to WolfpackS2k For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (01-08-2021)
Old 01-08-2021, 11:49 PM   #405
Irace86.2.0
Non Sequitur
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 4,765
Thanks: 3,615
Thanked 3,608 Times in 2,055 Posts
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k View Post
Some of the regulations brought down in this country by the EPA has been operating outside of the bounds of the constitution for decades. I'm not saying the effects have been for better or worse, I'm just stating the reality. Unelected bureaucrats aren't supposed to be able to wield such power.
Which part of the constitution?
__________________
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post:
Capt Spaulding (01-10-2021)
Old 01-09-2021, 11:54 AM   #406
soundman98
threadwrecker
 
soundman98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Drives: '14 brz limited
Location: chicago-ish
Posts: 6,109
Thanks: 17,228
Thanked 6,893 Times in 3,536 Posts
Mentioned: 55 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
this is ironic.
https://jalopnik.com/theres-a-caveat...les-1845938567

yes, it's less recurring damage to the environment, but it's still damaging the environment.
__________________
my '14 brz limited "the return to normal" (or is it?)
led mods-10%(planning/designing/sitting on hands)audio mods-99%(done is never done)

hidplanet build log
soundman98 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to soundman98 For This Useful Post:
Irace86.2.0 (01-10-2021), Spuds (01-10-2021)
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tcoat banned? Hotrodheart Off-Topic Lounge [WARNING: NO POLITICS] 95 07-06-2019 01:46 AM
Does anyone know why pansontw got banned? Soloside Off-Topic Lounge [WARNING: NO POLITICS] 17 10-26-2018 04:20 AM
Got banned from gf's complex jdmblood Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions 11 07-12-2015 12:46 PM
Why have so many users been banned? xuimod Site Announcements / Questions / Issues 9 03-08-2015 02:23 PM
Banned Toyota GT 86 Advert Banned Nevermore Photos, Videos, Wallpapers, Gallery Forum 9 11-16-2012 07:27 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.