Video: Toyota GR86 SPIED for the First Time!

[gymratter]

Originally Posted by N1rve

They get a free pass because they are already perfect. Don't fix what's not broken.

same can be said about the 86. most people think its a good looking car. the main complaint is the power, or lack of. :p

[vh_supra26]

Originally Posted by gymratter

but everything else seems to be correct.

The taillights do appear to be a little off as well. While I do agree the renders and spy shots are similar overall, we shouldn't treat the renders as the end all. I do think they are a good to decent preview of what's to come and they were the closest out of everyone, but as shown here and on the Zupra small details were off here and there. Again, I think everyone should just wait for better pics before getting all worked up over nothing. Very funny how everyone is getting at each other's throats over a hand full of blurry screen shots.

[vh_supra26]

Originally Posted by vh_supra26

I wouldn't be surprised if he followed the car and got some better shots and is currently shopping around to see which media outlet will offer him the most.

It looks like Kystify sold C&D a larger version of what he captured.

[unhappymeal]

Wow, I missed the sheer craziness of this board. For those expecting a radically different, car, you're going to be disappointed. There are essentially four options in front of Toyota-Subaru alliance for building the next 86:

1. Modify the BMW CLAR architecture like they did for the Supra. This is highly unlikely as you'd end up with a car the size of the 2-series and the price would have to go way up.

2. Modify the TNGA-N or TNGA-L architecture to make a BRZ. This is also highly unlikely. There are two vehicles on the TNGA-N platform: the JP market Crown and Mirai. The Lexus GS was scheduled to go on the TNGA-N platform and was cancelled. The IS was also scheduled for a clean sheet design on TNGA-N, but it's getting an update on its existing platform and the next generation is rumoured to be a platform share with Mazda. That leaves TNGA-L, which is only used for the LC and LS. They will not make a BRZ on that because a) too heavy b) too expensive and c) would take capacity from Tahara or Miyata, which are at 90%+ capacity. To give you an idea, here is what is currently built at those two plants: Lexus LS, GS, IS, GX, RC, ES, RX and NX. There is no chance Toyota is taking any capacity from those plants to make a BRZ with its tiny profit margins.

3. Clean sheet design. Never going to happen. Toyota didn't even bother to do this for the Supra. It's way too expensive and would require building a new plant or re-purposing a line at another plant. Good luck with that.

4. Modify the existing 86 chassis. This is the only solution that makes sense. The existing 86 is a modified Impreza and is built at Gunma on the Crosstrek line. Subaru doesn't like it, but it's the least costly option for the Alliance.

As for a turbo engine, I won't say never, but that is incredibly unlikely. It is in neither party's interest to have a BRZ with a factory turbo. For Subaru, it means cannibalizing sales from the WRX/WRX STi, which are more profitable. For Toyota, it means having something that could cannibalize sales from the Supra 2.0 T, which is also sells at far higher transaction prices.

The next gen car will likely be a refined version of the existing 86, much like the 9th gen Civic Si was a refinement of the 8th gen. It'll likely have more displacement to generate more torque and be a better daily. They'll probably also change the gearing a bit so that there's a sane ratio in 6th. It will likely have Subaru's latest infotainment and safety feature suite plus a bit more sound deadening. There'll likely be some tweaks to the chassis, but the overall formula will probably be quite close to the existing 86. It will also likely get a slight increase in the wheelbase to match the Impreza and to improve highway speed stability.

[mazeroni]

Oh, let's not forget:

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by HKz

who cares if it is refresh/next gen/same old shit, I think we should all be happy Toyota is cool with giving the 86 almost completely new sheet metal and doing something significant instead of letting the twins die or fade away into obscurity..especially coming out of covid I think it is pretty miraculous when folks were already clamoring on about the twins disappearing forever..

Seen them on the lots yet?

Here is the true next gen

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by unhappymeal

Wow, I missed the sheer craziness of this board. For those expecting a radically different, car, you're going to be disappointed. There are essentially four options in front of Toyota-Subaru alliance for building the next 86:

1. Modify the BMW CLAR architecture like they did for the Supra. This is highly unlikely as you'd end up with a car the size of the 2-series and the price would have to go way up.

