Frs vs s2000

[Zaggeron]

Originally Posted by RedRocket

Think about this...
Take the S2000's 37,000 USD price tag and spend that on an FRS.

Supercharger, Exhaust, Tune, Tires, and tons of extra's and suddenly you have a car with almost the same HP as the Mustang at 50% of the weight.

You understand they are no longer making the S2k and hence there are none with a 37K price tag ... So, you can't take the money you didn't save and spend it on the FRS instead ...

[Turbowned]

Yeah, it's the exact opposite. If you take the $5k+ you save buying a used S2000 you can spend that money on a supercharger kit or whatever else you like. Trust me, I find it tempting!

[rice_classic]

I want to race a supercharged S2000. If anyone can find me a good condition "salvage title" Supercharged S2000 for sale for $10k or less please let me know.

I understand the S2000/FRS comparo due to layout, weight, etc but really... apples and oranges. One is a coupe with a roof and the other is roadster. Comparison on performance basis, track days, racing... Ok, I get it but as an everyday car it isn't logical, they're too different.

As for the mileage. I managed a region that was half the state of WA for 2 years while owning an AP1 s2k. Even when I hypermiled, all freeway, never touching VTEC the best I got was 30.2MPG (80/20 hwy/city). The car is horrifically geared for touring/daily driving. It seemed like I was on the only owner that wanted a "freeway-6th-gear". The fact that the best MPG I could get all freeway (road trip) was 31.1mpg was pitiful for a 2L, 2700lb car. My typical mileage, and I'm no lead foot, was 26-28mpg avg. Most others saw less than that were amazed I could even see 28.

I will echo the comment about the S2k being a "tiring" everyday car. The gearing sucks for it, the complete and utter lack of power below 5k sucks and lack of room and high road noise just drains. I made custom ear plugs for long trips so I didn't show up at my destination drained and irritated, which worked great when the top was down!

Also, considering 80% of track clubs won't let you take your S2k on track without a roll bar there's also that to consider.

As an overall car, I enjoy my FRS way more.

If I had to choose between the two has a dedicated track-only use car.. then probably the S2k with a rollbar.

[CSG Mike]

Re: MPG.

Remember, the FRS/BRZ comes with Prius (albeit optional summer) tires from the factory. We switched ours out after the break-in and two laps at the track, and immediately noticed a 40% drop in MPG. During break-in, we were averaging 33MPG according to the in-car computer. Once the Star Specs went on, the car dropped to just 24.

On the flip side, the S2k is affected the same. Because it's most people's weekend/summer car, S2ks tend to have stickier tires on them. If you throw on low rolling resistance tires, the MPG will jump up. I typically see 22-23 MPG with RS3 on, but have seen 35+ with a tp, tune, and V12 evos.

Tires matter a LOT when MPG is involved.


As for performance, out of the box, the S2000 is faster, period. At the bolt-on level, I suspect a FRS/BRZ will be slightly faster (breather mods, tune, wing, splitter, coilovers). Once FI is involved, I suspect the BRZ will be faster on track, but at the cost of reliability. Just some speculation on my part.

Remember, the s2k's reliability is steller (part of why the resale is so high on them), while the FRS/BRZ is still unproven. There are no major failures you have to watch out for on a s2k, other than a ripped top, as long as all the maintenance has been done diligently. My S2k currently has 110k miles on it, and a good 1/4 of that has been at over 6000 RPM.


That being said, Scions and Subarus in general also tend to hold value well, and the FRS/BRZ is a far more comfortable daily, but it's hardly quiet. The NVH is disturbingly high for a modern car, but I suppose that comes with the territory... and it's still less than that of a S2k.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

I want to race a supercharged S2000.

If you come down to SoCal, I can arrange for that

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by RedRocket

I just don't think its a deal. 40 more HP, but the car is 100lbs heavier. Out of warantee. Unless your finding one with under 30k miles for 18k miles. The FR-S proforms better on AutoX. S2000 are notoriously uncomfortable, and most people don't keep them for every day drivers. Oh and 10+mpg LESS then an FR-S/BRS.

