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GR86 General Topics (2nd Gen 2022+ Toyota 86) General topics for the GR86 second-gen 86


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Old 11-09-2021, 07:27 PM   #57
Ernest72
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Originally Posted by AJBRZ View Post
I was driving an automatic FR-S years ago, around the first time they came out, and I always wondered what it would be like to have a manual. So around last year, I bought a manual BRZ and had it for a few months, but have since sold it, since I actually wasnt driving as much as I thought I would be. The BRZ was my first manual car and I love the change in driving focus it gave me. But living in NYC, with all the lights, stop signs, and traffic, it got to be more of a chore to drive the BRZ. So now here I am contemplating, picking up the new 86, but in automatic. Overall I dont really mind not having a clutch, less work when I just want to get to my destination and when I want to really have a spirited drive I think having paddles to keep me in the right gear will suffice. Hopefully I don't regret that mindset lol. But I guess Im the type of car enthusiast that isnt die-hard, but more so just loves to drive, and appreciates a car that loves to be driven. Rant over lol
This pretty much explains why there are less manuals for DD. Traffic, lights and commuting suck and the auto helps a little. Exactly why I got the auto.
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Old 11-09-2021, 07:50 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by Blighty View Post
The comparison data of the 86 and BRZ sales indicate that the 86 are older buyers and are more automatics, and the BRZ sales are younger buyer's and more manuals.
Still waiting on somebody to put this oft referenced "data" in front of me.
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Old 11-09-2021, 08:39 PM   #59
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Still waiting on somebody to put this oft referenced "data" in front of me.
If Subaru as a source isn't satisfactory, then what's the point of asking for the data? Will you just move the goalpost back and ask for something else?

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Well, here is where I think some of the misunderstandings occur.
The misunderstanding seems to be that people read what I wrote as "old people can't be an enthusiast or drive manuals."

I didn't make that claim.

I was responding to the suggestion that if the majority of GR86 models being produced currently are manuals, then this could indicate a shift in buying trends. for the car.

It likely does not.

The more logical answer would be that they are making more manuals to satisfy the expected early demand of shoppers who fall into the category of diehard enthusiast - a person who puts a deposits down on a car that isn't out yet.

We also can see from the official Subaru information that the age of BRZ buyers are younger and skew manual, verses the 86 which skews older and automatic.

Older people can be putting down deposits for manual GR86s too. But it is a safe inference that if 30% of cars being built currently at automatic, the early adopters who are older are likely buying them.

Once early demand is met, based on trends from GEN I, we should expect 30% of GR86s to be manual and 70% to be automatic.

I would take it further still by saying as both BRZ and 86 buyers continue to age up, we will see a further drop in manual sales. But we'll see where we land in 5-10 years.

Last edited by mazeroni; 11-09-2021 at 09:00 PM.
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Old 11-10-2021, 07:14 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by Tcoat View Post
Still waiting on somebody to put this oft referenced "data" in front of me.
The recent information and drive days had presentations by GR and Subaru.

Toyota claimed that 30 manual 70 auto.
Subaru claimed the opposite split for them.

Subaru showed a graph of average age for buyers which included the BRZ and 86 separately. The BRZ was just under 40, the 86 was just over 50.

I assume you haven't been following the launch...
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Old 11-10-2021, 07:20 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Blighty View Post
The recent information and drive days had presentations by GR and Subaru.

Toyota claimed that 30 manual 70 auto.
Subaru claimed the opposite split for them.

Subaru showed a graph of average age for buyers which included the BRZ and 86 separately. The BRZ was just under 40, the 86 was just over 50.

I assume you haven't been following the launch...

This roughly matches the data jalopnik and autoblog quoted a few years ago too.

https://jalopnik.com/u-s-buyers-stil...-th-1834945061

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/05/21/...smission-take/
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Old 11-10-2021, 07:33 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by 86-75309 View Post
All I know is I've been buying cars for over 40 years and that adds up to 19 different cars, all with manual transmissions. I've also owned 7 motorcycles (manual transmissions) and 3 battery electric vehicles (no transmissions).
That's a lot of cars!

I've driven a few, but ownership wise I've only had 4! All manuals as well. Oldest was a 1988 Ford XF ute, the last one was the 2012 86 GTS.

I have bought the missus 3 cars though, but the last two have been auto (2018 Honda HRV and a 2015 Ford ranger diesel - she's a tradie).

I'm interested to know if you have a collections or if you replace them?
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Old 11-10-2021, 07:34 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by Blighty View Post
The recent information and drive days had presentations by GR and Subaru.

Toyota claimed that 30 manual 70 auto.
Subaru claimed the opposite split for them.

Subaru showed a graph of average age for buyers which included the BRZ and 86 separately. The BRZ was just under 40, the 86 was just over 50.

I assume you haven't been following the launch...
That in no way says that the AT are selling to the over 50 and the MTs to the under. It could be the total opposite.
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Old 11-10-2021, 07:36 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by Tcoat View Post
That in no way says that the AT are selling to the over 50 and the MTs to the under. It could be the total opposite.
Its just an indication. Statistically its more likely the case.

That's just math bro.
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Old 11-10-2021, 07:42 AM   #65
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Its just an indication. Statistically its more likely the case.

That's just math bro.
It isn't math at all. It is making unsupported assumptions.

All my friends over 50 drive pickup trucks so therefore nobody over 50 drives sportscars at all.
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Old 11-10-2021, 08:04 AM   #66
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It isn't math at all. It is making unsupported assumptions.

All my friends over 50 drive pickup trucks so therefore nobody over 50 drives sportscars at all.
If Corvette didnt exist, this would be a fair assumption
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Old 11-10-2021, 08:11 AM   #67
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If Corvette didnt exist, this would be a fair assumption
Ahhh but they actually drive the trucks. Not sure how many Corvettes actually see the road more than once or twice a year.
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Old 11-10-2021, 08:14 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by Tcoat View Post
It isn't math at all. It is making unsupported assumptions.

All my friends over 50 drive pickup trucks so therefore nobody over 50 drives sportscars at all.
Dude... That's essentially a mathematical strawman.

Don't lose the plot here. I'm neither using such flip logic, nor telling you anything is absolute.

Your picking the wrong argument to have with me.
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Old 11-10-2021, 08:19 AM   #69
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Dude... That's essentially a mathematical strawman.

Don't lose the plot here. I'm neither using such flip logic, nor telling you anything is absolute.

Your picking the wrong argument to have with me.
You are taking two totally different data points and mashing them together to make a new one that simply is not supported.
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Old 11-10-2021, 08:26 AM   #70
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That's a lot of cars!

I've driven a few, but ownership wise I've only had 4! All manuals as well. Oldest was a 1988 Ford XF ute, the last one was the 2012 86 GTS.

I have bought the missus 3 cars though, but the last two have been auto (2018 Honda HRV and a 2015 Ford ranger diesel - she's a tradie).

I'm interested to know if you have a collections or if you replace them?
I've never owned more than two vehicles at a time. A few I've kept for over 8 years, a couple I've traded in after only a year or two due to lifestyle changes (residence, commute, employment, marital status).
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