2. Modify the TNGA-N or TNGA-L architecture to make a BRZ. This is also highly unlikely. There are two vehicles on the TNGA-N platform: the JP market Crown and Mirai. The Lexus GS was scheduled to go on the TNGA-N platform and was cancelled. The IS was also scheduled for a clean sheet design on TNGA-N, but it's getting an update on its existing platform and the next generation is rumoured to be a platform share with Mazda. That leaves TNGA-L, which is only used for the LC and LS. They will not make a BRZ on that because a) too heavy b) too expensive and c) would take capacity from Tahara or Miyata, which are at 90%+ capacity. To give you an idea, here is what is currently built at those two plants: Lexus LS, GS, IS, GX, RC, ES, RX and NX. There is no chance Toyota is taking any capacity from those plants to make a BRZ with its tiny profit margins.

3. Clean sheet design. Never going to happen. Toyota didn't even bother to do this for the Supra. It's way too expensive and would require building a new plant or re-purposing a line at another plant. Good luck with that.

4. Modify the existing 86 chassis. This is the only solution that makes sense. The existing 86 is a modified Impreza and is built at Gunma on the Crosstrek line. Subaru doesn't like it, but it's the least costly option for the Alliance.

As for a turbo engine, I won't say never, but that is incredibly unlikely. It is in neither party's interest to have a BRZ with a factory turbo. For Subaru, it means cannibalizing sales from the WRX/WRX STi, which are more profitable. For Toyota, it means having something that could cannibalize sales from the Supra 2.0 T, which is also sells at far higher transaction prices.

The next gen car will likely be a refined version of the existing 86, much like the 9th gen Civic Si was a refinement of the 8th gen. It'll likely have more displacement to generate more torque and be a better daily. They'll probably also change the gearing a bit so that there's a sane ratio in 6th. It will likely have Subaru's latest infotainment and safety feature suite plus a bit more sound deadening. There'll likely be some tweaks to the chassis, but the overall formula will probably be quite close to the existing 86. It will also likely get a slight increase in the wheelbase to match the Impreza and to improve highway speed stability.

The 86 is not built on a "modified" Impreza platform. It is a dedicated platform based on the architecture of the Impreza. These are two totally different things.

The current Impreza is built on exactly the same platform as the rest of the Subaru line up (or will be shortly). They will not increase the 86 wheelbase just because they did the Impreza.

Yep turbo has always been very clearly ruled out.

The 86 is a niche car with a very narrow target market. If they want to sell to the current owners they need to give them something far better than the current. If they want to open up the market they have to make it radically different than what we have simce most of the world doesn't even know it exists. If the rumours are even remotely true (they are still just rumours no matter how much some believe everything the internet tells them) then this "next gen" does neither of these things so who are they exactly targeting?

My opinion is that this "next gen" is simply a lazy and cheap appeasement version to say they did SOMETHING for the fanbois. The real next gen will come out for the 2025 zero emissions goals and will not appeal to anybody here.

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by mazeroni

Oh, let's not forget:

all ferraries look the same to me. bland, red, pointy.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by soundman98

all ferraries look the same to me. bland, red, pointy.

Those are clearly very different shapes and only share headlights.

[soundman98]

there's a new 86?

[vh_supra26]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

My opinion is that this "next gen" is simply a lazy and cheap appeasement version to say they did SOMETHING for the fanbois. The real next gen will come out for the 2025 zero emissions goals and will not appeal to anybody here.

Did you expect anything less from Toyota? Refuse to make a turbo 86 which people have been crying about since day one, but makes an overpriced 4 banger auto only Zupra that no one ask for.

[Phantobe]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

BLAH BLAH BLAH

The 86 is a niche car with a very narrow target market. If they want to sell to the current owners they need to give them MOAAAAAAR POWERRRR. If they want to open up the market they have to make it radically different than what we have simce most of the world doesn't even know it exists. If the rumours are even remotely true (they are still just rumours no matter how much some believe everything the internet tells them) then this "next gen" does neither of these things so who are they exactly targeting?

My opinion is that this "next gen" is simply a lazy and cheap appeasement version to say they did SOMETHING for the fanbois. The real next gen will come out for the 2025 zero emissions goals and will not appeal to anybody here.

Fixed it.

In all seriousness, I agree.

[vh_supra26]

Another youtuber (garbage).. but watching it he has some comparison where the current car also has that slight weld sharp a-pillar. I guess its just the angle. Makes me rethink if the camo car actually has different a-pillars. We need better pics!

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by vh_supra26

Did you expect anything less from Toyota? Refuse to make a turbo 86 which people have been crying about since day one, but makes an overpriced 4 banger auto only Zupra that no one ask for.

that was never, ever the point of the car.. turbo ain't happening.