This is from Motortrend

""It only has 200 horsepower!" you may be screaming. Yes, but it uses that power respectably, reaching 60 mph in 6.4 seconds. "That's slower than the FR-S!" Yes, but this might've been due to the low number on the odometer. "The Mustang's a second faster to the quarter mile! USA!" Yes, but that gap falls to 0.4 second on the figure eight. The secret? The Mustang spends more time in transitions, giving the BRZ precious catch-up time."

I think that shows HP isn't EVERYTHING. Mustang has 50% more HP, but what good did it do?

Think about this...
Take the S2000's 37,000 USD price tag and spend that on an FRS.

Supercharger, Exhaust, Tune, Tires, and tons of extra's and suddenly you have a car with almost the same HP as the Mustang at 50% of the weight.

I'm not saying you need to do that.. the car is WIN out of the box.

But Slap on a Tune, Exhaust, Pulley, Tires, and you've beat the Mustang in a road coarse, and the S2000, and almost anything else out there.

Last I checked, the S2k dominates in BS and STR. I could be wrong; I don't AutoX myself.

I don't deny that the BRZ might be faster at a road course... in fact, I'd love to see it do well, considering we're developing our car for time attack

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaArJZOMCpI"]BRZ vs S2000 - YouTube[/ame]

[veuxx]

I don't get why people are saying 37k. I can get an s2000 for cheaper than a BRZ right now and throw the $4000 towards FI. Can anyone talk me out of that? I really do like the BRZ FRS but it just seems silly. The rev drop is really what scares me.

[veuxx]

Originally Posted by Turbowned

Yeah, it's the exact opposite. If you take the $5k+ you save buying a used S2000 you can spend that money on a supercharger kit or whatever else you like. Trust me, I find it tempting!

This exactly!

[86'd]

S2000 was my dream car. I owned one, and it was awesome.

I wanted a coupe, but the convertible grew on me and I ended up loving that.

Add to the fact that it was a more expensive car (at one time); they are appreciating in some areas; it's an icon; it's very fun with the top down; they're very, very reliable; VTEC!!!; and they are cheaper than the FR-S.

If you're young, to me it's a no brainer.

But if you care about turning heads, getting substantially better gas mileage, and having a bit more practicality, then it's the FR-S.

[raz0rbladez909]

I think the best solution is to have an S2000 and an FRS in your garage

[ERZperformance]

Well... in order for you be get a S2000 at or close to the price of a brand new FR-S, you'll be looking at something like 2005 with 50,000 miles on it. S2000 is a fun car so their resales value is pretty high, too high to my opinion. Don't get me wrong! I love the S2000 as much as the next person but that car is too expensive even for a use one. You much rather trying to consider a 350z or a FR-S. But at the end of the day, you are go with the FR-S, that's a brand new car with warranty VS a use car.

[ERZperformance]

Originally Posted by raz0rbladez909

I think the best solution is to have an S2000 and an FRS in your garage

I think he should get a GTR!

[TouchMyHonda]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

I want to race a supercharged S2000. If anyone can find me a good condition "salvage title" Supercharged S2000 for sale for $10k or less please let me know.

a rich friend of mine has a supercharged, tein RA, cusco caged, volk RG's, fully modded out sick s2k for like 11k right now.

CLEAN AS IT GETS.

[fl_speed001]

I have had an S2000 for the past 3.5 years. Amazing car, but like most have said not one that is really suited to being a daily driver. The BRZ/FRS is definitely more comfortable and practical in that regard.

Not sure where you guys are pricing your S2Ks either...decent mileage AP2s (~50k) can be had for 15-19 all day long, as long as you aren't looking for Grand Prix white or CR versions.

I am selling my S2K solely because I have had a job change and need a daily driver and the S doesn't fit that role for me. Both cars are fantastic to drive and great around a track, and either can be made much faster as the mods add up. Stock for stock, I don't think the BRZ/FRS would be any faster around a typical track than an S2K, but most people won't keep,either car stock anyway so that is kinda moot.

In the end I think it comes down to what you want out of the car, a daily driven sports car that can hit the track on the weekend and commute M-F, or a top down cruiser that lives in the garage and can tear up the track on the weekend too!

Best bet is to buy both and love choosing between them!